while I'm stuck in here, why God let Israel into slavery in Egypt?

[imnotJohnSmith]

I've scan through the chapters in Bible,

wasn't that God let them go to Egypt for food because of a famine,

and it went well in the beginning until "...a Pharaoh that knows not Jospeph..." 

why 4oo years of slavery ? that's so long!

[Willa]

My recollection is that in the beginning they were in slavery but they prospered greatly and were very comfortable.  They weren't moving giant stones to build pyramids.  Meanwhile they had to wait till the sin of the Caananites was full before God permitted them to enter the Promised Land.  The last pharaoh was abusing them and made them desperate enough to call out to God.  

Welcome to Worthy, notJohn.  

[BeauJangles]

3 hours ago, imnotJohnSmith said:

why 4oo years of slavery ? that's so long!

Hi, John. Slavery started in America also, in 1619. And it wasn't abolished until the thirteenth amendment was ratified, in 1865. That's about 246 years, which is also a long time. I'm not saying which was worse comparatively speaking, but no slavery is good slavery IMHO. Welcome to Worthy, and God bless you. 

Shalom, 

David/BeauJangles

[Jayne]

3 hours ago, imnotJohnSmith said:

I've scan through the chapters in Bible,

wasn't that God let them go to Egypt for food because of a famine,

and it went well in the beginning until "...a Pharaoh that knows not Jospeph..." 

why 4oo years of slavery ? that's so long!

You have to go back to Abraham to see the why's of it all.

Joseph's great-grandfather, Abraham was told all the details.

From Genesis 15 - 

"Now when the sun was going down, a deep sleep fell upon Abram; and behold, terror and great darkness fell upon him. God said to Abram, “Know for certain that your descendants will be strangers in a land that is not theirs, where they will be enslaved and oppressed four hundred years. But I will also judge the nation whom they will serve, and afterward they will come out with many possessions. As for you, you shall go to your fathers in peace; you will be buried at a good old age. Then in the fourth generation they will return here, for the iniquity of the Amorite is not yet complete.”

God had two things going on at the same time according to his explanation to Abraham.

[1] The Hebrew people, which numbered less than 90 [I can't remember the exact number] would leave the Promised Land and be, initially, a "guest" of Egypt - then a slave.  As they grew from less than 90 to about 2 million, they became a nation all unto themselves.  When leaving, the Hebrew women would go to the Egyptian homes and ask for their possession and were granted them.

•   They had to grow into a large enough people group to constitute a "nation".
•   They had to leave with enough possessions to support that new nation.

[2]  God was giving 400 years of merciful patience to the vile inhabitant of the Promised Land - the Amorites in particular.  Remember "it is God's will that none should perish".  But they do perish. But NOT because God isn't patient and merciful.  These people were given 400 years to repent.  

•  Just like God gave the Ninevites time to repent during Jonah's days.  A people so brutal and vile and violent and gross.  But God was patient with them and he brought his plan of repentance to them and they did repent.
•   ....for a while.  Then in Nahum's days, [a couple of hundred years later], they fell back into sin and God destroyed them.

God is merciful beyond belief and bears with mankind more than WE would if WE were him.

 

 

 

 

[marvelloustime]

Welcome to Worthy.

It's lovely to have you here.

Becky.

[Heybro]

Hi there to you NotJohn, so, if you're not John, I hope you're not confused, (lol), enjoy your time here, God bless.

[imnotJohnSmith]

wow so many warm welcomes from so many of you, I'm thrilled. So thanks.

[imnotJohnSmith]

5 hours ago, Jayne said:

You have to go back to Abraham to see the why's of it all.

Joseph's great-grandfather, Abraham was told all the details.

From Genesis 15 - 

"Now when the sun was going down, a deep sleep fell upon Abram; and behold, terror and great darkness fell upon him. God said to Abram, “Know for certain that your descendants will be strangers in a land that is not theirs, where they will be enslaved and oppressed four hundred years. But I will also judge the nation whom they will serve, and afterward they will come out with many possessions. As for you, you shall go to your fathers in peace; you will be buried at a good old age. Then in the fourth generation they will return here, for the iniquity of the Amorite is not yet complete.”

God had two things going on at the same time according to his explanation to Abraham.

[1] The Hebrew people, which numbered less than 90 [I can't remember the exact number] would leave the Promised Land and be, initially, a "guest" of Egypt - then a slave.  As they grew from less than 90 to about 2 million, they became a nation all unto themselves.  When leaving, the Hebrew women would go to the Egyptian homes and ask for their possession and were granted them.

•   They had to grow into a large enough people group to constitute a "nation".
•   They had to leave with enough possessions to support that new nation.

[2]  God was giving 400 years of merciful patience to the vile inhabitant of the Promised Land - the Amorites in particular.  Remember "it is God's will that none should perish".  But they do perish. But NOT because God isn't patient and merciful.  These people were given 400 years to repent.  

