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john smith

Please help me understand violence in the Bible?

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Thank you all for letting me join this forum and would like to know in general why God has demanded Israel to kill people including everything especially the children with such violence? 

I can certainly understand God's hatred for them, but there were a million other ways God could have killed them like for example a disease that killed them in their sleep or a heart attack, lots of ways to kill them without pain and suffering - this really makes it hard for me to increase my believe and growth in Jesus. 

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17 hours ago, john smith said:

Thank you all for letting me join this forum and would like to know in general why God has demanded Israel to kill people including everything especially the children with such violence? 

I can certainly understand God's hatred for them, but there were a million other ways God could have killed them like for example a disease that killed them in their sleep or a heart attack, lots of ways to kill them without pain and suffering - this really makes it hard for me to increase my believe and growth in Jesus. 

Shalom John,

Good question.

Yahweh does seem to use armies to bring judgement in the Bible (the Philistines, the Assyrians, Babylonians, Persians, Greeks, Romans etc).  It could be that this would bring the most fear to the residents to change, as many wouldn't fear the sudden death.

Yahweh promised Israel that they would lose their land in a similar way that they were to take it, if they disobeyed.  Therefore, getting Israel to carry out the conquering could have been for the following purposes:

A demonstration (from the other side) of what fate awaited them if they disobeyed. Instant death or natural disaster wouldn't bring much fear to some.  However, an invading army... Indeed the same fate did hit Israel and Judah.

Keeping the land, water, animals and crops safe to sustain the whole nation.  A natural disaster, disease or the bodies from sudden mass death (caused by God as you suggest) in Canaan could have ruined the land for years.

A proving ground for Israel.  Yes, God could have used another method to wipe out the Canaanites, yes he could have used another nation.  But why not use Israel?  A nation learning to walk with God and to go when he says so. It seems to make sense to use Israel as the method to testing their hearts as well

Proof to Israel.  Yes, Israel conquered the land by they had little to do with it really.  They were an untrained army and displayed no evidence of advanced warfare tactics of tackling strongholds, whole nations and even giants.  Yet, Israel succeeded.  I'm sure it dawned on them all that Yahweh was in control of providing perfect circumstances, unbelievable coincidences and even giving some supernatural powers.  It surely showed Israel Yahweh's power, in another way from the 10 plagues of Egypt.  It's the equivalent of Israel tackling the Egyptians, something they were terrified to do at the time.  It's like in Egypt He said "I will watch over you and protect you" and in Canaan He was saying "I will be with you against your enemies and prospering your way".  That latter lesson wouldn't be learned had Israel not stepped forward in faith to fight.  Some lessons require our proactive action in faith.

Yahweh is a wonderful Father.  He watches over us and protects us divinely in ways we don't understand or even realise we need.  But, at other times, he wants our "training wheels" to come off and for us to stand up bravely and walk in faith proactively.  Let's not forget, He is raising up a holy nation to rule with His Son in the New World.  If we always sat back at waited for Him to do everything and just be reactive to it, what would be the point of our training and future leadership?

Christians today do not have the same challenge Israel had back then but it different ways.  As Israel cut off the Canaanites from the land literally, we are to do so figuratively.  That is, to remove the worldly evil (canaanites) from the holy land (our renewed lives).  In a way, we need to be violent with it, utterly destroying it all men, women and children (or strong evils, passive evils and seeds of evil).  Or we can become like Israel did and compromise with the "inhabitants" and suffer for it in the long run.  Let me make it clear, by inhabitants I'm not talking about non-believers in the world but strongholds in our lives; such as hatred, bitterness, unforgiveness, pride, greed, passiveness, grumbling, backbiting, viciousness, sexual immorality, drunkenness etc etc. 

I hope that gives you some new insights into the matter.

Love & Shalom

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20 hours ago, john smith said:

Thank you all for letting me join this forum and would like to know in general why God has demanded Israel to kill people including everything especially the children with such violence? 

I can certainly understand God's hatred for them, but there were a million other ways God could have killed them like for example a disease that killed them in their sleep or a heart attack, lots of ways to kill them without pain and suffering - this really makes it hard for me to increase my believe and growth in Jesus. 

Why? When it was we that chose all of this...

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Adam chose to follow after the created thing than The Creator and what was a do not~ he did.... and every child since that time has chosen the same... Now we are to turn to God to blame Him for the circumstances that have come as a result of those choices?

