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NickyLouse

Kingdom of God (or Heaven) - What is it?

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Hebrews 2:16 For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

Matthew 26:52 Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.

Isaiah 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.


Ephesians 5:19 Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;

Colossians 3:16 Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord.


James 4:4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.


2 Corinthians 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

1 John 2:15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.17 And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

 

2 Corinthians 11:32 In Damascus the governor under Aretas the king kept the city of the damascenes with a garrison, desirous to apprehend me:
33 And through a window in a basket was I let down by the wall, and escaped his hands.
Mark 13:9 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.

James 2:6 But ye have despised the poor. Do not rich men oppress you, and draw you before the judgment seats?
7 Do not they blaspheme that worthy name by the which ye are called?

Edited by gordon7777

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On 6/7/2019 at 5:54 AM, Oseas Ramos de Siqueira said:

You are welcome 

About God, I would like to say how I analyse the Person of the Omnipotent, and Omniscient and Omnpresent God through Scriptures, the only source that speaks of Him in Truth. First, God is a title. The Word is God, what is the image of the Word? Impossible to say, the Word-God is an invisible being. 

This is very deep to understand Scriptures that say: The Word is God, the Word is God the Father, the Word is the invisible God Creator of all things. 

For me this biblical revelation is very very deep to understand, I say so because if we get into the environment of the Power of the Word-God, only then we can understand the mystery of creation, that is, to understand how things were created out of nowhere by the Power of the Word-God. For example: God - the Word - by His Power, cried out saying: Gen.1:v.11-12  
11 Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.   - It means the earth bring forth these things out of nowhere under the command of the Power of the Word - the Word-God.
12 And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.  -  As we can see, the earth obeyd the command of the Word-God's Power and brought forth all things out of nowhere that was commanded.  


The Word-God also said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so. And the Word-God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.   -  Again, the earth obeyd the command of the Word-God's Power and brought forth all living creatures out of nowhere that was commanded.  -  
Yeah, all things were created out of nowhere under the Word-God's Power. The Word is God and we can see how the invisible God - the Word - worked and made appear the things in His Creation out of nowhere. This is impressive and hard to understand how was created the living creatures - cattle and beasts - out of nowhere.


But the process of creation of man is very very different and a peculiar creation, of course, yes, this was a very peculiar work of God, there is nothing superficial in the process of man's creation, but a great spiritual deep, for the Word-God is Spirit.  As is written in the Word of God - the Word is God - "what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Spirit teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. (1Corinthians 2:v.11-13)
V.14 - But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned" .  
 

Yes, God created man, but we cannot forget that the Devil, a former Cherub,  usurped man's creation for him, then the first that was born from the Devil was Cain, Cain was born in the image of the Devil, and after his likeness. Cain was of the Devil, his works were evil. (1John 3:v.12) 
V.10 - 10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the Devil (created in his image and in his likeness): whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

  

Yes, but the Holy Spirit is speaking of the sons of God exclusively or of them that was born of God's seed. We can not generalise, for there is also the sons of Devil, made in his image and after his likeness.

 

1Cor.15:v.49-50 say: 49 As we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly. 50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
 

In this the children of the Devil are manifested - the children of the god of this satanic world - they were made in his image and in his likeness, their minds were blinded by their own father, Satan, and remain in great darkness.  

 

Yes, he - JESUS - is the image of the invisible God - the Word-God - this confirms Gen.1v.26 - The Word-God said: Let us make man in our image, after our likeness. 
 

4 And the Lord spake suddenly unto Moses, and unto Aaron, and unto Miriam, Come out ye THREE unto the tabernacle of the congregation. And they three came out.
5 And the Lord came down in the pillar of the cloud, and stood in the door of the tabernacle, and called Aaron and Miriam: and they both came forth.
6 And God said, Hear now my words: ...  
 

I do not interpret Scriptures by the letter, the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. 


Summing up, the verses above, amoang others posted, confirm what is revealed in Philippians 3:v.20-21:
20 Our conversation is in heaven - a celestial place in Christ (Eph.1:v.3); from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:
21 Who shall change our vile BODY, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious BODY, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself. 
1 Cor.15:v.42 -  42 So will it be with the resurrection of the dead. The body that is sown is perishable, it is raised imperishable-body; 44 it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. 51 - I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed. the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53 For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality. 54 When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: “Death has been swallowed up in victory.

