Is it correct to look at salvation this way?

[dr3032]

Everyone else has posted well, but I'd just like to correct the wording.

You say Jesus was BURIED but the correct term would be "entombed". His corpse was placed within a cave and a large boulder was rolled over the opening, requiring multiple men in order to move it.

[plo1988]

56 minutes ago, dr3032 said:

Everyone else has posted well, but I'd just like to correct the wording.

You say Jesus was BURIED but the correct term would be "entombed". His corpse was placed within a cave and a large boulder was rolled over the opening, requiring multiple men in ordEer to move it.

Entombed might be an appropriate word, but 1 Corinthians 15:4 in the NIV ESV and KJV all say buried.

[Revelation Man]

On 6/3/2019 at 11:12 PM, LeeGreenForest said:

Is it correct to look at salvation this way? That we've accrued a debt through our sins which must be paid with our death and eventual place in the lake of fire and that Jesus has completely paid our debt with His death and shed blood on the cross and that He was buried and rose again on the third day and that through faith in Him and what He's done (His death and shed blood on the cross, His burial, and His resurrection on the third day) we are saved?

Its not so much about us but about God. God doesn't really sentence us to hell, we sentence ourselves there by rejecting the Free Gift of Salvation, which saves us from being "Separated from God" for eternity. Since God can't abide sin, hence His Glory would destroy it, He couldn't be looked on by Moses lest Moses would have died, 70 something men died via the Ark at one time. So the purge is a must need so that God can receive us in Heaven. 

Most people who aren't Christians don't really get that. Jesus on the cross stated "My God, My God, why have you forsaken me", when Jesus had all of our sins upon Him, God had to leave hm all alone, God didn't forsake Jesus, but he had to leave His presence. So by rejecting the free gift, we sentence ourselves to a separation from God, and not being in God is DEATH, there is no life save in God. So those that aske, "Well why doesn't God just forgive and accept. He can't, you sins are yet with you unless you turn from them, and God would destroy Sin via His Glory.

[gordon7777]

On 6/5/2019 at 10:08 PM, Revelation Man said:

Its not so much about us but about God. God doesn't really sentence us to hell, we sentence ourselves there by rejecting the Free Gift of Salvation, which saves us from being "Separated from God" for eternity. Since God can't abide sin, hence His Glory would destroy it, He couldn't be looked on by Moses lest Moses would have died, 70 something men died via the Ark at one time. So the purge is a must need so that God can receive us in Heaven. 

Most people who aren't Christians don't really get that. Jesus on the cross stated "My God, My God, why have you forsaken me", when Jesus had all of our sins upon Him, God had to leave hm all alone, God didn't forsake Jesus, but he had to leave His presence. So by rejecting the free gift, we sentence ourselves to a separation from God, and not being in God is DEATH, there is no life save in God. So those that aske, "Well why doesn't God just forgive and accept. He can't, you sins are yet with you unless you turn from them, and God would destroy Sin via His Glory.

We being born in sin are sentenced already. We cant sentence ourselves to the place we are in even before birth, sin death and hell.

We then being separated from God, know nothing of God, who is Holy and different from the devil who dwells in us. 

 

God gives the Holy calling, and the light of Christ is shines in the heart, and we see the calling and respond to it.

 

Eyes that are closed, due to the heart being hardened in sin and stone, see nothing of holiness, and respond in an unholy manner.

Jesus Christ seemed to be left, but was not left really, He does always the things that please the Father, also He has life in Himself, how can you be abandoned when you are life ?

John 1:4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

 

John 5:26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;

 

John 8:29 And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that pleasehim.

 

John 16:32 Behold, the hour cometh, yea, is now come, that ye shall be scattered, every man to his own, and shall leave me alone: and yet I am not alone, because the Father is with me.

 

The forsaking. Why the Lord seems to be far from our calls ? We cried and He heard not. But when we trust the Lord, we are not confounded, we know He has never truly forsaken. Zion said the Lord has  forsaken me, forgotten me, yet He will never forget them. Continually before Him. Called as a woman forsaken, for a small moment forsaken, and gathered with great mercies, hidden for a moment, but with everlasting kindness mercy on them, this is the feeling of MEN, to be forsaken, but we see it played out by Christ, the feeling of forsaken was to never truly be forsaken, but we believed it that way until we see the mercy that was hidden from us was known and revealed from Heaven..

