The Seven Heads of Daniel 7 and Rev. 17

[iamlamad]

10 hours ago, breathoflife said:

&0 Weeks of Years has been decreed for Daniel's people and Daniel's city. If you are going to claim this last, 70th Week, it must have as it focus Daniel's people and city. Rome won't fit, Arabs don't fit nothing but Daniel's people and city fulfills the prophecy. All one has to do to prove otherwise is show where Scripture changed that ending to Gentiles and a Gentile city. Prophecy after prophecy shows the condition of apostate Israel in that day and still excuses for others fulfilling this are suggested. Also why is the underpinnings of others having wrong motives for their belief while extolling the high moral fiber of our own beliefs. From

De. 32 As a witness against them. Shown taking anti-Christ

Isaiah 1-5 apostate Israel on the day of the Lord.

Jeremiah 1-12 apostate Israel

Ez. to many chapters One of the worst books for anyone trying to claim Gentile entities in the Last Days replacing apostate Israel.

Ez. 23 the Mother of Harlots There is no other mother of harlots. 

The list goes on and on Joel, Amos, etc. all showing apostate Israel as the central figure of those last days. There are so many prophetic teachings concerning Israel and the Last Days that even if Daniel had not said Daniel's city and people we should have been drawn to all the Last Day prophecies that reveal her over and over again. Prophecies like "virgin Israel will never rise again." Has Israel risen again? well then this destruction being spoken of here must not have been the one spoken of here. 

How do you take the Song of Moses that is to be a witness against them in De. 32 that shows them rejecting "The Rock" Jesus Christ for another small "r" rock who is anti-Christ. Knowing that this prophecy clearly shows apostate Israel taking for herself anti-Christ. Yet we come to the prophecies in Isaiah 1-5 that shows her on the day of the Lord as being so apostate she cannot get any more apostate. She wreaks of false gods, riches, power all things she had to amass when anti-Christ had been there. When no one may buy our sell. This mystery Babylon was not in full apostasy she became like that. Yet its apostate Israel referred to as the faithful city who has become the harlot. Where is any Gentile entity shown committing spiritual harlotry? Just a few thoughts on why she cannot be Gentile

OF COURSE Israel is the focus! the 70th week is for Daniel's people. No question. But does that mean God won't use Gentiles to attack Israel as in the past?

[breathoflife]

Yes because anti-christ comes out of the Bottomless Pit as king of the demonic army that comes up with the rest of the angels released at this time they have all been held prisoner for this time. These will be the army who follow their king. We are told when the Lord return He will destroy anti-Christ, false prophet and their satanic army with the splendor of His coming. No feast for the birds. All of these are thrown into lake of fire. Then Satan comes down in chains to be locked in the Bottomless Pit for a 1,000 years.

[breathoflife]

57 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

They will attack Israel and most certainly attack Jerusalem, and just when it looks hopeless, Jesus returns. The city is not 100% "taken" and Jews will flee the city in the new valley. The ten horns are the nations of the world that will join with the Beast for one hour  - the last hour -  to wipe Israel off the map. AT least, that is what they THINK they will be doing. OF COURSE "Babylon" can be Jerusalem. But it is "mystery" babylon: the city that deceives the entire world. The real physical city will be rebuilt, but "mystery" city will never bee seen again. Jerusalem will never, every again, be a city for the devil. The city will never again kill the prophets. All is says is they hate the whore and burn her with fire; it is not written that the city is totally destroyed. We all know that 1/3 of the Hebrews will make it through the fire - literally and figuratively. 

The Beast will arrive in Jerusalem as the man of sin just a few days before he will enter the temple and declare he is God. He never leaves except perhaps for war exploits. It is not long after the midpoint that the image and mark is created.