1 Thessalonias 4:13-18NIV
13 Brothers and sisters, we do not want you to be uninformed about those who sleep in death, so that you do not grieve like the rest of mankind, who have no hope. 14 For we believe that Jesus died and rose again, and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in him. 15 According to the Lord’s word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel - MICHAEL - and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first (Daniel 12:v.1-2). 17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever. 18 Therefore encourage one another with these words.
 

"Yes, God created man, but we cannot forget that the Devil, a former Cherub,  usurped man's creation for him, then the first that was born from the Devil was Cain, Cain was born in the image of the Devil, and after his likeness. Cain was of the Devil, his works were evil. (1John 3:v.12) 
V.10 - 10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the Devil (created in his image and in his likeness): whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother."

Everybody's works are evil,  everybody has sin in them, everybody has that image of the earthly,.

1 Corinthians 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
Matthew 7:11 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?

"
Yes, but the Holy Spirit is speaking of the sons of God exclusively or of them that was born of God's seed. We can not generalise, for there is also the sons of Devil, made in his image and after his likeness."

The first man, is such and such, and then the second man is such, there is no third man..

1 Corinthians 15:47 The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.
James 3:14 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.
15 This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.
16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.


1Cor.15:v.49-50 say: 49 As we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly. 50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

1 Corinthians 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

Raised in incorruption, incorruptible seed by the word of God to be born of God NOW.

1 Peter 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

sown in wesakness, raised in power, we weakness in Him but live with HIm by the power of God..

2 Corinthians 13:4 For though he was crucified through weakness, yet he liveth by the power of God. For we also are weak in him, but we shall live with him by the power of God toward you.

first natural and flesh, afterward Spirit, which is born of God already..

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

this last Adam is ALREADY quickened together with Christ, and all who are still the FIRST ADAM are not quickened together with Christ. Neither are they circumcised..

Ephesians 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)

Colossians 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;


2 Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

"In this the children of the Devil are manifested - the children of the god of this satanic world - they were made in his image and in his likeness, their minds were blinded by their own father, Satan, and remain in great darkness.  "

Christ is Spirit, that is the Image of God, Spirit. Flesh is not the image of God any longer, that is why those who are in the flesh are not the children of God..

Romans 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

Colossians 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

"Yes, he - JESUS - is the image of the invisible God - the Word-God - this confirms Gen.1v.26 - The Word-God said: Let us make man in our image, after our likeness. "

That was the first man, Adam, made of the earth, earthly. The second man is the Lord from Heaven, very different image.

1 Corinthians 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

3. God's personal look was not seen, is not seen yet, but Mosesd saw the similitude..

Numbers 12:8 With him will I speak mouth to mouth, even apparently, and not in dark speeches; and the similitude of the Lord shall he behold: wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against my servant Moses?

4 And the Lord spake suddenly unto Moses, and unto Aaron, and unto Miriam, Come out ye THREE unto the tabernacle of the congregation. And they three came out.
5 And the Lord came down in the pillar of the cloud, and stood in the door of the tabernacle, and called Aaron and Miriam: and they both came forth.
6 And God said, Hear now my words: 

Moses saw the similitude, others heard the voice of the Lord..

Genesis 3:8 And they heard the voice of the Lord God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the Lord God amongst the trees of the garden.

Deuteronomy 4:12 And the Lord spake unto you out of the midst of the fire: ye heard the voice of the words, but saw no similitude; only ye heard a voice.

You said you go by the Spirit not by the letter, ignoring all the Spirit words shared, is not going by much Spirit.

Read in SPIRIT terms.. We do not know yet what we shall be, but we shall be like Him when He appears. Purfying as He is pure, as in Him is no sin, to not sin is to have seen Him, to sin means we never saw Him..

1 John 3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.
4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

See through the SPIRIT. To see the Son is to see the Father, who nobody has seen at any time, the Son is in the Farther and the Father is in the Son, this is SEEING through the Spirit He has given us ALREADY..

John 5:37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.

John 14:7 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.
8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?
10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.

1 John 3:24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

1 John 4:13 Hereby know we that we dwell in him, and he in us, because he hath given us of his Spirit.

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21 hours ago, choir loft said:

I think you may be better at understanding subtleties than you admit.

