TCC Posted September 8, 2021 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 59 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 14 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/02/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted September 8, 2021 (edited) 8 hours ago, Omegaman 3.0 said: You too, and I totally agree with the above. Hi Omegaman 3.0, R. Hartono & Dennis1209. Interesting conversation. The best I have heard on 23:31 is that it is not the rapture but the gathering of Israel from all over the world after scattering away from the antichrist. If we look at the usage generally in the bible of 4 winds we come to notice that it is referencing an earthy use of language, not a rapture: 10 Bible verses about Four Winds (knowing-jesus.com). In addition, if we look at the parable of the wheat and the tares (Matthew 13:24-30), we see that the tares are picked up first. I believe the tares reflects what occurs in Rev 14. There are two instances of reaping but they both look like tares. One might be for those who took the mark of the beast, and the other those evil but did not take the mark of the beast perhaps. But in order for the wheat and tares parable to be accurate, the wheat is gathered last. In Rev 14:14-20 the last reaping is the worst. Some think the first reaping is the good or rapture. But chapter 14 seems to be dealing likely with a time in which the earth experiences the sign of the Son of Man. Therefore, the first reaping would seem to be (as chapter 14 is a later chapter in the book--likely indicating a later period in time of the tribulation) something other than a rapture at that late timeframe. The wheat and tares parable would seem to govern Rev 14 not be talking about the rapture...but that the rapture was likely an event much earlier not involving the "nation of Israel" as the wheat and tares parable would...since it was told to Israel under that covenant with the Jews and to them as a parable (about them, not necessarily the church age). So in the way I see it, Matt 24:31 is when the wheat (the nation of Israel) is gathered by angels from around the world and brought into the 1,000 year reign. Not in their resurrection bodies, but making it through the tribulation to this new period in time with extend their life significantly (as people live much longer under the reign of Christ period), if that makes sense? I hope this is to some degree helpful Blessings. Edited September 8, 2021 by TCC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegaman 3.0 Posted September 8, 2021 Group: Graduated to Heaven Followers: 57 Topic Count: 1,546 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 10,320 Content Per Day: 1.41 Reputation: 12,323 Days Won: 9 Joined: 04/15/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/05/1951 Share Posted September 8, 2021 On 8/4/2021 at 9:10 PM, TCC said: I believe the pretrib rapture because no other arguments hold water for me. I have looked at 15 hours of the best debates. My unique perspective is that Rev 12 woman and child = seals sign seen during the age of grace. The child going up is the church (the body). Since the sign is viewed during the age of grace, it would figure that rapture would be too. If that makes sense. Ok, I just have to ask, how does the post address the topic of the thread: Defense of the Post Trib Rapture? No need to reply to this particular post, I am just using it as an opportunity to see if my posting is working here today. I had one that timed out on me maybe a dozen times yesterday, it would not stick. If this works, I shall try again. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TCC Posted September 9, 2021 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 59 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 14 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/02/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted September 9, 2021 22 hours ago, Omegaman 3.0 said: Ok, I just have to ask, how does the post address the topic of the thread: Defense of the Post Trib Rapture? No need to reply to this particular post, I am just using it as an opportunity to see if my posting is working here today. I had one that timed out on me maybe a dozen times yesterday, it would not stick. If this works, I shall try again. Looks like your post made it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegaman 3.0 Posted September 10, 2021 Group: Graduated to Heaven Followers: 57 Topic Count: 1,546 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 10,320 Content Per Day: 1.41 Reputation: 12,323 Days Won: 9 Joined: 04/15/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/05/1951 Share Posted September 10, 2021 16 hours ago, TCC said: Looks like your post made it no, a few have not! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nagzie harb Posted September 10, 2021 Group: Non-Trinitarian Followers: 1 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 60 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 20 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/06/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted September 10, 2021 It is un-scriptural, Period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegaman 3.0 Posted September 15, 2021 Group: Graduated to Heaven Followers: 57 Topic Count: 1,546 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 10,320 Content Per Day: 1.41 Reputation: 12,323 Days Won: 9 Joined: 04/15/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/05/1951 Share Posted September 15, 2021 On 9/10/2021 at 11:22 AM, nagzie harb said: It is un-scriptural, Period. What is the "it"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nagzie harb Posted September 15, 2021 Group: Non-Trinitarian Followers: 1 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 60 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 20 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/06/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted September 15, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, Omegaman 3.0 said: What is the "it"? My mistake. I was thinking Pre-trib rapture. The rapture is another word for being caught up with the Lord during the time of the first ressurection after the time of tribulation. Most of God's own Church(the bride of Christ) will be taken to a place of safety before the tribulation begins. Edited September 15, 2021 by nagzie harb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamL Posted September 15, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 99 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 5,103 Content Per Day: 1.48 Reputation: 2,548 Days Won: 4 Joined: 11/06/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/01/1950 Share Posted September 15, 2021 (edited) On 9/8/2021 at 10:55 AM, TCC said: The best I have heard on 24:31 is that it is not the rapture but the gathering of Israel from all over the world after scattering away from the antichrist. ... In addition, if we look at the parable of the wheat and the tares (Matthew 13:24-30), we see that the tares are picked up first. I believe the tares reflects what occurs in Rev 14. I just posted a 2-part blog having to do with the harvest of the wheat. The general harvest is not the same as the gathering of the firstfruits and the firstborn. The general harvest is gathered in last, the firstfruits are brought in first. The firstfruits are gathered to God's Temple; the full harvest gathered to God's barn. Big difference: the firstfruits are the elect of God who will be taken up to God's Temple in heaven, being faithful disciples of Christ; whereas the harvest is gathered on earth to the lands of Israel. These points just hit the highlights of the blog, the first part (regarding the firstfruits and firstborn) is found here: https://www.worthychristianforums.com/blogs/entry/2686-the-firstfruits-and-the-harvest-20-part-1/ The second part, having to do with the general harvest, found here: https://www.worthychristianforums.com/blogs/entry/2687-the-firstfruits-and-the-harvest-20-part-2/ Edited September 15, 2021 by WilliamL 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBear Posted November 17, 2021 Group: Senior Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 695 Content Per Day: 0.78 Reputation: 748 Days Won: 5 Joined: 11/10/2021 Status: Offline Birthday: 06/17/1973 Share Posted November 17, 2021 (edited) Great topic I have been listening to both sides of the argument lately, despite the movies like “ left behind” I can honestly say the spirit is pushing me more toward the post trib stance I know pre trib people say “ no mention of the church after Chp.6” I myself go with scripture that we are grafted onto the vine with Isreal where pre trib says church=\= Isreal its been a fascinating subject and one I’m not at all claiming to be experienced with, BUT I do look forward to more Bible study on this subject Without inciting scriptural sword fighting I’m interested to see others stances pre trib? post trib? pre Wrath? I hate pain like the next person, but I can’t follow pre- trib , the spirit isn’t leading me in that direction SHALOM❤️ Edited November 17, 2021 by MrBear 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Last Daze Posted November 19, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 9 Topic Count: 84 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 4,011 Content Per Day: 1.13 Reputation: 2,519 Days Won: 4 Joined: 07/17/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted November 19, 2021 On 11/17/2021 at 1:27 AM, MrBear said: Great topic I have been listening to both sides of the argument lately, despite the movies like “ left behind” I can honestly say the spirit is pushing me more toward the post trib stance I know pre trib people say “ no mention of the church after Chp.6” I myself go with scripture that we are grafted onto the vine with Isreal where pre trib says church=\= Isreal its been a fascinating subject and one I’m not at all claiming to be experienced with, BUT I do look forward to more Bible study on this subject Without inciting scriptural sword fighting I’m interested to see others stances pre trib? post trib? pre Wrath? I hate pain like the next person, but I can’t follow pre- trib , the spirit isn’t leading me in that direction SHALOM❤️ Yes, it's the Spirit who leads us into the truth and shows us the things to come (John 16:13). I'm of a post-trib persuasion myself. I've posted some of my thoughts on a website if you're interested . . . The Last Daze 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.thumb.jpg.59eed8b93aa1c92d8b306f10811981dc.jpg)
Recommended Posts