The Unholy Trinity

[missmuffet]

47 minutes ago, Omegaman 3.0 said:

Hopefully, for your sake (I guess) you are right missmuffet, but I suppose you might want to be concerned, because it will affect many, some of them Christians without even the slightest of doubts, but mostly, just because God put in in the book for you to read about!

I am very concerned Omega. But I can not change the heart only God can. But many of those people who enter the 7 year trib will realize that they made a horrible mistake. They will come to Christ and become the Tribulation Saints. 

[Omegaman 3.0]

Fair enough miss, I understand your position, but tribulation saints is not a term or idea expessed in the Bible, it looks to be a concept, made up to explain why there are followers of Jesus, who even die in the tribulation as a way to explain their presence when the church was supposed to have been raptured, event though the Bible never speaks of any catching up (rapture) before the tribulation, but does describe it after that time, just sayin'!

[Omegaman 3.0]

sorry miss, my posts are off topic!

[missmuffet]

5 minutes ago, Omegaman 3.0 said:

Fair enough miss, I understand your position, but tribulation saints is not a term or idea expessed in the Bible, it looks to be a concept, made up to explain why there are followers of Jesus, who even die in the tribulation as a way to explain the their presence when the church was suppossted to have been rapture, event though the Bible never speaks of any catching up (rapture) before the tribulation, but does describe it after that time, just sayin'!

The Tribulation Saints:

Revelation 7:9

After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands,

Revelation 12:11

And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, and they did not love their lives to the death.

 

 

[Omegaman 3.0]

Right, I admit, that there are saint during the tribulation, I am just saying, that th bible does not say they were unbelievers who converted during the time of tribulation. They could just as likely be saints who were already Christians, when those events began! Nothing in the scripture, speaks of a catching up of believers to be with the Lord, before that all starts, is just is not there. It is only inferred by some, who claim to take th Bible literally, when it is convenient for them to do so.

[childoftheking]

Revelation 12:11 is an AWESOME VERSE!!

 

The moment we see the antichrist, we will not hesitate to go to war with him even knowing we will be killed in battle!!   Of course, not every Saint will be at the location when the antichrist comes onto the scene.  It will be the duty of those alive and remaining to warn people about the coming "Mark."   Even a simple warning could lead to them choosing to be beheaded rather than to take the Mark.   So many responsibilities for the Saints during the Tribulation, you just never know which one will fall upon you until that moment arrives.

Edited May 20, 2019 by childoftheking

[Michael37]

49 minutes ago, childoftheking said:

Revelation 12:11 is an AWESOME VERSE!!

 

The moment we see the antichrist, we will not hesitate to go to war with him even knowing we will be killed in battle!!   Of course, not every Saint will be at the location when the antichrist comes onto the scene.  It will be the duty of those alive and remaining to warn people about the coming "Mark."   Even a simple warning could lead to them choosing to be beheaded rather than to take the Mark.   So many responsibilities for the Saints during the Tribulation, you just never know which one will fall upon you until that moment arrives.

The preaching from pulpits during events like the French Revolution, WWI, & WWII would often include speculation and claims that prophecies in the Book of Revelation were being fulfilled, and the Lord was about to return any day, with Armaggedon a dead cert any time soon.

 Rev 16:16
(16)  And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.

Rev 19:19
(19)  And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.

[Omegaman 3.0]

1 hour ago, childoftheking said:

The moment we see the antichrist, we will not hesitate to go to war with him even knowing we will be killed in battle!!   Of course, not every Saint will be at the location when the antichrist comes onto the scene.  It will be the duty of those alive and remaining to warn people about the coming "Mark."   Even a simple warning could lead to them choosing to be beheaded rather than to take the Mark.   So many responsibilities for the Saints during the Tribulation, you just never know which one will fall upon you until that moment arrives.

I happen to believe, that Christian1s are not appointed unto wrath.

What then? But to obtain salvation

The verse that states this is 1 Thess 5:9

This fits in well, with verses that say true Christians, those who are the elect (chosen of God) will be preserved and not lost, no one can take us out of the Father's hand etc.