If you invest a lot of money in a home, you first investigate.  The same is true for buying a major appliance or a car.   The subtleties we learn to avoid are those which tend to lead us in directions we have learned to avoid.  Lies, innuendo and confidence artists abound and if one is to walk steadfastly in the right path one must first learn the way to go.   The Bible is the way, but many do not consider its words seriously.   Most take bits and pieces of it to suit their own agenda.   Every despot of the modern age quoted the Bible when they justified their crimes against humanity.  Americans do the same thing every day.

"Gott mitt uns," proclaimed the banners of National Socialism in Germany during the 1930's and 1940's.   Adolph Hitler was photographed next to those words on many propaganda banners.  The English translation is, "God is with us."   The American version is almost identical, "God bless America."  These popular buzz words and political slogans serve to justify crimes against humanity in the Name of God.  In truth they serve neither God nor man.

"Christ does not vindicate a race or a nation.  It is the sovereignty of God which is vindicated." - Reinhold Neibuhr

Differences between earthly empires and the Kingdom of Heaven are obvious if you study the behavior of the Son of God.

Jesus NEVER accepted political or religious leadership.  

While He did accept the title of rabbi, it should be understood that in Judaism the title isn't indicative of the same pomposity ascribed to Catholic popes or the infallible pretentiousness of Protestant leadership. A rabbi is simply a teacher, nothing more and nothing less.  If the pope were married, he'd quickly learn he isn't infallible either.

Jesus NEVER supported the troops.

He didn't express any special respect for men in uniform, didn't grant them any special favors and didn't act as though they were God's gift to the people.  While He did perform miracles of healing for certain Roman soldiers and officials, they were granted to men who asked for help, not because they wore a uniform.

Jesus NEVER saluted a flag or Roman banner.

There's simply no evidence of it nor that Our Lord certified such worship of the government as proper or worthy of a believer.

Jesus NEVER sang a national anthem.

While such tunes were not generally promoted as they are today, I'm certain Our Lord wouldn't have participated in this form of national worship either.   He prayed to the Father, not the State.

Jesus NEVER respected the State.

While He did obey the civil laws and paid the normal tax due to citizens of the Roman Empire, Jesus always acted as though He were a tourist in a foreign land - which in fact He was.

Across the planet, citizens of every nation and empire are TOLD they owe their allegiance to the State.   Of this there is no dispute anywhere on earth.  They give it because they've been taught (sometimes at the point of a gun) they have to do so.  Americans do it in spite of a history of crimes against humanity perpetrated upon those who do not salute the stars and stripes.  (Ask any Native American how they feel on the subject of governmental genocide.  Ask any Afro-American how they feel about legalized slavery in America.  Both groups are still pretty sore about it.)

Jesus NEVER gave His allegiance to an earthly government - ever.

Consider the American Pledge of Allegiance.  While many folks believe this to honor our nation, it doesn't.  In actual fact it is a vow of loyalty to the US government and wasn't adopted until 1942.(*)  At the time America was deeply involved in a struggle for existence.  The US government needed its citizens to pledge their loyalty to Washington, DC.  (Those who's loyalty was in question were rounded up and put in detention camps.)  The German Nazi government did the same thing - Adolph Hitler, Seig Heil.

There is a BIG difference between the Kingdom of God and the empires of earthly history.

If one follows Christ, should one grant allegiance to any government other than the Kingdom of God?

There is nothing subtle about the choice.   It has more to do with courage than mental acumen.  

that's me, hollering from the choir loft...

(*) "I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America AND TO THE REPUBLIC for which it stands."  This is an unconditional oath to support a government.  Nowhere in its words are the people mentioned except as vassals of the state.  

"Got mitt uns" predates the Nazis, and was in use in Germany before then, but your point stands.

Jesus asked US to give allegiance to earthly governance AND to support our honored soldiers, at numerous passages in both testaments. How do you make sense of Romans 14 apart from such an understanding?

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27 minutes ago, Billiards Ball said:

"Got mitt uns" predates the Nazis, and was in use in Germany before then, but your point stands.

Jesus asked US to give allegiance to earthly governance AND to support our honored soldiers, at numerous passages in both testaments. How do you make sense of Romans 14 apart from such an understanding?