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On 14 June 2019 at 5:36 PM, john smith said:

Thank you all for letting me join this forum and would like to know in general why God has demanded Israel to kill people including everything especially the children with such violence?

I can certainly understand God's hatred for them, but there were a million other ways God could have killed them like for example a disease that killed them in their sleep or a heart attack, lots of ways to kill them without pain and suffering - this really makes it hard for me to increase my believe and growth in Jesus.

You are concerned about people who died hundreds of years ago?

You acknowledge that they were all evil and deserved Gods judgement, but quible at how God punished them?

Can you identify the bases for your moral indignation?

Is it based on Christian morality or upon atheist/agnostic morality?

Because if based on Christian morality you have no bases for a complaint.

If based on atheist/agnostic morality you have no bases for morality and so again no reason for a complaint.

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On 6/14/2019 at 9:36 AM, john smith said:

Thank you all for letting me join this forum and would like to know in general why God has demanded Israel to kill people including everything especially the children with such violence? 

I can certainly understand God's hatred for them, but there were a million other ways God could have killed them like for example a disease that killed them in their sleep or a heart attack, lots of ways to kill them without pain and suffering - this really makes it hard for me to increase my believe and growth in Jesus. 

God always knows best so I never question the actions that God takes. It goes with having faith and trust in God in everything He does. 

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13 minutes ago, Who me said:

You are concerned about people who died hundreds of years ago?

You acknowledge that they were all evil and deserved Gods judgement, but quible at how God punished them?

Can you identify the bases for your moral indignation?

Is it based on Christian morality or upon atheist/agnostic morality?

Because if based on Christian morality you have no bases for a complaint.

If based on atheist/agnostic morality you have no bases for morality and so again no reason for a complaint.

He says "has demanded" and "could have killed" 

Therefore, grammatically speaking, tenses don't match. This is why I am not sure whether or not he is referring to a past event.

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2 minutes ago, Godismyloveforever said:

He says "has demanded" and "could have killed"

Therefore, grammatically speaking, tenses don't match. This is why I am not sure whether or not he is referring to a past event.

Practically speaking, God has not commanded modern Israel to attack or kill anyone, so the post can reasonable only refer to the OT.

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God must have had a good reason. 

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On ‎6‎/‎15‎/‎2019 at 4:36 AM, john smith said:

Thank you all for letting me join this forum and would like to know in general why God has demanded Israel to kill people including everything especially the children with such violence? 

I can certainly understand God's hatred for them, but there were a million other ways God could have killed them like for example a disease that killed them in their sleep or a heart attack, lots of ways to kill them without pain and suffering - this really makes it hard for me to increase my believe and growth in Jesus. 

As you continue to study God's Word and seek His purpose and plan for your life as well as for His Creation, He will reveal more to you both of His Judgment and His Mercy. 

"Divine Judgment" is evidenced all through the Bible from Genesis to Revelation where it comes to a climax at Judgment Day. The OT destruction of the pagan nations that posed a threat to God's chosen people points forward to Judgment Day when once again God will deal with those who oppose Him.

Rom 9:22-24
(22)  What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
(23)  And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
(24)  Even us, whom he has called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
 

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On 6/15/2019 at 2:36 AM, john smith said:

Thank you all for letting me join this forum and would like to know in general why God has demanded Israel to kill people including everything especially the children with such violence? 

I can certainly understand God's hatred for them, but there were a million other ways God could have killed them like for example a disease that killed them in their sleep or a heart attack, lots of ways to kill them without pain and suffering - this really makes it hard for me to increase my believe and growth in Jesus. 

I never had any trouble when i read the accounts of these actions carried out by the Hebrew people under the orders of Yaveh..

Having read the entire Bible and reading the accounts of the brutal actions of these peoples including sacrificing children by fire ( can you imagine the suffering of little babies being burnt to death as a sacrifice to the idol molech?  And also some of these peoples attacked the Hebrew people in times past,, violently.. Note also that God had communications with these people .. If you read about the prophet Balaam who lived in those lands and was consulted by a king of those peoples in the OT..

So God chose to use the Hebrew people as an implement of His wrath upon the peoples of Canaan so be it.. It was justified..

Later God chose to use the Media/Persians as an implement of His wrath upon the Hebrews.. and again later He used the Romans as an implement of his wrath upon the Jews, So be it, God was justified..

Maybe in the near future the wrath of God will be poured out upon this world again as predicted in the Book of Revelation and again when it happens it will be justified..

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