Now, those who take the mark, ARE appointed unto wrath, they will not see salvation. Therefore, they are not real Christians, they will not be fooled, nor give in or fall for the mark, God will not allow it. Satan had his seal, his mark, but God seals believers for salvation, they are His, forever!

There are many, many New Testament warnings to watch and be ready, for the things that are coming, Some say to watch for the abomination of desolation, or the man of sin, etc, in the middle to Daniel's 70th week, that some (not I) refer to as the great tribulation.

Even Paul, in addressing the people who were told that we are not appointed unto wrath, said to them, that Christians are different than other. Some people are in the dark, others are in the light. Jesus does not come like a theif for those in the light, they are expecting Him watching:

2For you yourselves are fully aware that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 3While people are saying, “There is peace and security,” then sudden destruction will come upon them as labor pains come upon a pregnant woman, and they will not escape. 4But you are not in darkness, brothers, for that day to surprise you like a thief.

Same chapter as before. (1 Thess 5)

He also tells them that they will not be caught up, before those who are dead, and go to be with Christ at his coming. Also of interest:

4Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom the authority to judge was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended). This is the first resurrection. Rev 20

So yet again, the indication of scripture, is not one of a pre-trib rapture, but that is a different topic!

[childoftheking]

33 minutes ago, Omegaman 3.0 said:

I happen to believe, that Christians are not appointed unto wrath.

What then? But to obtain salvation

The verse that states this is 1 Thess 5:9

This fits in well, with verses that say true Christians, those who are the elect (chosen of God) will be preserved and not lost, no one can take us out of the Fathers hand etc.

No, those who take the mark, ARE appointed unto wrath, they will not see salvation. Therefore, nos real Christian, fall, for the mark, God will not allow it. Satan had his seal, his mark, but God seals believers for salvation, they are His, forever!

 

 

I normally would agree, and to a certain point still am agreeing.   There are solid scriptures to back this claim for us to hold onto this promise.  And then we have examples of what the Apostles (except John) went through and became martyrs.   But that is not really the thought behind what I posted.   God is definitely going to allow the antichrist to battle some Believers (could end up being beheaded and possibly a few killed in other ways) like verse 7 seems to elude to.   

 

What I mostly fall back on, is the fact that God is going to allow after 3 1/2 years of great miracles and no reason behind the ability to protect themselves, the Two Witnesses, will be killed by the antichrist.   

 

With that being said, I truly believe the bulk majority of the Believers will be hidden for most of the Tribulation.   Out in the middle of the deserts or deep in the woods and mountains.   Will most likely be communities.   And I believe God will provide protection (keeping us hid) and provide the necessities to survive on.  We very well could see a glimpse of the manna the Hebrews experienced in their desert and wilderness.

Edited May 20, 2019 by childoftheking

[childoftheking]

39 minutes ago, Michael37 said:

The preaching from pulpits during events like the French Revolution, WWI, & WWII would often include speculation and claims that prophecies in the Book of Revelation were being fulfilled, and the Lord was about to return any day, with Armaggedon a dead cert any time soon.

 Rev 16:16
(16)  And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.

Rev 19:19
(19)  And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.

 

Indeed, Preachers have been hammering this could be the "End" on events to like the Book (88 reasons God will return in 1988), the Y2K where technology was supposed to crash and burn and the Apocalypse would begin from it, George Bush I Desert Storm in Iraq, George Bush II debacle that led us to both Iraq and Afghanistan, Obama's continuation of Afghanistan, and of course this election of a President with no experience in politics (Trump)(who did bring us closer with his acknowledgement of Jerusalem being the Capital of Israel).

 

But I would definitely believe we are closer to it than ever before.   And not just because as each day passes, it naturally gets us closer.   But because so many prophecies have actually been fulfilled, and Israel has been ready for the past couple years to begin reconstructing their Temple and getting back to "Daily Sacrifice."   Which we know from Daniel Chapter 12, when the antichrist stops Daily Sacrifice, Israel will know they have been duped and that Yeshua was their Messiah all along.