Justin Adams Posted September 19, 2019 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 26 Topic Count: 61 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 9,604 Content Per Day: 3.98 Reputation: 7,795 Days Won: 21 Joined: 09/11/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 19, 2019 24 minutes ago, Sister said: or where you speaking of man? In Hebrew, all spirit beings are elohim. Can be singular or plural. EL or haShem (the Name is God most High) In some cases the english rendering is anything but clear. The Angel of the lord might be The Second Yahweh figure = 'Do what He says for My Name (haShem) is in Him'. Angel is sort of interchangeable with elohim (small 'e') but often 'one like the son of man' is referring to the second Yahweh figure AKA, Daniel, Ezekiel, the exodus etc. An 'angel' may be just a ministering spirit with a message, or it may be God Himself in human form like the Word in Jeremiah 1, "The Word touched my lips.." If you read a better translation like ESV or EXB and go to Psalm 82 or Deut 32 (and others) you will probably see 'sons of God'. These are spirits in the throne room of the High Divine Council. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Adams Posted September 19, 2019 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 26 Topic Count: 61 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 9,604 Content Per Day: 3.98 Reputation: 7,795 Days Won: 21 Joined: 09/11/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 19, 2019 33 minutes ago, Sister said: We get the jist however that that God created heavenly creatures for the heavenly realm (angels) and man for the earth. This is not really the case, but we have been taught Augustine theology and it seeps into our doctrine. God's idea is for a blended family. We as humans elevated to divine status will reign with Christ and His other (obedient) Spirits. We will not be confined just as the Lord will not be confined. Yahweh's problem has been that if He fully presents Himself to man, then we die. So the Second Yahweh, the son or the ONLY UNIQUE ONE has come to us for our sakes in more ways than one. When we see Him Face to Face it will be different and we will shed our human limitations and restrictions. The whole creation was made for God's Created Beings. Eden back on Earth will attest to this fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alive Posted September 24, 2019 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 22 Topic Count: 194 Topics Per Day: 0.12 Content Count: 11,053 Content Per Day: 6.58 Reputation: 9,010 Days Won: 36 Joined: 09/12/2019 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/09/1956 Share Posted September 24, 2019 On 9/13/2019 at 11:31 AM, Justin Adams said: It is a really tricky issue. Yeshua is God. The One by Whom Creation was constructed. He 'learned' obedience by suffering. That much I kinda get. Sort-of. The Spirit that was in Christ is really Holy Spirit if we look at the Tanach and the apostles writings. He knew who He was and had no identity issues. Not like we do. He knew what was going to happen and that is why He sweat blood in anguish. He must have had some recollection of the Glory He left behind and His frequent prayer times was due to His prior closeness (One-ness) to the Father in their Heavenly Godhead. That is understood (sort of). But we are different. All created beings are different. They are autonomous in their own right. So my question is really, does something change us so radically when we have our 'better bodies' (and presumably better minds)? Are we actually changed in the way we see things and relate to things, without as you mention, losing our free will. Personally, I have faced so much in my life, that if God appeared to me and said 'wanna be MY zombie?' I might jump at the idea. (Probably not, but there is that lingering thought - can I trust myself NOT to screw up again). So, since you imply that the millenium is a 'second test' I wondered about that question. That is why the 1k years seems odd and the temple and sacrifice. Surely they are not allegories or metaphorical? And why two battles and not just one to finish it all for good? These are my thoughts sometimes. Just a couple more thoughts on what seems the core of the topic. I think the scriptures are clear on the two wars. One before the 1000 years and one after that precedes the final judgement and the 'New Heaven and New Earth'. As far as it being a literal 1000 earth years, who knows--but it fits the 8th day notion as being a type of a 'New Day', that I have long held to. We don't know for sure. As someone mentioned, there remains guess work. :-) Genesis tells us a great deal...its almost as though Genesis is the template/type of everything to follow as regards God's 'eternal purpose'. That gets me to the second point and one I admit is very dear to my heart. I could even say my 'pet doctrine'. So it is in this light that I see the solution to the second point. I believe that God's 'eternal purpose' was to reproduce. I have written of this in another thread. I could easily digress, but I will try to get to the point. When we have changed and are given our new incorruptible bodies and we shall be 'like Him' for we shall see him as He is--at that point we are fully realized 'sons of God'--fully divine offspring. And just to make a point on this. My son Jacob Paul