 

Psalm 22:My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? why art thou so far from helping me, and from the words of my roaring?2 O my God, I cry in the day time, but thou hearest not; and in the night season, and am not silent.3 But thou art holy, O thou that inhabitest the praises of Israel.4 Our fathers trusted in thee: they trusted, and thou didst deliver them.5 They cried unto thee, and were delivered: they trusted in thee, and were not confounded.

Isaiah 49:14 But Zion said, The Lord hath forsaken me, and my Lord hath forgotten me. 15 Can a woman forget her sucking child, that she should not have compassion on the son of her womb? yea, they may forget, yet will I not forget thee.16 Behold, I have graven thee upon the palms of my hands; thy walls are continually before me.

 

Isaiah 54:6 For the Lord hath called thee as a woman forsaken and grieved in spirit, and a wife of youth, when thou wast refused, saith thy God.7 For a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great mercies will I gather thee.8 In a little wrath I hid my face from thee for a moment; but with everlasting kindness will I have mercy on thee, saith the Lord thy Redeemer.
7 For a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great mercies will I gather thee.

 

To be saved, is to believe the testimony of Christ, heavenly and enlightened and just and right and not the testimony of man, nothing right in it at all when it is man.

[Behold]

On 6/3/2019 at 11:12 PM, LeeGreenForest said:

Is it correct to look at salvation this way? That we've accrued a debt through our sins which must be paid with our death and eventual place in the lake of fire and that Jesus has completely paid our debt with His death and shed blood on the cross and that He was buried and rose again on the third day and that through faith in Him and what He's done (His death and shed blood on the cross, His burial, and His resurrection on the third day) we are saved?

Lets say you were trying to explain salvation to a non-believer.

If you start talking about "debt accrued" for sin, then they are going to change the channel.   As this type of nomenclature is "christianese"...Its what we as believers use when we are speaking the "Jesus lingo" to each other, but, in the real world of lost people, they don't get it.

So, try it like this..

simplify....

If they are willing to agree that there is a God, then have them try to understand that we are born disconnected from God's Family.  Then you can tell them why... "Adam".. "Sin"... the fall., etc.

And then simply explain to them that God Himself created a way for all of us to be back into His family, as the reality is....."Salvation" is come to us,  when we are back into His family.

That is what SAVED actually means, more then the rest, because its the most important part of redemption.

Sure, baby Christians will want to talk about repenting, and  being saved from hell......but unsaved people wont listen long if you try to get them out of Hell, as they are not going to stand to be told about this...  So, a wise believer, one with actual experience.......not chatting endlessly on forums like this one.....but one who is actually doing something for God.........this person, understands that there is one universal thing that everybody is looking for......in this world........and that is........LOVE.    Everyone is looking for LOVE........and so, for the looker, for the unsaved looker.......to find out about a Loving God and a Loving Christ who LOVE THEM SO MUCH, that they died for them............so that they could be a part of God's loving FAMILY..........this is their Salvation.....and this is what an unbeliever wants to know about, and this is what a Christian will explain = as their best way to offer salvation to a non-believer.

"Christ came to SEEK and SAVED that , those, who are LOST"......and lost means........"separated from God and God's family".   So, Salvation is the rejoining to God's family, BY the Cross and the shed blood of Jesus, as the only means to get you there..........and its the only WAY.     John 14:6

[Revelation Man]

1 hour ago, gordon7777 said:

We being born in sin are sentenced already. We cant sentence ourselves to the place we are in even before birth, sin death and hell.

We then being separated from God, know nothing of God, who is Holy and different from the devil who dwells in us. 

 

God gives the Holy calling, and the light of Christ is shines in the heart, and we see the calling and respond to it.

 

Eyes that are closed, due to the heart being hardened in sin and stone, see nothing of holiness, and respond in an unholy manner.

Jesus Christ seemed to be left, but was not left really, He does always the things that please the Father, also He has life in Himself, how can you be abandoned when you are life ?

John 1:4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

 

John 5:26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;

 

John 8:29 And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that pleasehim.

 

John 16:32 Behold, the hour cometh, yea, is now come, that ye shall be scattered, every man to his own, and shall leave me alone: and yet I am not alone, because the Father is with me.

 

The forsaking. Why the Lord seems to be far from our calls ? We cried and He heard not. But when we trust the Lord, we are not confounded, we know He has never truly forsaken. Zion said the Lord has  forsaken me, forgotten me, yet He will never forget them. Continually before Him. Called as a woman forsaken, for a small moment forsaken, and gathered with great mercies, hidden for a moment, but with everlasting kindness mercy on them, this is the feeling of MEN, to be forsaken, but we see it played out by Christ, the feeling of forsaken was to never truly be forsaken, but we believed it that way until we see the mercy that was hidden from us was known and revealed from Heaven..

