I'm struggeling to accept hell

[enoob57]

8 hours ago, Alive said:

And yet I have quoted a great many verses that seem contrary to your eternal torture, but rather speak to a ceasing to exist?

How do you square those? I only ask you to give room to consider these things before your Lord and mine---the Lord of heaven and earth and our Savior.

¹⁶ For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

It is really simple the account of Lazarus is conscious torment told to us by God Who cannot lie... no matter how the created thing feels about it changes nothing. The account is clear and to say it is not for whatever reason lies in contention with verbal plenary aspects of Scripture itself... angels and mankind do not cease in exist but to be out of God’s presence, do to choice, and to reside in His wrath only is the point of all other descriptives found in Scripture....

[Alive]

Why do you ignore all of the other verses and the language there?

[Raven]

@Blood Bought 1953, @DustyRoad, please forgive my recent posts of intolerance. I did not notice it at the time.

The last few days I have been ill from a virus, and being tired and discontent with it all. This intolerance of illness got transferred into my posts. Sorry.

[JustPassingThru]

11 hours ago, Margo1945 said:

3. saved persons who chose to become unrepentant sinners ... adulterers, idolaters, sexually immoral, etcetra ... 

but be assured that all in the lake of fire are there due entirely to themselves .. 

many will not agree with the third 3. group I mention and it is up to you whether you do or not

I'm one of the many who do not agree there is a third group;

Yes, ...I have read there is Biblical proof for the devil and his demons being cast into the Lake of Fire.

And yes, I have read there is Biblical proof those that reject the Salvation God has provided for them will be cast into the Lake of Fire.

But,  ...I have not read, ...in the context the Holy Spirit intended it to be understood, ...there is any Biblical proof, ...not one single verse to authenticate the third "assumption," ...however, I have read there is Biblical proof that the "assumption" is WRONG coming from the "mouth" of Jesus!

They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.  Luke 8:13

Who is the root?

Now the parable is this: The seed is the Word of God.  Luke 8:11

Who is the Word of God?

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.  John 1:1

We all know Jesus is the Word of God, so for us, ...that means the "Root" is Jesus.

Those that are "on the rock" hear the Word (Gospel Message) and receive it with joy, ...but the proof they were never "born again" is when temptation came, they fell away, ...why(?), because they have no "Root!" They DO NOT have the Holy Spirit of Christ living inside of them, and if this be their "state" the Holy Spirit tells us:

But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His (Jesus).  Rom 8:9

And I have also read (by two or three witnesses let everything be established) Jesus Himself reiterates the "third" group is just an "assumption" and NOT Scriptural:

On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’  And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’   Matt 7:22-23

Notice, Jesus said, "I never knew you,"  ...He did NOT say, "I knew you once, but now I don't!"

 

12 hours ago, Margo1945 said:

keep reading God's Holy Spirit inspired Word and Truth

Excellent advice!!!

That's what I have done in the above verses,  ...and I encourage everyone else to do the same, ...study to show ourselves approved by comparing Scripture with Scripture in the "context" the Holy Spirit wrote it.

Lord bless

[JustPassingThru]

7 minutes ago, Margo1945 said:

.. but others are mentioned as being there, too, including sexually immoral, adulterers, etcetra

Correct!!!

But you haven't provided any Scriptural proof they were "once" born again children of God...

8 minutes ago, Margo1945 said:

those who are mentioned as being there for their sinfulness must be as I said, those who were saved but "CHOSE" to fall into unrepentant sinfulness and to die in such and be "lost" and "dead" for all eternity

Voilà, ...there is the "assumption," ...I was taught to be a Berean, to search the Scriptures to see if what you say is true, ...I haven't found any Scriptures to authenticate what you say, ...on the contrary, ...I have posted the words of Jesus that says the exact opposite of what you say, ...can you provide any Verses the clearly say a born again, blood bought child of God can lose their Salvation, ...in the context of How the Holy Spirit intended them to be received and understood?

Lord bless

[Not me]

@Ineedhugs

If it helps in your search after truth in this subject;

It might help to consider that if in fact hell is eternal torment and there is something that can be done, but God doesn’t do it, that would mean He’s not good....

I’m of the mind and belief that God is good.... Therefore in the nature of things, there is nothing He can do, for He did all, when He sent Christ to secure the new birth for His fallen creatures. Seeing how  only those creatures that have the Divine Nature can inhabit Heaven...And since only death can free a creature from itself. Death is necessary towards a change of the creatures nature. And since those that are in hell are eternal creatures. Therefore they can not die and be re-created or born again with the necessary Divine Nature... They are stuck with the fruit of their choice, a fallen nature. That is why salvation is to be had in this life. 

But than the question remains;

Are those born of Adam, born eternal creatures? 

(Ponderings before God.)  

Be blessed as you pursue these truths, Not me 

[enoob57]

5 hours ago, Alive said:

Why do you ignore all of the other verses and the language there?

They are not ignored they are tempered by that which is clearly stated and thus could be nothing else...

[Mal'ak]

On 12/13/2019 at 6:58 PM, Ineedhugs said:

For the last 6 months I've been a christen but after about 10 days of being faithful and sinless I get these strong feelings that hell is just insane and there couldn't possibly be one. That leads to losing my faith temporarily because then I can't trust what the bible says. How can I stay faithful the rest of my life?

Like how could a loving god brutally torture people just cos they had sex or didn't believe in him or they get drunk etc. It's not rational to care so much about those things let alone torture them for eternity. It's hard for me to accept this. If i can't accept hell then why believe anything in the bible you know?