 Anti-christ is coming with the false prophet and the army of fallen angels anti-christ is king over as well as the angels held under the Euphrates. The city will never be rebuilt the Millennial Temple is so huge it would cover all of present day Jerusalem. I don’t know where the 1/3 figure comes from the 144,000 are numbered. The beast is coming as a counterfeit of the Christ. This is the great Delusion the Lord is sending on the world. From the false prophet who comes as Elijah preparing the way for Messiah to his bringing fire down from heaven this counterfeit could almost fool the elect

55 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

OF COURSE Israel is the focus! the 70th week is for Daniel's people. No question. But does that mean God won't use Gentiles to attack Israel as in the past?

 

[Revelation Man]

On 10/1/2019 at 9:05 AM, Dennis1209 said:

Why do you suppose words like; biblical 'exegesis', eschatology and hermeneutics were added to the American lexicon?

Who cares, I understand God, so I suppose like all words they have a stated meaning.  The Beast doesn't FIT the RCC and never has, I discounted that 25-30 years ago. It doesn't even get close to passing the smell test. TBH it kinda makes me wonder about people who can't see through it. Its something a juvenile Christian might have trouble with, but a Christian on MEAT should be way past that. JMHO.

Edited October 2, 2019 by Revelation Man

[Marilyn C]

5 hours ago, iamlamad said:

They will attack Israel and most certainly attack Jerusalem, and just when it looks hopeless, Jesus returns. The city is not 100% "taken" and Jews will flee the city in the new valley. The ten horns are the nations of the world that will join with the Beast for one hour  - the last hour -  to wipe Israel off the map. AT least, that is what they THINK they will be doing. OF COURSE "Babylon" can be Jerusalem. But it is "mystery" babylon: the city that deceives the entire world. The real physical city will be rebuilt, but "mystery" city will never bee seen again. Jerusalem will never, every again, be a city for the devil. The city will never again kill the prophets. All is says is they hate the whore and burn her with fire; it is not written that the city is totally destroyed. We all know that 1/3 of the Hebrews will make it through the fire - literally and figuratively. 

The Beast will arrive in Jerusalem as the man of sin just a few days before he will enter the temple and declare he is God. He never leaves except perhaps for war exploits. It is not long after the midpoint that the image and mark is created.

 

`Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and SHALL BE NO MORE AT ALL. (Rev. 18: 21)

[Diaste]

19 hours ago, Dennis1209 said:

I suppose it depends on your view? Constantine turned Rome into a church / state system, the state part wilted into obscurity, but the church part [RCC] continued on and thrives today. Last check, Catholicism is the world's largest religion with 1.6 billion followers, closely followed by Islam with 1.4 billion followers. That's close to half the globes population. 

Traditional scholarship has mostly maintained as you know, that the feet and toes represent European nations and there loose association. We can already see that with their borders, defense pacts, talk about a European Army and the Euro, etc., it's unstable with Brexit as an example. It seems to nicely fit scripture. I suspect it is even possible the ten toes could represent the 'ten' global economic zones the United Nations has divided the world into, and their leaders? It appears to me the U.N. is a key player in shaping up end time events with their "Agendas".

However and with that said; I've been reading and closely studying some modern scholarship, that like you said, places Islam as the legs, feet and toes. One leg representing Shia and the other Sunni, the two major branches loosely allied depending on the cause. They hate each other but they hate the Jews and true Christians even worse. I have to say, I've found no holes in their argument and it fits nicely also. 

I've always firmly believed the Bible was referring to European nations. With the advent of ecumenism and the Pope signing agreements with the Muslim's, and trying to bring all religion under one umbrella, back to the 'one true church', it's getting interesting. No doubt Islam is and will be playing a major role in end time events. I have changed some of my firm views to just watching the pieces fall into place and not be dogmatic with my interpretations. However the Lord accomplishes His will and the players involved; we definitely see the moving and shaking taking place in our very own lifetimes. 

Indeed. The case can be made for the 10 toes as reference to the 10 kings 'that have no kingdom' at the end of the age, but receive power with the beast. Then the 10 toes would have nothing to do with current political borders or regions and only come to power once the beast is revealed, or at the advent of the beast prior to Temple ascension.