was born of the union of his mother and myself. This is the great mystery that teaches us. There is nothing in Jacob that is not his mom and myself. He is ‘fully’ his mom and dad. Nothing else is introduced there. In that sense, he is complete and perfect…unadulterated. His personality as it develops is set aside for now--I believe there is something to learn there as well, but for now I am talking about reproduction 'of kind'. everything after its own kind. Genesis. So, I believe that we will be quite literally ‘sons of God’—what He ‘I am’ has been after all along. The many spoken of —“the First of many brethren”. Again—to be brief…I do not believe it will be possible for us to sin at that point. Not because of a lack of free will, but because of our ’Nature’. Just as a bear can’t fly and a gold fish can’t climb a tree…we will not go contrary to God—who is our Nature any more than God can go against Himself, who is perfect and unchanging. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Adams Posted September 24, 2019 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 26 Topic Count: 61 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 9,604 Content Per Day: 3.98 Reputation: 7,795 Days Won: 21 Joined: 09/11/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 24, 2019 26 minutes ago, Alive said: Just as a bear can’t fly and a gold fish can’t climb a tree…we will not go contrary to God—who is our Nature any more than God can go against Himself, who is perfect and unchanging. Good thoughts. Thanks. I am fairly sure that we will be 'as the heavenly beings' also, and even higher than them. So it is quite a thought that being a son of God, ruling and reigning with Yeshua and the heavenly host that are obedient will be interesting. I see that from Genesis that Eden was there as a template for Adam to spread throughout earth. Unfortunately that was put on hold. But eventually, we will dwell in Eden, the Mountain of our God - as in the beginning. 'As on earth, so in heaven' will have a multiplicity of realities that currently we can not really grasp well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Hartono Posted October 1, 2019 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 770 Topics Per Day: 0.34 Content Count: 6,929 Content Per Day: 3.07 Reputation: 1,979 Days Won: 1 Joined: 02/15/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted October 1, 2019 On 9/12/2019 at 4:45 PM, Justin Adams said: Ezekiel 38:8, 11-12 (HCSB) — 8 After a long time you will be summoned. Revelation 20:7-9 (HCSB) — 7 When the 1,000 years are completed, Revelation 19:17-21 (HCSB) — 17 ...an angel ... cried out in a loud voice, saying to all the birds flying high overhead, “Come, gather together for the great supper of God, 18 so that you may eat the flesh of kings, the flesh of commanders, the flesh of mighty men, the flesh of horses and of their riders, That speaks about 3 wars Ezekiel 38 : Be4 the Great Tribulation, nations try to wipe off Israel from the map. The church and Holy Spirit must be removed first be4 God comes to defeat them. Rev 19 : 17 : Be4 Jesus Millennium starts, Lord Jesus will descend with all raptured saints from heaven to battle at Armageddon and then to land on Zion Rev 20: 7 : After the 1000 expires the devil will b released to deceive nations again and they will be deceived and follow the devil to attack Lord Jesus in Jerusalem, to try to kill Him and replace Him with the devil to rule the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Adams Posted October 1, 2019 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 26 Topic Count: 61 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 9,604 Content Per Day: 3.98 Reputation: 7,795 Days Won: 21 Joined: 09/11/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted October 1, 2019 3 hours ago, R. Hartono said: That speaks about 3 wars Ezekiel 38 : Be4 the Great Tribulation, nations try to wipe off Israel from the map. The church and Holy Spirit must be removed first be4 God comes to defeat them. Rev 19 : 17 : Be4 Jesus Millennium starts, Lord Jesus will descend with all raptured saints from heaven to battle at Armageddon and then to land on Zion Rev 20: 7 : After the 1000 expires the devil will b released to deceive nations again and they will be deceived and follow the devil to attack Lord Jesus in Jerusalem, to try to kill Him and replace Him with the devil to rule the world. Thanks for the reply. You might be correct. Look at it differently for a while. Say you were covering the WWII war in the pacific. You sent in your material on Iwo Jima. At the same time a guy might be covering the Battle of Britain. Then another the battle for Stalingrad. And so on. So they all send in their info and it gets published - BUT it is the same war on different fronts. So who is to know these prophesies were not inter related visions of the same general conflict - from differing perspectives. Certainly Revelation seems to repeat stuff and it is like a circular set of circumstances. Only later do we find the historical relationships of all these WWII battles. One huge conflict fought on different fronts with different battlefields. But the same general war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Hartono Posted October 1, 2019 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 770 Topics Per Day: 0.34 Content Count: 6,929 Content