Floatingaxe Posted December 21, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted December 21, 2006 I am sure there is a difference between the "trump" and the last "trumpet judgment". I am looking into this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenod Posted December 21, 2006 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 139 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/06/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/12/1945 Share Posted December 21, 2006 (edited) Then why are the dead raised first, then the living are caught up with them to meet them in the air? All in ONE resurrectioin. Not exactly certain of your point, but I'm sure you are aware that the Bile speaks of the first and the second resurrections. At the first resurrection, the saints are raised and those who are still living are changed, and together we are all caught up to meet Jesus Christ in the air. Edited December 21, 2006 by kenod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted December 21, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted December 21, 2006 I am sure there is a difference between the "trump" and the last "trumpet judgment". I am looking into this! Let me know what you find, personally I believe they have two seperate meanings, the last Trump in the Feast of Trumpets (Rosh Hashanah) and the Last Trumpet in Revelation which sounds at the end of the seven vials or bowls of wrath closing out the Tribulation. Peace CJ Yes, that is what I was always taught. Will try to get back here about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomPJr Posted December 22, 2006 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 387 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/30/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/11/1977 Share Posted December 22, 2006 Then why are the dead raised first, then the living are caught up with them to meet them in the air? All in ONE resurrectioin. Hey kat8585, The dead are raised first because they are "In Christ" and with Christ being the First Fruits of resurrection, I can't explain this one very well....I'll let the word guide me here. 1Corinthians 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept. Those who have died as believers have died "in Christ". We pass through death into life. Paul in 1Thessalonians was teaching the Thessalonians not to grieve those who have fallen asleep, died. 13But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 14For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. 15For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 1Thess. 1:10 10And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come. 1Cor. 15:52 52In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. When mankind was punished for the First Sin we were subjected to a realm of corruption, that corruption is our flesh once we are to be present with the LOrd we must again put on incorruption, return to the original body that God had intended us to live in in the first place, both the dead and the living will put on this incorruptable body but anyone who is physically living at the time this takes place will not experience a physical death, their transformation will be so sudden it will be like a twinkling of an eye. The body of flesh that now houses the spirit will be removed and the spirit will be returned to incorruption. Scripturally there is an order to the Resurrection(s) and it begns with the dead in Christ rising first. Peace CJ Hey Christopher, I'm sure you mean well, but If I may be so bold...I think that you are letting your own reasoning get in your way. look at the texts again...Kat never said that the ones who put on incorruption die...look here... 1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 1Co 15:53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. (I think we agree that the dead in Christ rise first, and then the living in Christ, together with them, meet Christ in the air) 2Th 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: (this is talking about the same time!...just pause and look for a minute...) Jesus doesnt destroy them with the brightness of his coming after the 1000 years. He did when he Raptured the saints. He resurects them after the 1000 years, and then Satan gathers them together to try and take Gods Holy City.) Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, (Satan goes out to gather all the people from the second resurection....The Saints have already been sealed, and the rest lived not until the 1000 years were finished.) Rev 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the numbe of whom is as the sand of the sea. Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. (remember, God brings the New Jerusalem out of Heaven, after the 1000 years, when he resurects the wicked.) Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. (All the wicked die twice. Once at or before his coming in the clouds to rapture the saints. Second, after the 1000 years when they try to take Gods City) With love, Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishcowboy Posted December 23, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 127 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 3,248 Content Per Day: 0.88 Reputation: 13 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/23/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted December 23, 2006 Allow me to set the stage.... The time is the new world order under one religion. The antichrist is killing all who do not pledge his alliance. You cannot buy, sell, or trade without his mark. What would you do? Where would you go? How do you protect your family? How would you survive? Do you have a plan if this horrible event should ever occur? wont be here. why plan on doing something being i wont be there to participate.... kind of like the 30 class reunion, wont be there, so why help plan it, or get hotel reservations when i wont be there.... If, (if the studies i have done, are wrong, IF...... IF....) and the rapture is a post trib thing, i have had enough training to be able to survive with out having to BUY anything. squirrel, rats, opposum, rabbits are fairly easy game, deer, well be careful cause they can crawl right past ya an you may never know it.... how can i hunt and not be seen nor heard? a few of our Native American friends have taught me how to move and not be heard nor seen...... my son and me last year, stalked a deer (doe) for an hour and half, and the furthest it