My Church Practices Heresy

[JustPassingThru]

Friend, ...it seems Father has revealed to you the Truth that maybe no one else sees, or just a select few, ...on this planet there are religious organizations and then there is the True "Church" of the Lord Jesus Christ:

As for the mystery of the seven stars that you saw in my right hand, and the seven golden lampstands, the seven stars are the angels (pastors) of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches.  Rev 1:20

Remember, man can "ordain" another man to be a "pastor" in one of these organization, ...but only the Holy Spirit can "anoint" a man of "Jesus'" choosing to give him the ministry of pastor-teacher:

And He (Jesus) gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors-teachers;  Eph 4:11

I found myself in the same situation about 30 years ago, ...may I humbly suggest you try what I did, after talking to the pastor without any satisfaction, ...I prayed and asked Father to place me in one of the True local bodies that was a part of the Church of the Lord Jesus Christ, ...and He did, ...on reflecting back, ...I'm so thankful for what He has done for me, ...I have grown tremendously in the Grace and the Knowledge of my Lord Jesus Christ, ...He has taught me the Truth of His Word, ...when I look in the mirror I don't walk away and forget what I see, ...I'm amazed, shocked, and thankful, it's not the same man that I saw 30 years ago, ...I find I'm being conformed into the image of my blessed Lord, ...Jesus Christ, ...He has allowed me to observe His Holy Spirit at work, and, ...He has even allow me to participate with Him in that work (imagine working side by side with the Holy Spirit, I know it's unimaginable, but it happens), ...He has allowed and given me the opportunity to use the "talents" He has given me to build up treasure in Heaven, ...opportunities and experiences that I would of missed if I had stayed in the "other" church organization.

All Praise, Glory, Honor, Dominion and Power goes to my Lord, my Creator, my Master, my King, .the Lord Jesus Christ!

Lord bless

[lovethelord]

Hi Samuelg1,

I also encourage you to speak to your Pastor. If you don't say anything, who will? He is leading many people astray and portraying the wrong message that is affecting eternal lives. In faith, courage and righteousness you can make all the difference there.  

8 hours ago, samuelg1 said:

People can be very, very stupid, gullible and seem largely indifferent to hypocrisy and immorality, even within church!!!

I don't think it's as simple as this. Many people are simply trusting that their Pastor knows what is best as leader of the church and probably not as mature in their Bible reading to know what God tells us.  

•  Peter 5:1-3, "So I exhort the elders among you, as a fellow elder and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, as well as a partaker in the glory that is going to be revealed: shepherd the flock of God that is among you, exercising oversight, not under compulsion, but willingly, as God would have you; not for shameful gain, but eagerly; not domineering over those in your charge, but being examples to the flock"

[samuelg1]

Yes, I believe communication in writing will work better.

I'm not that thrilled about my options in the local area, quite frankly. Maybe it means traveling out of town to find a better church. I'm not obligated to attend this particular church. Thank you all. 

[BeauJangles]

On 12/4/2019 at 1:48 PM, samuelg1 said:

I have/had a plan b, which was to attend an evening service with a different church. This church has a far less aggressive approach with regards to fundraising, but then again, they are a significantly smaller church which cannot offer as much to the community. It saddens me that a church which steps outside of doctrine has so much more worldly success than others. 

A wise choice, Samuel. Go, and remain with plan b. I think you'll be blessed, and regain your needed peace of mind. Sounds like you are happier there, and the Lord wants you to be joyful again. 

[BeauJangles]

On 12/4/2019 at 1:48 PM, samuelg1 said:

I have/had a plan b, which was to attend an evening service with a different church. This church has a far less aggressive approach with regards to fundraising, but then again, they are a significantly smaller church which cannot offer as much to the community. It saddens me that a church which steps outside of doctrine has so much more worldly success than others. 

Hi @Margo1945, 

This is actually Samuel's quote and not mine. It's okay, dear. We've all made that common mistake. I still gave you the "Well Said!" reaction though, because I thought it was. God bless! 

Shalom, 

David/BeauJangles 

Edited December 6, 2019 by BeauJangles

[Coliseum]

Of the Seven Churches Jesus speaks of in Revelation, Thyatira was perhaps the worst of them, yet Jesus never tells a single person in any of them to leave. Here is what He did say:

Revelation 2:20-25 (NIV)
²⁰  Nevertheless, I have this against you: You tolerate that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess. By her teaching she misleads my servants into sexual immorality and the eating of food sacrificed to idols.
²¹  I have given her time to repent of her immorality, but she is unwilling.
²²  So I will cast her on a bed of suffering, and I will make those who commit adultery with her suffer intensely, unless they repent of her ways.
²³  I will strike her children dead. Then all the churches will know that I am he who searches hearts and minds, and I will repay each of you according to your deeds.
²⁴  Now I say to the rest of you in Thyatira, to you who do not hold to her teaching and have not learned Satan's so-called deep secrets (I will not impose any other burden on you):
²⁵  Only hold on to what you have until I come.  