Per Day: 3.07 Reputation: 1,979 Days Won: 1 Joined: 02/15/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted October 1, 2019 31 minutes ago, Justin Adams said: Say you were covering the WWII war in the pacific. You sent in your material on Iwo Jima. At the same time a guy might be covering the Battle of Britain. Then another the battle for Stalingrad. And so on. That happened at the same time period 1940-1945. The 3 wars is at different times and for has its own purpose. The 1st Gog n Magog war shall happen be4 the Great Tribulation, antichrist shall take credit from the war for himself, he shall appear to make the 7 years peace covenant between Israel and invaders, Arabs will allow the 3rd Temple to be rebuilt as the part of the old city of Jerusalem will be internationalized and because they are shocked and embarassed to hv suffered great loss at the battle. The Armageddon battle will happen after 7 years of the great tribulation, where it will be decided at the battleground who will own and rule this world. Jesus w/ saints against antichrist/false prophet commanding all armies of the world. The final Gog n Magog war will happen after 1000 years is expired, nations are given the most beautiful and plentiful world we can never imagine now yet at that time God must use the devil again to test their hearts, who will obey and who will rebell. As did God let the devil roam in Eden to test Adam n Eve in the garden. God use all for His Mighty Purpose. Before this painstaking and horrible civilization can be closed forever with the White Throne Judgment, and God will create a new heaven n a new earth and dwell with man in the Glorious New Jerusalem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Adams Posted October 1, 2019 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 26 Topic Count: 61 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 9,604 Content Per Day: 3.98 Reputation: 7,795 Days Won: 21 Joined: 09/11/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted October 1, 2019 Japan and China were in conflict from 1937 onward. Japan invaded Manturia in 1931. For the Axis Powers it is generally considered to be 1939 - 1945. If you have to read Revelation literally in sequence, then a number of issues are apparent that do not make consecutive sense. Getting hung up on the Millennium also presents issues as well. Please read the following and give me your thoughts. (I'm not saying this is my view) http://www.1000yearmillennium.com/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alive Posted October 1, 2019 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 22 Topic Count: 194 Topics Per Day: 0.12 Content Count: 11,053 Content Per Day: 6.58 Reputation: 9,010 Days Won: 36 Joined: 09/12/2019 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/09/1956 Share Posted October 1, 2019 On 9/24/2019 at 9:23 AM, Justin Adams said: Good thoughts. Thanks. I am fairly sure that we will be 'as the heavenly beings' also, and even higher than them. So it is quite a thought that being a son of God, ruling and reigning with Yeshua and the heavenly host that are obedient will be interesting. I see that from Genesis that Eden was there as a template for Adam to spread throughout earth. Unfortunately that was put on hold. But eventually, we will dwell in Eden, the Mountain of our God - as in the beginning. 'As on earth, so in heaven' will have a multiplicity of realities that currently we can not really grasp well. There is no life higher than 'God'. That is plain. Everything else was created. His Life is not. He is the 'I am'. Before anything was, He is. There is no denying this...again, this is the point. His eternal purpose. His ultimate goal. To reproduce and to share His very being with the Universe He created. If we accept these things as true, then the implications are clear. This doesn't mean that we now see fully. But not yet seeing fully, can't negate the core truth. When that day comes and we no longer see through a dark glass, this core truth will flesh out. No pun intended. All doctrine must fit into core truths. This is the great key to understanding scripture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alive Posted October 1, 2019 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 22 Topic Count: 194 Topics Per Day: 0.12 Content Count: 11,053 Content Per Day: 6.58 Reputation: 9,010 Days Won: 36 Joined: 09/12/2019 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/09/1956 Share Posted October 1, 2019 2 hours ago, Justin Adams said: Japan and China were in conflict from 1937 onward. Japan invaded Manturia in 1931. For the Axis Powers it is generally considered to be 1939 - 1945. If you have to read Revelation literally in sequence, then a number of issues are apparent that do not make consecutive sense. Getting hung up on the Millennium also presents issues as well. Please read the following and give me your thoughts. (I'm not saying this is my view) http://www.1000yearmillennium.com/index.html Justin---that is quite a construct he has accomplished. I read several of his other articles as well. I have problems with it. I could be wrong, but he seems to be a purveyor of 'fear'. As far as his picture of the 1000 years? He has made what I see as assumptions in key areas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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