•  Just like God gave the Ninevites time to repent during Jonah's days.  A people so brutal and vile and violent and gross.  But God was patient with them and he brought his plan of repentance to them and they did repent.
•   ....for a while.  Then in Nahum's days, [a couple of hundred years later], they fell back into sin and God destroyed them.

God is merciful beyond belief and bears with mankind more than WE would if WE were him.

 

 

 

Thank you Jayne.

I'll read more of the chapters

...

But it has been difficult for me to explain the faith to people under totalitarian regime.

So they believe, but all that come are conflicts and distress, there seem to be little consolations.

Almost all of them are first time/generation believers, I guess they just have to bear the iniquities of their fathers unto the third and fourth generations?(Numbers 14:18  The LORD is longsuffering, and of great mercy,forgiving iniquity and transgression, and by no means clearing the guilty, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation.)

That's why it get me started to link it with the situations with Israel in Egypt. But I'm afraid their belief wont' last to third or fourth generations before it's extinguished.

Some of the totalitarian regimes today are far worse than Pharoahs.

So any  thoughts on this people-under-bondage in the context of our current world?

 

[Jostler]

So very often God allows us to see adversity because we're fat and prosperous and have no sense of need...of Him.   430 years to the day, but they were not living as slaves as long as Joseph was Prime Minister and honored by Pharoah, who gave Joseph's family the best of the land to live in.  As long as Joseph's memory remained with the  ruling class, his family was at least left alone to prosper.  And they did.   Birthrates exceeding those of the  Egyptians  to the  point a Pharoah who did not  know Joseph became fearful the  Israelites would rise up and side with  Egypt's enemies if  Egypt were attacked.   He is the one who began to enslave and oppress the  Israelites and attempted to halt their increase.

God told Abraham His p

Quote

 

Gen 15:13-16

And he said unto Abram, Know of a surety that thy seed shall be a stranger in a land that is not theirs, and shall serve them; and they shall afflict them four hundred years;  And also that nation, whom they shall serve, will I judge: and afterward shall they come out with great substance.  And thou shalt go to thy fathers in peace; thou shalt be buried in a good old age. But in the fourth generation they shall come hither again: for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet full.

I think my  little opening speculation has some merit, but here He  clearly shows His motives.  He fully  intended to judge the  gods of Egypt and they  fell into His trap....externalizing the evil He already knew was in their hearts when they  chose to oppress His  people.  He intended to waste and spoil the economic might of Egypt and made sure the Israelites got every penny of 430 years of back pay.  A lot  of that built the Tabernacle.  And the people who were then occupying  His land, had not yet filled up the  cup of their iniquity.  They were to be judged by Him through Israel's armies and Israel learned more about following and obeying  Him as He led them in conquest of their  promised possession.

 

Edit: not sure how I missed Jayne's post...said pretty much the  same things but I think she said it better

Edited July 5, 2019 by Jostler

[thomas t]

6 hours ago, imnotJohnSmith said:

Thank you Jayne.

I'll read more of the chapters

...

But it has been difficult for me to explain the faith to people under totalitarian regime.

So they believe, but all that come are conflicts and distress, there seem to be little consolations.

Almost all of them are first time/generation believers, I guess they just have to bear the iniquities of their fathers unto the third and fourth generations?(Numbers 14:18  The LORD is longsuffering, and of great mercy,forgiving iniquity and transgression, and by no means clearing the guilty, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation.)

That's why it get me started to link it with the situations with Israel in Egypt. But I'm afraid their belief wont' last to third or fourth generations before it's extinguished.

Some of the totalitarian regimes today are far worse than Pharoahs.

So any  thoughts on this people-under-bondage in the context of our current world?

 

Hi NotJohn,

yes I have.

Look at Germany under Hitler, Hitler was voted into power by democratic standards. Before, he wrote a book in which he laid out what he would do if in power. Moreover, people could see how he ruled the Berlin area (that's what he was in charge of before winning the 1933 general elections). In my opinion, Germans basically knew what that was. Many people say "Hitler was so mean", yes he was, but don't forget the Germans that voted for him.

Hamas was voted into power in Gaza - by democratic poll.

Erdogan in Turkey - this man is supported by more than 50% of all Turks. Putin in Russia knows that he has the support of more than half of the Russian population.

All these leaders have their very own approach to freedom. Yet their peoples love them.

 

Israel loved the Pharoahs, it seems.

Numbers 11:18 said

And say to the people, ‘Consecrate yourselves for tomorrow, and you shall eat meat, for you have wept in the hearing of the Lord, saying, “Who will give us meat to eat? For it was better for us in Egypt.” Therefore the Lord will give you meat, and you shall eat.

 

and then Numbers 11:20

 but a whole month, until it [the meat] comes out at your nostrils and becomes loathsome to you, because you have rejected the Lord who is among you and have wept before him, saying, “Why did we come out of Egypt?”’”

Yeah, Egypt was horrible, but they loved it, it seems. I mean they even wept when they were out.

Thomas