Jump to content
R. Hartono

Did the planetary position of 23 Sept 2017 speak about Rev.12 ?

Recommended Posts

Posted (edited)

Find the answer fr Dr. Danny Faulkner holds an MS in Physics from Clemson University and an MA and PhD in Astronomy from Indiana University and taught at the University of South Carolina Lancaster for over 26 years. He serves as editor of the Creation Research Society Quarterly and has published over 100 papers in various journals. He now works as a researcher, author, and speaker for Answers in Genesis. a credible Astronomer :

https://answersingenesis.org/astronomy/stars/what-will-happen-september-23-2017/

Its just a HOAX like the 2012 Doomsday Mayan calendar.

Examination of the Claims

First, there is nothing particularly unusual about the sun appearing in the constellation Virgo. As we orbit the sun each year, the sun appears to move through the 12 constellations of the zodiac, spending about a month in each one. The month that the sun appears in Virgo is around the time of the autumnal equinox, from mid-September through late October. Nor is it unusual to find the moon near the feet of Virgo. The moon takes 27 1/3 days to orbit the earth with respect to the stars. Therefore, for a day or two each month, the moon appears near the feet of Virgo. (I keep mentioning the feet of Virgo. Although I am very familiar with Virgo, I have never been able to see a woman in the sky there, so I can hardly pick out what is supposed to be her feet, and I seriously doubt anyone else can either.) Therefore, for a day or two each September or October, the sun appears in Virgo with the moon at her feet, so this is not that remarkable.

It was more than 15 years ago that I first heard the suggestion that this annual event might be a fulfillment of Revelation 12 in some particular year. Since then, interest in this idea has increased, with some people speculating or even predicting that “this is the year,” only to forget about it when nothing significant transpired before moving on to the next year’s occurrence. However, this year’s event has attracted much more attention than previously, so why is this year so different? One possibility is the addition of Jupiter to the mix. Some people claim that this year Jupiter will be near what is supposed to be the womb of Virgo, so it represents the child that the woman is about to give birth to. Jupiter takes nearly 12 years to orbit the sun, so this is the period with which Jupiter moves through the zodiacal constellations, spending about a year in each one. In fact, I first saw Jupiter when it was close to Virgo in 1969—I have watched Jupiter pass through four complete orbits since. This means that Jupiter appears in the part of Virgo corresponding to her womb, along with the sun in Virgo and the moon at her feet for a day or two every 12 years or so. The last time this happened was in 2005, so why was that event not heralded for its prophetic significance? I suspect that it is because YouTube was very new then, having started in February of that year. This year, with the huge popularity of YouTube, it is much easier to propagate these ideas.

Another factor is the addition of the three naked-eye planets in Leo, above the head of Virgo. The videos promoting this supposed sign claim that the constellation Leo has nine stars, so the addition of these three “wandering stars” brings the total number of stars in Leo, above the head of Virgo, to 12, with the 12 stars forming the crown of the woman in the sky, according to Revelation 12:1. Except that Leo has more than nine stars. Where did the people touting this supposed fulfillment of prophecy get the idea that Leo has nine stars? Every presentation of the September 23 event that I have seen has used the popular Stellarium software package to illustrate the events of September 23. Sure enough, the lines connecting the stars of Leo into an outline of a lion include nine stars. However, even the Stellarium display shows other stars in Leo that are not connected by the lines. And different depictions of Leo connect different numbers of stars. For instance, the monthly star chart in the April 2017 issue of Sky and Telescope magazine (pp. 42–43) connects 13 stars with lines. The star chart at this website connects 10 stars. None of these charts connect a line to Omicron Leonis, the star that forms the front paws of Leo. When showing Leo to people, I always point out this star marking Leo’s paw. By the way, the Digistar-5 software in the Stargazers Planetarium at the Creation Museum connects 10 stars in Leo, including Omicron Leonis.

Since the claim that Leo has nine stars is false, the assertion that the addition of the three planets brings the total number of stars in Leo to 12 is false too. And how rare is this occurrence, to have these additional three planets in Leo at the same time that Jupiter is in Virgo? It isn’t that common, but it certainly has happened many times over the past 6,000 years, so the claim that this unusual event is so rare is false too. And how do we know that Jupiter must represent the child? There is no evidence for that either. Instead, this is a mere assertion that someone made, with many others repeating the claim. Based upon Revelation 12:5, most commentators think that the child was Jesus. Some promoters of this supposed sign claim that the Hebrews associated Jupiter with the Messiah. Again, this is a conjectural assertion not supported by any facts. These sorts of claims amount to Rorschach tests—people tend to see in them what they want to see.

