jackie d Posted October 12, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 25 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,081 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/29/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/08/1967 Share Posted October 12, 2006 The question asked is " DO YOU BELIEVE IN ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED?" No, I do not believe in that for many reasons all of which ARE scriptural. Mind giving me the Scriptural reasons against OSAS?? Most certainly charlye, but I will not do it in open forum for there to become an ugly, get no where debate on it..if you would like to speak privately..feel free to PM me. I would then gladly share and listen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kabowd Posted October 12, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 112 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,489 Content Per Day: 0.48 Reputation: 13 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted October 12, 2006 No, I believe in the perseverance of the saints. That is a different doctrine alltogether I agree with this statement. I don't hold to the term "OSAS", but I believe in eternal security. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaisum Posted October 12, 2006 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 16 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/29/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted October 12, 2006 Romans 11:29 - "For God's gifts and his call are irrevocable". John 10:28 "I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish: no-one can snatch them out of my hand" Another misquote from the lies of OSAS, so lets look at the verse in full conext: Jhn 10:27 "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. Jhn 10:28 "And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. So those that are never snatched out of Jesus hand are those that FOLLOW HIM. We dont just believe and praise and pray and sit back... we must follow Him. Read the Sermon on the Mount (Matt ch 5, 6, 7). If we dont Follow Jesus, then whether we are Born Again or not, Jesus will be saying this to us: Mat 7:21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Mat 7:22 "Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' Mat 7:23 "And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness! The above is for Christians. Not atheists or people of other religions. It is for CHristians. We are called to Follow Jesus and do Gods Will. If we don't= No Heaven. OSAS is a lie from the devil to cause confusion, complacency and sinfull attitudes amongst Christians If youbelieve in OSAS, then i would repent and start combining Faith with Good Works (such as those described in the Sermon on the Mount), as in the Book of James, Faith without Works is DEAD. Peace Jai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaisum Posted October 12, 2006 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 16 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/29/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted October 12, 2006 SALVATION A LICENSE TO SIN? There is no subject in the Bible more Misinterpreted or Deliberately Distorted than that of Salvation. What should be as simple as 1 + 1 = 2 has been twisted into something "Alien" from what Jesus taught in the Gospel. One of the most asked Questions in Protestant Christianity is, "Can A Christian Lose His or Her Salvation? Believers ask this Question because: 1) Salvation is often packaged in a way which appears as A Divine Object that God gives to The Repentant. 2) Gifts and Objects can Be lost, stolen or misplaced. The Truth of The Gospel is that we cannot "accidently" lose our salvation as we can lose our wallet or car keys." We can deliberately lose and trash our Salvation by unrepentant sin to the point of hardening our heart to GOD. Satan knows the above Truth and he knows that if Christians follow this, They will bear fruit of love and peace and kindness and draw many to JESUS... well the devil cannot have this! He wants Christians to be lazy, complacent, full of hypocrisy and self righteousness and darkness. Thus, Satan, The Father of All Lies, thought of a way to Distort The Gospel to turn Christians more sinful than Sodom and more wicked than Gommorrah. And he came up one of his sweetest of all lies. ETERNAL SECURITY This is The Most Destructive Doctrine in Protestant Christianity today. Started by Luther and His Reformers as "Salvation By Faith Alone", this Satanic Falsehood was renamed "Eternal Security" by the Baptist Clergy, commonly known as "Once Saved Always Saved", more wide-spread thruout The Bible Belt than Corn Stalks, White Gravy and Nascar. ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED falsely teaches us when we Repent and Receive Jesus as Our Savior (Acts:2:38) we are "Saved Forever", Given A Guaranteed - Irrevokable, Heaven. ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED falsely Tells us that all of our sins; PAST -- PRESENT -- FUTURE are Automatically Forgiven. "Once Saved" Theology actually claims Our Future Sins Are Forgiven Whether we repent and confess them to God or not. ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED falsely promises us that we cannot "Lose" our Salvation no matter what we do, no matter how much we sin, no matter how cruely or brutally we treat others. ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED IS SATAN'S VIRTUAL LICENSE TO SIN, TO SIN YOUR WAY TO HEAVEN AND TRAMPLE THE GRACE AS GOD AS YOU DO! I could show you twelve verses why "Once Saved Always Saved" is false Theology and a lie of hell. Now I will show you the strongest verse that disproves Baptist Theology. This is The Words of JESUS Himself to a sinning Church at Sardis in Revelation chapter three. "He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot-out his name from the Book of Life but rather I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels." Rev:3:5 JESUS Warns He Has An Eraser and will "BLOT OUT" The Names of Christians (from The Book of Life) who sin and sin and refuse to repent! THIS ONE VERSE FROM JESUS HIMSELF SHATTERS THE DOGMA OF "ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED". THE TRUTH OF SALVATION SALVATION IS A DIVINE JOURNEY, A PROCESS A WALK WITH GOD. A Person cannot lose a Process but it can be stopped. A person cannot lose a Journey, but he can quit and turn back. A person cannot misplace a Walk with God but he can choose to Walk Away from God and Feast at The Devil's Table. "ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED" THEOLOGY NEGATES OUR FREE WILL AND CONTRADICTS VIRTUALLY ALL THAT JESUS TAUGHT IN THE GOSPELS. St. Paul divided Salvation into Three Distinct Phases, Emcompassing The Role of Our Free Will 1- Justification 2- Sanctification 3- Glorification (1) JUSTIFICATION "Repent and be baptized for the forgiveness of sins in JESUS name and you shall receive the Gift of the Holy Spirit." ACTS:2:38 This Is When Jesus Becomes Your Savior Starting with the First Century Church, Believers would Repent of their sins Be forgiven by God and receive The Gift of The Holy Spirit. They would experience The Peace of God and Sense A Love from Above. JUSTIFIED = PAST SINS JUST- AS IF- I'D- NEVER SINNED Acts 2:38 refers to our Past Sins: what we have done wrong. No matter what we have done or how bad we have lived, we can be forgiven. This is the Good News of the Gospel. PRESENT SINS We are only forgiven for our present sin if We confess and ask forgiveness. (1 Jn:1:9) FUTURE SINS 1} We don't know our future sins and how we will react to God. We don't know if we will repent or fall-away? {Rev:3:5}. 