The fulness of the Gentiles

[The Light]

15 minutes ago, dhchristian said:

 I clearly distinguished between the fulness of time as found in Gal. 4;4, which points the first advent and the fulness of times as found in Eph 1:10 which points to the end times, and the second advent. 

When You first commented here, you said the time of the gentiles is not the same as the fulness of times, Now you say fulness of time is not the same as the fulness of times. As you can see your criticism makes no sense whatsoever.

The Only time I quoted Gal. 4;4 I used it as an example of what the fulness of times means, My Point being: "The fulness of times is thus an expression for the end of a dispensation,"  Because in the verse Gal 4:4, it was speaking of the first advent of Christ, and the end of that dispensation.

I Honestly do not know why I am even bothering to answer you if you have no basic modicum of comprehension. It is almost as if you are just disagreeing for the sake of disagreeing as there is no logic to your responses. Israel reached the fulness of time, and the messiah came, and they received him not. The church will reach the fulness of times, and the Lord will Gather them together, Provided they are ready for His coming... IMO they are not, for they are still children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; (Eph 4;14) As you are doing here.

So what then? If the church is not ready? 

I Have nothing to sell you besides the cross, Will you purchase one and carry it with you?  

 

Ok. Modicum takes it.

 

 

[Gentle-Warrior]

37 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

Don't be silly!  We are talking about the truth of God making changes on  the order of things when - for example - the law was given, and how things changed again when Jesus was born. Then again when He rose from the dead. These things are the truth of God's word, and anyone honest with themselves know this. Maybe you don't like the name attached to these changes of order. That is OK. We all know these changes happened.

Thanks for bringing up Ephesians - for that passage proves a change in the order of things:

¹⁵ Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

Note that at one time THE LAW was the proper order of things; but no that law was abolished in the death of Christ.

Are there people on earth today that were born of Jewish (or Hebrew) mothers - people that CALL themselves descendants of Jacob? You know there are.  THANK GOD you are not God - for you would give them no hope whatsoever! However, God and you are different: when God makes a promise, it is forever. God made promises to them and in the end, many of them will be saved - but NOT through "the church" which they deny. You would write them off; God will not. He has already planned on how to save them.

Covenants is all over the bible. Yes, agreed: and many times a new covenant changes the order of things.  That is what many people call a dispensation.

Before Christ there was the old covenant. After Christ the new covenant came by the shedding of Christ's blood. Very simple indeed, so why complicate matters with men's inventions? 

[The Light]

7 hours ago, Gentle-Warrior said:

Before Christ there was the old covenant. After Christ the new covenant came by the shedding of Christ's blood. Very simple indeed, so why complicate matters with men's inventions? 

Rom 11

 ²⁵ For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

We know many scriptures that tell us that God will turn His face towards Israel after He has dealt with the Gentile.

However, there is a group of people that had no faith that God could and would keep His word to Israel as there was no Israel. Therefore they are the ones that had a man made invention that the Church was Israel.

Once God re-established Israel as a nation, they continued in their folly despite absolute proof that Israel was reborn.

God will keep His promise to His people. Period.

[Justin Adams]

24 minutes ago, The Light said:

However, there is a group of people that had no faith that God could and would keep His word to Israel as there was no Israel. Therefore they are the ones that had a man made invention that the Church was Israel.

Yes this is pathetic. Even Spurgeon got this wrong and many theologians down thru the ages that show a positive hatred of Israel.

If you look at a good translation of Psalm 82 and, Deut 32 (the scattering) you will also find many scriptures that promise a return and regathering of the nations and the new Israel as the apostle says includes Israel (regathering of the ten) and the regathering of the nations scattered at Babel due to their sins. This is why Pentecost is so important and shows God's methods are not always ours or plainkly observable. It is a HAPPENING thing today...

All Israel will be saved - non Israelis and Israelis alike because all believers are 'the seed of Abraham'.

[Gentle-Warrior]

2 hours ago, The Light said:

Rom 11

 ²⁵ For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

We know many scriptures that tell us that God will turn His face towards Israel after He has dealt with the Gentile.

However, there is a group of people that had no faith that God could and would keep His word to Israel as there was no Israel. Therefore they are the ones that had a man made invention that the Church was Israel.