Conclusion

So, what will happen on September 23, 2017? Probably nothing unusual.

I have identified several problems with the supposed sign of September 23, 2017. However, there are other, broader problems with it. One of the purposes that God ordained for the stars is for them to be signs (Genesis 1:14). However, to truly be a sign, shouldn’t such things be obvious, at least to a few people? Since the sun will be in Virgo at the time, virtually none of Virgo’s stars will be visible. The three planets in Leo will be visible in the early morning that day, but all will be low in the southeastern sky. Venus is very bright, so it will be relatively easy to spot; however, Mars and Mercury will not be, because they will be much fainter, and they won’t rise until about the time morning twilight begins. The thin crescent moon will be visible in the evening sky, low in the southwest. Jupiter may be visible lower in the southwest, though it will be difficult, since it will set before evening twilight ends. That is, not all of this “sign” will be visible, and those parts that will be visible won’t be visible at the same time. While this event may show up nicely on a computer screen, God set the lights in the “firmament of heaven” (not on computer screens) to be for signs.

 

danny-faulkner-products.jpg

HOAX.jpg

Edited by R. Hartono

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is one topic I never really have gotten. I know many watchers jumped all over Scottie Clarke and others who promoted this event and have made a big deal over it, but I have just never gotten it. 

Even if Rev 12 was discussing this even on 9/23/17.....so what?  How is that significant for us today? Nothing happens that day.....although I know many in that camp believed a rapture.......and subsequently had to do damage control and come up with another possible explanation of what it means, if anything. 

I just don’t get it......can someone please tell me why, if Rev 12 does reveal what we are told happened, why is this significant for us today?  It’s been almost two years and counting.....

  • Thumbs Up 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/13/2019 at 4:59 AM, Spock said:

This is one topic I never really have gotten. I know many watchers jumped all over Scottie Clarke and others who promoted this event and have made a big deal over it, but I have just never gotten it. 

Even if Rev 12 was discussing this even on 9/23/17.....so what?  How is that significant for us today? Nothing happens that day.....although I know many in that camp believed a rapture.......and subsequently had to do damage control and come up with another possible explanation of what it means, if anything. 

I just don’t get it......can someone please tell me why, if Rev 12 does reveal what we are told happened, why is this significant for us today?  It’s been almost two years and counting.....

The star alignment of Sept. 23rd. 2017 was preceded by a total eclipse across the entire USA a month prior.  Jesus stated there would be one sign, the sign of Jonah (which was also an eclipse), that we would be aware of.  So we had two signs.

These signs were to announce the marriage feast of the bride.   They were not about any kind of rapture event.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 hours ago, eileenhat said:

The star alignment of Sept. 23rd. 2017 was preceded by a total eclipse across the entire USA a month prior.  Jesus stated there would be one sign, the sign of Jonah (which was also an eclipse), that we would be aware of.  So we had two signs.

These signs were to announce the marriage feast of the bride.   They were not about any kind of rapture event.

Okay, let’s say they were to announce the marriage feast of the bride. That hasn’t happened yet....and it’s been two years.  What’s the point? I’m still missing the significance of 9/23/17.  It seems to me that date means nothing and the marriage feast is still in the future. 

By the way, I never read any interpretation like what you just said. I’m not trying to be mean here, but I think everyone who was promoting 9/23/17 as some important sign is now trying to fit some interpretation into it, with no apparent connection at all. 

Marriage feast?  How is that connected to 9/23/17? 

  • Thumbs Up 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Spock said:

Okay, let’s say they were to announce the marriage feast of the bride. That hasn’t happened yet....and it’s been two years.  What’s the point? I’m still missing the significance of 9/23/17.  It seems to me that date means nothing and the marriage feast is still in the future. 

By the way, I never read any interpretation like what you just said. I’m not trying to be mean here, but I think everyone who was promoting 9/23/17 as some important sign is now trying to fit some interpretation into it, with no apparent connection at all. 

Marriage feast?  How is that connected to 9/23/17? 

Well as you pointed out, there is much to discuss here.  I will simplify for various reasons, my explanation.