 

Psalm 22:My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? why art thou so far from helping me, and from the words of my roaring?2 O my God, I cry in the day time, but thou hearest not; and in the night season, and am not silent.3 But thou art holy, O thou that inhabitest the praises of Israel.4 Our fathers trusted in thee: they trusted, and thou didst deliver them.5 They cried unto thee, and were delivered: they trusted in thee, and were not confounded.

Isaiah 49:14 But Zion said, The Lord hath forsaken me, and my Lord hath forgotten me. 15 Can a woman forget her sucking child, that she should not have compassion on the son of her womb? yea, they may forget, yet will I not forget thee.16 Behold, I have graven thee upon the palms of my hands; thy walls are continually before me.

 

Isaiah 54:6 For the Lord hath called thee as a woman forsaken and grieved in spirit, and a wife of youth, when thou wast refused, saith thy God.7 For a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great mercies will I gather thee.8 In a little wrath I hid my face from thee for a moment; but with everlasting kindness will I have mercy on thee, saith the Lord thy Redeemer.
7 For a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great mercies will I gather thee.

 

To be saved, is to believe the testimony of Christ, heavenly and enlightened and just and right and not the testimony of man, nothing right in it at all when it is man.

Reread my quote, I said we sentence ourselves by Rejecting the Free Gift of Salvation. I am speaking about us rejecting a Free Gift. 

EXAMPLE: If a prisoner was sentenced to Death and he refused a FREE PARDON by the Gov. who would be responsible for his Death ? He would of course. 

The Free Gift is there for all, thus my thought, we sentence ourselves by rejecting the Pardon.

[gordon7777]

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

Reread my quote, I said we sentence ourselves by Rejecting the Free Gift of Salvation. I am speaking about us rejecting a Free Gift. 

EXAMPLE: If a prisoner was sentenced to Death and he refused a FREE PARDON by the Gov. who would be responsible for his Death ? He would of course. 

The Free Gift is there for all, thus my thought, we sentence ourselves by rejecting the Pardon.

That is not according to the faith.

 

The sheep hear His voice and follow Him AND a stranger will they NOT follow.

 

The sheep never heard the thieves and robbers, all who were before the shepherd are thieves and robbers.

 

The ones not His sheep do not hear Him.

 

John 10:3 To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out.

 

John 10:8 All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them.

 

John 10:²⁵ Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.²⁶ But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.²⁷ My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

John 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

 

 

[Revelation Man]

2 minutes ago, gordon7777 said:

That is not according to the faith.

 

The sheep hear His voice and follow Him AND a stranger will they NOT follow.

 

The sheep never heard the thieves and robbers, all who were before the shepherd are thieves and robbers.

 

The ones not His sheep do not hear Him.

 

John 10:3 To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out.

 

John 10:8 All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them.

 

John 10:²⁵ Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.²⁶ But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.²⁷ My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

John 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

 

 

Which is what those who love sin more than God do, they Reject the Free Gift of Salvation by saying we don't believe in Christ. Faith is A GIVEN, Abraham believed and thus was accounted as Righteous. No one said we don't come unto God by Faith, I just stated we sentence ourselves unto separation from God by rejection the pardon. 

[gordon7777]

4 minutes ago, Revelation Man said:

Which is what those who love sin more than God do, they Reject the Free Gift of Salvation by saying we don't believe in Christ. Faith is A GIVEN, Abraham believed and thus was accounted as Righteous. No one said we don't come unto God by Faith, I just stated we sentence ourselves unto separation from God by rejection the pardon. 

Nothing can be rejected by those who cannot escape the damnation of hell. Nothing can be rejected by those who are of their father the devil.

 

Matthew 23:³³ Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?³⁴ Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:³⁵ That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.³⁶ Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.

 

John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

 

Faith is the gift of God, and if you notice yet the words of Christ, He told them to their face the decisions.

 

Jude 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[gordon7777]

This is the work Christ came to do, a marvellous work, did you know it ?

 

Isaiah 29:14 Therefore, behold, I will proceed to do a marvellous work among this people, even a marvellous work and a wonder: for the wisdom of their wise men shall perish, and the understanding of their prudent men shall be hid.

 

Matthew 11:25 At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.

 

1 Corinthians 1:19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.

 

Matthew 11:27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neitherknoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.