2} We don't even know if we will follow Christianity six months from today. And "if we do not forgive others, God will Not forgive us." {Matt:6:14-15}. {2} SANCTIFICATION Here is Phase 2 of our Salvation, where we are Sanctified or SET-APART to do God's Will, "On Earth as it is in Heaven." This is when Jesus Becomes Lord. 1} We follow what Jesus taught on an everyday (Mt:7:21/ Mt:10:38/Jn:10:27) 2} Overcome evil which is greed and hatred and our fear {Satan's Domain} and -- 3} Earn our Crown of Life, of Eternal Life. (Ja:1:12 = Rev:3:11-12) "He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot-out his name from the Book of Life but rather I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels." Rev:3:5 "He who overcomes, I will make a pillar in the temple of My God".... {Rev:3:12}. "He who overcomes I will grant to sit with me on My throne, as I have overcome and sat down with My Father on His throne. {Rev:3:21}. There are Seven Warnings to "Overcome" In Rev: Chapters 2 and 3. If we do not overcome, there will be No Crown of Eternal , No Heaven. {3} GLORIFICATION This Is When Jesus Becomes Our Redeemer. Here is where Those Who Overcome Receive their Crown of Life - of Eternal Life. "Overcomers" are given a New Glorified Body in Heaven That will never age or die. (Rev:21:7). Don't believe me or anyone else. Read the words of Jesus for yourself. SERMON BY PASTOR HARRY WALTHER OF WWW.SATANSRAPTURE.COM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricH Posted October 12, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 366 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 10,933 Content Per Day: 1.58 Reputation: 212 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/21/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted October 12, 2006 Another misquote from the lies of OSAS, so lets look at the verse in full conext: I am addressing this as a moderator. This style of discussion is not acceptable here at Worthy. It is fine to disagree and show your biblical reasons for doing so. But using terms like "lie" do not strengthen your argument. In fact, they do just the opposite. Please try to apply this passage to your discussions: And the Lord's bond-servant must not be quarrelsome, but be kind to all, able to teach, patient when wronged, with gentleness correcting those who are in opposition, if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth, and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, having been held captive by him to do his will. 2 Timothy 2:24-26 NASB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smalcald Posted October 12, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 5,258 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 42 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/16/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/22/1960 Share Posted October 12, 2006 Well the only heresy is the idea that we need to do some sort of deeds or works in order to have salvation. That is indeed a lie. Our salvation was totally accomplished by Christ and what He has already done. In fact the bible is so strong on that it says that those who attempt justification through the law have fallen from grace. The problem is a misunderstanding about what faith is and what it means. If you have no struggle in your flesh if you are not fighting against the flesh everyday, it is doubtful that the Holy Spirit resides in you and you have true faith. Without faith we would love sin, we would feel no guilt when we did sin, the reason we would not sin would be for fear of punishment or hope of earning or currying favor with God. With faith we burst forth with good works that were ordained for us to walk in. With faith we attempt to subdue our flesh out of love for Christ, not out of fear of torment. Love casts out fear. Now we must walk in the good works that Christ has given us. We can I think turn our backs and run from faith and from the Holy Spirit. Do we believe the promise of Christ or not? Part of faith is believing this promise of forgiveness and salvation, even when we ourselves do not feel forgiven, when we still sin, when we feel lost. Faith simply shines a light on some of our sin; it makes us recoil at who we really are and brings us to only one thing, a total reliance on Christ alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jude 1:3 Posted October 12, 2006 Share Posted October 12, 2006 (edited) I BET HALF THE PEOPLE WHO RESPOND TO THIS QUESTION DONT REALLY KNOW THE ANSWER DO THEY? Do I believe in OSAS? Yes and no. If we're walking with Christ, we are secure in our salvation. But if we claim to be Christian, yet abandon ourselves to the flesh, we won't receive the kingdom of God. 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 says, Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. Seems awfully clear to me! Edited October 12, 2006 by Jude 1:3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smalcald Posted October 12, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 5,258 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 42 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/16/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/22/1960 Share Posted October 12, 2006 Certainly living in sin without remorse, regret nor without the help of the Holy Spirit to put you on the right path, would be an indication of a lack of faith in Christ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Theology_Professor Posted October 13, 2006 Share Posted October 13, 2006 No, I do not believe in OSAS as Calvin preached and as Baptists, Reform, etc teach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric Posted October 13, 2006 Group: Graduated to Heaven Followers: 2 Topic Count: 50 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,073 Content Per Day: 0.52 Reputation: 43 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/02/2002 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/10/1923 Share Posted October 13, 2006 No, I do not believe in OSAS as Calvin preached and as Baptists, Reform, etc teach. Het prof, I'm glad to see that you didn't go to college just to eat your lunch. I agree with you for a change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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