I am using a few passages from one article's end time timeline.  Note it leaves out the marriage feast, so I will add that in.  Note also it speaks of a rapture which is not in my timeline.

Quote one:

"7. The judgment of the nations. Christ will judge the survivors of the tribulation, separating the righteous from the wicked as “sheep” and “goats” (Matthew 25:31–46). (It is thought that at this time the Old Testament saints will be raised from the dead.) The righteous will enter the Millennial Kingdom; the wicked will be cast into hell."

Quote two:

"9. The Millennial Kingdom. Jesus Himself will rule the world, and Jerusalem will be the capital. This will be a 1,000-year period of peace and prosperity on earth (Revelation 20; Isaiah 60–62). Memorial sacrifices will be offered in a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem (Ezekiel 40–48)."

Source:  link here

So first there is a judgement of the 7 Churches as quote number one mentions.  Rev. 2 and 3 covers this topic well.  And then later the third temple rises with Jerusalem's involvement, per quote two.  

Technically, the marriage feast occurs then, with Jerusalem's involvement and the rising of the third temple (which is a spiritual temple this time).  In this case, Jerusalem is involved in the glory of the rising of the third temple (spiritually) as it represents the Hebrew covenant with God in this matter.

Summary:

Sept. 23rd, 2017 represented the time frame for this feast.  That means it is the day the Lord prepared in order to show us a sign in the Heavens to illustrate his work.

Note:  As this second article mentions toward the end, there is no date given for the marriage feast.  link here

It is therefore a mystery that must be revealed by God.

Conclusion

Lets review the passages about the marriage feast now.

"Revelation 19:6-9 Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)

Then I heard something that sounded like a large crowd of people. It was as loud as crashing waves or claps of thunder. The people were saying,

“Hallelujah!
    Our Lord God rules.
    He is the All-Powerful.
Let us rejoice and be happy
    and give God glory!
Give God glory, because the wedding of the Lamb has come.
    And the Lamb’s bride has made herself ready.
Fine linen was given to the bride for her to wear.
    The linen was bright and clean.”

(The fine linen means the good things that God’s holy people did.)

Then the angel said to me, “Write this: Great blessings belong to those who are invited to the wedding meal of the Lamb!” Then the angel said, “These are the true words of God.”

 

Here we read that a woman is Christ's bride.  As I have mentioned before in previous posts, this is an actual human being.  In fact the woman of Revelation 12.  Again, this is a mystery that God must reveal.  It isn't something God wanted revealed before it was time.  You can read more about her in Revelation 11 and Zechariah 5.  What you will learn is that there are two woman who sacrifice themselves for God and then they are the very first two humans to be resurrected from the dead, because really that is the entire show.  There is no rapture, but instead a first judgement of man's souls and then a full resurrection of the dead into their still living corpses, to put it bluntly.  It is only witnessed by them, hence they are called the two witnesses in Revelation 11.

It gets more complicated after that.  Trying to explain how souls get resurrected.  Who got judged and when in this timeline.  Why some were apostate and not others.  Why two women, why not one single dud.  Why not explain it in the bible.  That is where it gets complicated and you just have to know because God revealed it.  He plays his cards close to the chest in this matter, is why, so satan doesn't know.  

I will say why there is two people involved.  Zechariah 5 reveals God's strategy.  You probably won't understand it though.  But the information is there.  But to continue, one can't resurrect back into one's own body once dead.  The soul has to travel to the next abode which means a 2nd witness was needed.  Two people means two resurrections.  And just to leave you shaking your head, time doesn't matter in heaven.  They don't even have to be alive at the exact same time.  They can be anyone from anytime, except the condition one be around right now due to the star virgin alignment.  Which tells you that God planned all of this once he sent Adam to earth.  The end times and everything.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

NO, it's a vision of the events recorded im Matthews chapter 2.

 

PICJAG.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, eileenhat said:

Well as you pointed out, there is much to discuss here.  I will simplify for various reasons, my explanation.

I am using a few passages from one article's end time timeline.  Note it leaves out the marriage feast, so I will add that in.  Note also it speaks of a rapture which is not in my timeline.

Quote one:

"7. The judgment of the nations. Christ will judge the survivors of the tribulation, separating the righteous from the wicked as “sheep” and “goats” (Matthew 25:31–46). (It is thought that at this time the Old Testament saints will be raised from the dead.) The righteous will enter the Millennial Kingdom; the wicked will be cast into hell."