Once God re-established Israel as a nation, they continued in their folly despite absolute proof that Israel was reborn.

God will keep His promise to His people. Period.

God KEPT His promise to Israel: Jesus Christ was and will always be the PROMISE. PERIOD. 

The election of the Jews as God’s people was designed to reverse the impact of Adam’s sin, and most Jews believed that the law’s role was to restrain the sin that Adam introduced into the world. By contrast, Paul maintains that God’s intention in giving the law was to increase sin, and to increase it particularly in Israel.

The piling up of sin in Israel via the law does not indicate malevolence in God toward his people. It shows that the problem introduced into the world through Adam is not remedied through the law. These verses anticipate Rom. 9–11. Sin reached its climax in Israel so that God’s grace would be discerned more clearly in his mercy both to Gentiles and to Israel. The end of the story, therefore, is not the triumph of sin. The story ends with the victory accomplished by grace, a grace that fulfills God’s righteousness and promises through the last Adam, Jesus the Messiah.

If you think God made a promise outside of Jesus Christ to Israel, you are waiting in vain.  

Edited September 4, 2019 by Gentle-Warrior

[iamlamad]

10 hours ago, Gentle-Warrior said:

Before Christ there was the old covenant. After Christ the new covenant came by the shedding of Christ's blood. Very simple indeed, so why complicate matters with men's inventions? 

People like to place titles on things. Live with it! But don't knock the truth of the word of God!

[Gentle-Warrior]

Just now, iamlamad said:

People like to place titles on things. Live with it! But don't knock the truth of the word of God!

The ULTIMATE TRUTH of God's word is JESUS CHRIST. He is the truth and the one who joins both old covenant people with the new covenant people in Himself 

Ephesians 2:11–16 (NET)

^{11 "}Therefore remember that formerly you, the Gentiles in the flesh—who are called “uncircumcision” by the so-called “circumcision” that is performed on the body by human hands—

¹² that you were at that time without the Messiah, alienated from the citizenship of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

¹³ But now in Christ Jesus you who used to be far away have been brought near by the blood of Christ.

¹⁴ For he is our peace, the one who made both groups into one and who destroyed the middle wall of partition, the hostility,

¹⁵ when he nullified in his flesh the law of commandments in decrees. He did this to create in himself one new man out of two, thus making peace,

^{16 a}nd to reconcile them both in one body to God through the cross, by which the hostility has been killed."

This is the truth of God's word! 

[BeauJangles]

  

Okay, everyone pull over - Internet Etiquette Police. Name, license, registration, proof of insurance, place of employment, bank account number, credit and/or debit card PIN code, IP address and password, please. 

[iamlamad]

6 hours ago, Gentle-Warrior said:

The ULTIMATE TRUTH of God's word is JESUS CHRIST. He is the truth and the one who joins both old covenant people with the new covenant people in Himself 

Ephesians 2:11–16 (NET)

^{11 "}Therefore remember that formerly you, the Gentiles in the flesh—who are called “uncircumcision” by the so-called “circumcision” that is performed on the body by human hands—

¹² that you were at that time without the Messiah, alienated from the citizenship of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

¹³ But now in Christ Jesus you who used to be far away have been brought near by the blood of Christ.

¹⁴ For he is our peace, the one who made both groups into one and who destroyed the middle wall of partition, the hostility,

¹⁵ when he nullified in his flesh the law of commandments in decrees. He did this to create in himself one new man out of two, thus making peace,

^{16 a}nd to reconcile them both in one body to God through the cross, by which the hostility has been killed."

This is the truth of God's word! 

Yes, this is one truth of the word of God. But to tell you the truth, it is just one more proof of what you are arguing against: dispensations - or times of different ordering of things. Notice "he nullified in his flesh the law of commandments..." When Christ came, it was a new order of things: it was for the first time ever:  "God with us - Immanuel!"

 

You pointed out great scriptures.  Good post.

Edited September 4, 2019 by iamlamad

[iamlamad]

6 hours ago, BeauJangles said:

  

Okay, everyone pull over - Internet Etiquette Police. Name, license, registration, proof of insurance, place of employment, bank account number, credit and/or debit card PIN code, IP address and password, please. 

I wish I had one of those rolling on the floor emojis!