I think the description of the 10 toes fits with Islam in the world today, 'mingle but not adhere'. This is what Islam does in every country. They mingle but set up enclaves and try to change laws going to the extreme touting Sharia Law and in so doing they 'do not adhere'.

There is of course much much more.

 

[iamlamad]

5 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

 

`Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and SHALL BE NO MORE AT ALL. (Rev. 18: 21)

Jerusalem as "Mystery Babylon"  - a city that deceives the whole world - will certainly never exist again. But the physical city of Jerusalem will be rebuilt and be the city Jesus rules with a rod of iron from.

[iamlamad]

4 hours ago, Diaste said:

Indeed. The case can be made for the 10 toes as reference to the 10 kings 'that have no kingdom' at the end of the age, but receive power with the beast. Then the 10 toes would have nothing to do with current political borders or regions and only come to power once the beast is revealed, or at the advent of the beast prior to Temple ascension.

I think the description of the 10 toes fits with Islam in the world today, 'mingle but not adhere'. This is what Islam does in every country. They mingle but set up enclaves and try to change laws going to the extreme touting Sharia Law and in so doing they 'do not adhere'.

There is of course much much more.

 

I agree: mingle but not adhere: they have no desire to become a part of any Western nation.  There was a 15 year old boy in Israel who died during an operation and went to heaven, then came back to his body. While in heaven, he saw the end of this age play out like on a huge tv screen. He saw world war 3 begin and apparently last until Armageddon. He saw and perhaps heard that the military of 70 nations came against Israel. (Ten toes just may represent all or completeness). He told the Rabbis questioning him that their IDF lasted only two days into this war. Then, when it looked like Israel would be no more, Messiah came! It was interesting what he said about the Messiah: "when you (Meaning the Jews and Hebrews) meet Him, you are going to say, "How could HE be the Messiah?"

It seemed, everything he told the Rabbis questioning him, they would pick up the Tanakh and show him verses about what he had just said - and they would ask him: "did you read this and are just making this up?"  He always answered the same: "no, I have never read the Tanakh: everything I am telling you I heard while in heaven."

[iamlamad]

8 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

Who cares, I understand God I suppose like all words they have a stated meaning.  The Beast doesn't FIT the RCC and never has, I discounted that 25-30 years ago. Iy doesn't even get close to passing the smell test. TBH it kinda makes me wonder about people who can't see through it. Its something a juvenile Christian might have trouble with, but a Christian on MEAT should be way past that. JMHO.

In this I agree with you, RM. When the Messiah returns, He is NOT going to come to the Vatican! He is going to come to JERUSALEM. And if the devil wanted to send a man to imitate the Messiah, OF COURSE he would send the man to Jerusalem! And that is exactly where the Beast of REvelation is going to reside.

[iamlamad]

10 hours ago, breathoflife said:

 Anti-christ is coming with the false prophet and the army of fallen angels anti-christ is king over as well as the angels held under the Euphrates. The city will never be rebuilt the Millennial Temple is so huge it would cover all of present day Jerusalem. I don’t know where the 1/3 figure comes from the 144,000 are numbered. The beast is coming as a counterfeit of the Christ. This is the great Delusion the Lord is sending on the world. From the false prophet who comes as Elijah preparing the way for Messiah to his bringing fire down from heaven this counterfeit could almost fool the elect

 

Zec. 13:8 And it shall come to pass in all the land,” Says the Lord, “That two-thirds in it shall be cut off and die, But one-third shall be left in it: 9 I will bring the one-third through the fire, Will refine them as silver is refined, And test them as gold is tested. They will call on My name, And I will answer them. I will say, ‘This is My people’; And each one will say, ‘The Lord is my God.’ ”

Where do you read that the Beast is going to come with "the army of fallen angels?" That sounds like myth. I think the angels reserved under the Euphrates will be God's angels, and the 200 million army will be God's heavenly army.  The 1/3 have nothing to do with the 144,000, who are firstfruits and caught up to heaven before the Beast is revealed. The 1/3 go through it all and survive.

Wrong again, the REAL Elijah will come with Enoch as one of the two witnesses.