Did Christ give allegiance to herod, or refused to speak one word to that fox ?

 

The children are free, but only to not offend them, Christ gave the coin that was in the mouth of the fish.

 

Dishonourable soldiers..

 

Matthew 27:27 Then the soldiers of the governor took Jesus into the common hall, and gathered unto him the whole band of soldiers.

 

Our honoured soldiers are ourselves, spiritual warfare ONLY..

2 Timothy 2:3 Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ.
 
2 Timothy 2:4 No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.
 
1 Timothy 1:18 This charge I commit unto thee, son Timothy, according to the prophecies which went before on thee, that thou by them mightest war a good warfare;
19 Holding faith, and a good conscience; which some having put away concerning faith have made shipwreck:
 
Acts 24:16 And herein do I exercise myself, to have always a conscience void to offence toward God, and toward men.

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13 minutes ago, gordon7777 said:

Did Christ give allegiance to herod, or refused to speak one word to that fox ?

 

The children are free, but only to not offend them, Christ gave the coin that was in the mouth of the fish.

 

Dishonourable soldiers..

 

Matthew 27:27 Then the soldiers of the governor took Jesus into the common hall, and gathered unto him the whole band of soldiers.

 

Our honoured soldiers are ourselves, spiritual warfare ONLY..

2 Timothy 2:3 Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ.
 
2 Timothy 2:4 No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.
 
1 Timothy 1:18 This charge I commit unto thee, son Timothy, according to the prophecies which went before on thee, that thou by them mightest war a good warfare;
19 Holding faith, and a good conscience; which some having put away concerning faith have made shipwreck:
 
Acts 24:16 And herein do I exercise myself, to have always a conscience void to offence toward God, and toward men.

Hi, I'm a fundamentalist, saved by the holy Word of God through Jesus Christ. You can quote 50 more verses if you like, but Romans 14 is plain that we DO serve country and many others. Period.

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1 minute ago, Billiards Ball said:

Hi, I'm a fundamentalist, saved by the holy Word of God through Jesus Christ. You can quote 50 more verses if you like, but Romans 14 is plain that we DO serve country and many others. Period.

We serve not what is here we do not even look here, show what you claim is plain ?

 

Hebrews 13:14 For here have we no continuing city, but we seek one to come.
 
2 Corinthians 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

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1 minute ago, gordon7777 said:

We serve not what is here we do not even look here, show what you claim is plain ?

 

Hebrews 13:14 For here have we no continuing city, but we seek one to come.
 
2 Corinthians 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

The entire chapter of Romans 14 has to do with submitting to authorities and others--we must pay Caesar sometimes. Take a look at the chapter prayerfully, I urge you. Providing individual verses out of context is not causing me to change my mind.

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Just now, Billiards Ball said:

The entire chapter of Romans 14 has to do with submitting to authorities and others--we must pay Caesar sometimes. Take a look at the chapter prayerfully, I urge you. Providing individual verses out of context is not causing me to change my mind.

Yes we submit to the authorities, but do we serve God or man, when these same authorities commanded to not serve God ?

 

Acts 5:26 Then went the captain with the officers, and brought them without violence: for they feared the people, lest they should have been stoned.27 And when they had brought them, they set them before the council: and the high priest asked them,28 Saying, Did not we straitly command you that ye should not teach in this name? and, behold, ye have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this man's blood upon us.29 Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.

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2 minutes ago, gordon7777 said:

Yes we submit to the authorities, but do we serve God or man, when these same authorities commanded to not serve God ?

 

Acts 5:26 Then went the captain with the officers, and brought them without violence: for they feared the people, lest they should have been stoned.27 And when they had brought them, they set them before the council: and the high priest asked them,28 Saying, Did not we straitly command you that ye should not teach in this name? and, behold, ye have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this man's blood upon us.29 Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.

Per the rest of the scriptures, we certainly DO NOT submit to men when they ask us to break God's law and will. For example, we would not abort children even if living in a country with forced abortion. Thanks for raising that issue.

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Why would we honour soldiers then that kill man, when man is made in the image of God ?

 

Aborting children is murder, the same as anyone who kills, will die by the sword.

 

Yes we submit to them, to show the peace makers in Christ, and we support nothing of them, as all that is in the world is the enemy of God.

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