was from us when we started stalking was about 50 yards, and we got closer then about 10 yards from her, as we walked through the woods following her... never once did we draw the bows back, even though there was clear and clean shots avail many many times... we had fun just seeing how close we could get and how long we could keep this up.... we went until about a half hour past sun down, and then worked our way back out with out disturbing her.... the Tribulation will be a time of survival for those that do not know Christ... the first 3.5 years of it will be relativly easy, until the having the mark is enforced.... the last 3.5 years will be the part that people will be trying to hide, and there will be no place to hide... my plans? not to be here.... mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted December 23, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted December 23, 2006 Allow me to set the stage.... The time is the new world order under one religion. The antichrist is killing all who do not pledge his alliance. You cannot buy, sell, or trade without his mark. What would you do? Where would you go? How do you protect your family? How would you survive? Do you have a plan if this horrible event should ever occur? wont be here. why plan on doing something being i wont be there to participate.... kind of like the 30 class reunion, wont be there, so why help plan it, or get hotel reservations when i wont be there.... If, (if the studies i have done, are wrong, IF...... IF....) and the rapture is a post trib thing, i have had enough training to be able to survive with out having to BUY anything. squirrel, rats, opposum, rabbits are fairly easy game, deer, well be careful cause they can crawl right past ya an you may never know it.... how can i hunt and not be seen nor heard? a few of our Native American friends have taught me how to move and not be heard nor seen...... my son and me last year, stalked a deer (doe) for an hour and half, and the furthest it was from us when we started stalking was about 50 yards, and we got closer then about 10 yards from her, as we walked through the woods following her... never once did we draw the bows back, even though there was clear and clean shots avail many many times... we had fun just seeing how close we could get and how long we could keep this up.... we went until about a half hour past sun down, and then worked our way back out with out disturbing her.... the Tribulation will be a time of survival for those that do not know Christ... the first 3.5 years of it will be relativly easy, until the having the mark is enforced.... the last 3.5 years will be the part that people will be trying to hide, and there will be no place to hide... my plans? not to be here.... mike Amen, mike! BUT---IF I am wrong, I hope I have watched enough of Survivor to be able to survive a bit! I don't care, anyway...whenever I die, I will see Jesus! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herald2 Posted April 18, 2007 Group: Junior Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 46 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 88 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/20/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted April 18, 2007 The Scriptures teach , that, we will be caught up to meet Him, and then will be the great destruction of the earth: "For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Wherefore comfort one another with these words." 1 Thess 4:16,17 Jesus compared the end to Noah and Lot. Noah and his family were kept safe, during the Great Flood. Immediately, after Lot left, Sodom and Gommorah were destroyed. Many believe, that, He will come and gather us and take us to heaven for the Millenium. Afterward, we will return in the New Jerusalem, adorned as a Bride. The New Jerusalem will set down on the Promised Land. The wicked will be revived, attack and be destroyed and He will make all things new and reign from the New Jerusalem forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butler Posted April 18, 2007 Group: Junior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 86 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/28/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/28/1982 Share Posted April 18, 2007 Allow me to set the stage.... The time is the new world order under one religion. The antichrist is killing all who do not pledge his alliance. You cannot buy, sell, or trade without his mark. What would you do? Where would you go? How do you protect your family? How would you survive? Do you have a plan if this horrible event should ever occur? Interesting. Well the church would probably have a safehouse set up. I would probably move my family and loved ones there and keep up there. Food would be hard to come by but considering the other problems we would be having I believe it would be bearable. Guess we will have to wait and see. Sean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustinM Posted April 18, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 144 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 4,512 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 625 Days Won: 10 Joined: 04/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/07/1979 Share Posted April 18, 2007 It's good to prepare just in case. If we make provisions for ourselves, to prepare for the rapture and it happens, then those left behind, will be able to use them. If we are not raptured then, at least we were prepared. Also, I believe there is a pretribulation rapture and that when Jesus Catches us up to be with Him, that does not count as Him returning. To return, He must set foot on the temple mount again, remaining in the clouds does not fulfill prophecy as His second coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus Admirer Posted June 16, 2007 Group: Junior Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 75 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/05/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted June 16, 2007 I want to share an article I wrote on my wbsite titled: I Don't Believe In A Pretribulation Rapture! I Believe In A PreWrath Rature! I wrote the article as Part One and Part Two, because it wouldn't fit all on one page. Part One http://thelordsplace.bravehost.com/PreWrath.html Part Two http://thelordsplace.bravehost.com/PreWrath2.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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