A guy called Bill wiese apparently went to hell for 23 minutes and tries to bring the world to repentance after his experience. He has youtube videos and he said that the reason hell is justified is because who you wrong determines the severity of punishment. Like if I punch my (male) friend its wrong, if I punch my mother its much worse and if I punch the queen its FAR worse. Since god is infinitely greater than us in position then sins against him are worthy of eternal punishment. Like if you bashed the queen of England you would probably be put to death, and you can say but I only bashed her, normally you just get 3 months jail for that....well you would still get put to death.

While I can see what Bill is saying I still have a hard time accepting it. I could never put someone through that especially for 'little sins' that most good people do. Isn't the right thing to give little things little punishments? If someone heard about Jesus but didn't believe because of reasons that made sense to them shouldn't you be understanding as long as they weren't bad people? I thought these are universally the 'right thing'.

I want to be a perfect Christian but these strong gut feelings keep making me lose faith.....any ideas on how to help?  

 

It is not that you do not believe in Hell, it is that your spirit is telling you that the Hell you been lied too about is not real.  This is not Hollywood, there is no fire and torture.  The Bible tells us clearly, that Hell is just a place people wait at until Jesus returns.  The 'torment' for them, is being out of God's grace since they are not in Heaven.  The fact that you think you have been "sinless" shows you just don't know the Bible, not that the Bible is wrong.  "1 John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us." You might not be willfully sinning (which is good), but you still sin and that is why we need the blood of Jesus to cleanse us as we repent.

 

1 Peter 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

1 Peter 3:19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;

 

When Jesus died, for three days he was dead but never went to Heaven, the Bible tells us he went to the "spirits in prison" or Hell, and he preached to them for three days.  Those that believed and repented left Hell and went to Heaven, they were waiting there for Jesus' death, because even the righteous were in "Abraham's bosom" which was in Hell as no one could go to Heaven until the Lamb was sacrificed.  

 

Revelation 6:8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

 

During the Tribulation or end times satan and all the demons will be kicked out of Heaven by Michael, Hell will also be emptied and everyone there will be sent to Earth as well.  So everyone that does not have the crown of life already will be on Earth at this point, this is so everyone can be gathered together to wait for Jesus' coming for the second time as those in Hell waited for his death on the cross before he preached to them in Hell.

 

Revelation 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Revelation 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

 

When Jesus returns the Christians will be given their crown of life and be priests with him for the thousand years, similar to when Jesus visited Hell when he died on the cross, Jesus and the Christians will be preaching and calling to repentance everyone that was on Earth or Hell.  For the second time, everyone will have a chance to chose Jesus Christ as their Savior and go to eternity with the Father.

 

John 9:1 And as Jesus passed by, he saw a man which was blind from his birth.

John 9:2 And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind?

John 9:3 Jesus answered, Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him.

 

1 Corinthians 10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

 

The problem with "once saved, always saved" and "saved by Grace", is that the Christians that believe this can not explain why they are given the gift of faith but God denies it to another person and sends them to Hell.  If God opens our eyes to the truth, then uses the Holy Spirit to make us perfect so we don't sin, then says we don't need works to prove our faith; so what then separates Christians from those going to Hell?  If we go to Heaven without deeds, how can the wicked go the Hell because of deeds?  That is two faced, and makes God a liar and a respecter of persons.

The answer is rather simple, "by their fruits you will know them" and "trial of your faith", are the two correct ways of Christians.  With that said, in 1 Corinthians 10:13 we know we are never given more then we can handle.  Also from John 9, that we some times have to go through hard times so God's plan can work in us.  For those in Hell they were not ready or able to receive the gift of faith, so instead of God giving it to them and watching them fail as he knew they would then receive great punishment, he instead kept their eyes closed and they had to deal with a little hardship of waiting in Hell until Jesus returns.  Then when Jesus returns they will be given their chance to be righteous and show they are good people, and so earn the crown of life for themselves.  It seems harsh to our flesh minds because we are emotional, but better they wait in Hell and then get a chance to go to eternity, then for them to be given the gift of faith when God knows they will fail and maybe end up in the Lake of Fire.

 

Revelation 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

Revelation 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

Revelation 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

 

Last note, the "eternal damnation" is not Hell, that is the Lake of Fire.  But it is not eternity of burning alive, that is a phrase, we are told it is the second death.  Just like when your flesh dies, your human/flesh body no longer exists or thinks.  The second death is the same, all evil will be spiritually killed as if they never existed.  They will not suffer or feel anything, they will just be nothingness.  Which is sad, heart aching to see anyone die, but they will not suffer and it is needed so evil is gone and the righteous can live in eternity peacefully.

Edited December 16, 2019 by Mal'ak

[dailyprayerwarrior]

Thanks for being honest about how you feel.

Blood Bought nailed the answer. People are in hell for not accepting Jesus. Thats it.

If I went by my feelings I would not have gone to church today. 

I look at God's Word and believe it, whether I feel like it or not. He cannot lie.

Faith is trusting God more than I trust my feelings or circumstances.

I am praying for you as I know what you mean by your post. I felt that way too at times but thankfully, ended up staying in the place of trusting God over my feelings.

Don't get me wrong. I have questions too, for Him. One day, He'll answer them if really need to know in the end.

God bless you!

[Blood Bought 1953]

7 hours ago, Raven said:

@Blood Bought 1953, @DustyRoad, please forgive my recent posts of intolerance. I did not notice it at the time.

The last few days I have been ill from a virus, and being tired and discontent with it all. This intolerance of illness got transferred into my posts. Sorry.

 

Was not and is not a problem........thanks anyway, though...