Quote two:

"9. The Millennial Kingdom. Jesus Himself will rule the world, and Jerusalem will be the capital. This will be a 1,000-year period of peace and prosperity on earth (Revelation 20; Isaiah 60–62). Memorial sacrifices will be offered in a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem (Ezekiel 40–48)."

Source:  link here

So first there is a judgement of the 7 Churches as quote number one mentions.  Rev. 2 and 3 covers this topic well.  And then later the third temple rises with Jerusalem's involvement, per quote two.  

Technically, the marriage feast occurs then, with Jerusalem's involvement and the rising of the third temple (which is a spiritual temple this time).  In this case, Jerusalem is involved in the glory of the rising of the third temple (spiritually) as it represents the Hebrew covenant with God in this matter.

Summary:

Sept. 23rd, 2017 represented the time frame for this feast.  That means it is the day the Lord prepared in order to show us a sign in the Heavens to illustrate his work.

Note:  As this second article mentions toward the end, there is no date given for the marriage feast.  link here

It is therefore a mystery that must be revealed by God.

Conclusion

Lets review the passages about the marriage feast now.

"Revelation 19:6-9 Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)

Then I heard something that sounded like a large crowd of people. It was as loud as crashing waves or claps of thunder. The people were saying,

“Hallelujah!
    Our Lord God rules.
    He is the All-Powerful.
Let us rejoice and be happy
    and give God glory!
Give God glory, because the wedding of the Lamb has come.
    And the Lamb’s bride has made herself ready.
Fine linen was given to the bride for her to wear.
    The linen was bright and clean.”

(The fine linen means the good things that God’s holy people did.)

Then the angel said to me, “Write this: Great blessings belong to those who are invited to the wedding meal of the Lamb!” Then the angel said, “These are the true words of God.”

 

Here we read that a woman is Christ's bride.  As I have mentioned before in previous posts, this is an actual human being.  In fact the woman of Revelation 12.  Again, this is a mystery that God must reveal.  It isn't something God wanted revealed before it was time.  You can read more about her in Revelation 11 and Zechariah 5.  What you will learn is that there are two woman who sacrifice themselves for God and then they are the very first two humans to be resurrected from the dead, because really that is the entire show.  There is no rapture, but instead a first judgement of man's souls and then a full resurrection of the dead into their still living corpses, to put it bluntly.  It is only witnessed by them, hence they are called the two witnesses in Revelation 11.

It gets more complicated after that.  Trying to explain how souls get resurrected.  Who got judged and when in this timeline.  Why some were apostate and not others.  Why two women, why not one single dud.  Why not explain it in the bible.  That is where it gets complicated and you just have to know because God revealed it.  He plays his cards close to the chest in this matter, is why, so satan doesn't know.  

I will say why there is two people involved.  Zechariah 5 reveals God's strategy.  You probably won't understand it though.  But the information is there.  But to continue, one can't resurrect back into one's own body once dead.  The soul has to travel to the next abode which means a 2nd witness was needed.  Two people means two resurrections.  And just to leave you shaking your head, time doesn't matter in heaven.  They don't even have to be alive at the exact same time.  They can be anyone from anytime, except the condition one be around right now due to the star virgin alignment.  Which tells you that God planned all of this once he sent Adam to earth.  The end times and everything.

 

You are right about one thing......I won’t understand what you just said, especially the last section. I will come back and try again after I drink my daily gin and tonic ( for medicinal purposes, so put your rocks down). 

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/13/2019 at 6:59 AM, Spock said:

This is one topic I never really have gotten. I know many watchers jumped all over Scottie Clarke and others who promoted this event and have made a big deal over it, but I have just never gotten it. 

Even if Rev 12 was discussing this even on 9/23/17.....so what?  How is that significant for us today? Nothing happens that day.....although I know many in that camp believed a rapture.......and subsequently had to do damage control and come up with another possible explanation of what it means, if anything. 

I just don’t get it......can someone please tell me why, if Rev 12 does reveal what we are told happened, why is this significant for us today?  It’s been almost two years and counting.....

what is the chapter all about...…       War in heaven and Satan and his brood kicked out and confined to planet earth within the 4th dimension...   and things that would happen after this.

We didn't see anything happen on earth that was outstanding, but we don't know what happened in heaven....   my guess is that if that was the Rev thing, the war in heaven started.    Just a milestone marker in the history of planet earth....    

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...