Jesus is telling those who remain to continue doing what is right. Certainly tell your pastor what you are observing; he deserves the chance to be confronted. James 5:20 says this: 

James 5:20 (NIV)
20  remember this: Whoever turns a sinner from the error of his way will save him from death and cover over a multitude of sins.

Our first hope is not to destroy, but to restore if at all possible.

[samuelg1]

I'm not even sure if I need to do anything, at least not urgently. The pastor has been absent for approximately two months now. I don't know exactly what's going on, but very shortly after delivering his heretical messages, he is now suddenly missing from all church proceedings. 

It's an interesting church in the sense that the church just rolls on, with or without him. I often get the sense that few people at this church care who is "in the pulpit" so to speak. Without going into too much detail, this church has often stated that they want to attract attendees in large numbers, so perhaps none of this is terribly surprising. 

[Dennis1209]

3 hours ago, Coliseum said:

Of the Seven Churches Jesus speaks of in Revelation, Thyatira was perhaps the worst of them, yet Jesus never tells a single person in any of them to leave. Here is what He did say:

Revelation 2:20-25 (NIV)
²⁰  Nevertheless, I have this against you: You tolerate that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess. By her teaching she misleads my servants into sexual immorality and the eating of food sacrificed to idols.
²¹  I have given her time to repent of her immorality, but she is unwilling.
²²  So I will cast her on a bed of suffering, and I will make those who commit adultery with her suffer intensely, unless they repent of her ways.
²³  I will strike her children dead. Then all the churches will know that I am he who searches hearts and minds, and I will repay each of you according to your deeds.
²⁴  Now I say to the rest of you in Thyatira, to you who do not hold to her teaching and have not learned Satan's so-called deep secrets (I will not impose any other burden on you):
²⁵  Only hold on to what you have until I come.  

Jesus is telling those who remain to continue doing what is right. Certainly tell your pastor what you are observing; he deserves the chance to be confronted. James 5:20 says this: 

James 5:20 (NIV)
20  remember this: Whoever turns a sinner from the error of his way will save him from death and cover over a multitude of sins.

Our first hope is not to destroy, but to restore if at all possible.

You mention a point I should have remembered, but didn't. Long story but, I'm sure the Lord led me to this one particular church. Every church, especially in these last days, are going to have it share of problems; Satan and his minions are hard at work. Shortly after I became a member, something happened that I strongly disagreed with, and there was gossip and unrest within the congregation. I left for awhile and attended another church; I was welcomed and felt at home there too, and loved my brothers and sisters in Christ there also. I still felt that strong tugging to go back to the church with the problems. I feel the Lord placed me in that church maybe for a reason, of which I'm not aware of? Perhaps the following scripture has something to do with it? Take a stand, and don't run like I did? The church as well as the individual needs the whole armor of God to stand. 

Ephesians 6:12 (KJV) For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

Ephesians 6:14 (KJV) Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness; [emphasis added]

[Coliseum]

11 minutes ago, Dennis1209 said:

You mention a point I should have remembered, but didn't. Long story but, I'm sure the Lord led me to this one particular church. Every church, especially in these last days, are going to have it share of problems; Satan and his minions are hard at work. Shortly after I became a member, something happened that I strongly disagreed with, and there was gossip and unrest within the congregation. I left for awhile and attended another church; I was welcomed and felt at home there too, and loved my brothers and sisters in Christ there also. I still felt that strong tugging to go back to the church with the problems. I feel the Lord placed me in that church maybe for a reason, of which I'm not aware of? Perhaps the following scripture has something to do with it? Take a stand, and don't run like I did? The church as well as the individual needs the whole armor of God to stand. 

Ephesians 6:12 (KJV) For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

Ephesians 6:14 (KJV) Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness; [emphasis added]

Thx for your perspective Dennis. I left my church; I never said not to. I only shared Jesus never told us to. But first I went directly to the pastor. I told him I could not trust him, that I believed he lied to us, and that he silently stood by doorways, listening to others' conversations without announcing his presence. His answers were not satisfactory, so I left. I was there 20 years. It was hard. God led me to another.

[Dennis1209]

23 minutes ago, Coliseum said:

Thx for your perspective Dennis. I left my church; I never said not to. I only shared Jesus never told us to. But first I went directly to the pastor. I told him I could not trust him, that I believed he lied to us, and that he silently stood by doorways, listening to others' conversations without announcing his presence. His answers were not satisfactory, so I left. I was there 20 years. It was hard. God led me to another.

Yes. I was only citing my own experience and belief, and not implying or recommending anything. I can definitely see times and reasons why people would or should flee from a good many churches now in these end-times. The gambit goes from ecumenicism to the prosperity gospel, cults and everything in between.

With large and mega-churches; there's one thing I'd be curious to know [I have no idea]. Are the Pastor(s) salaries in anyway associated with congregation sizes, tithes and offerings? Quantity rather than quality and tickling of ears seems to be the focus of 'many' mega-churches. Just my observation formed into an opinion.  

Edited December 7, 2019 by Dennis1209