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The seven seals


Isa

Opening of the seven seals  

20 members have voted

  1. 1. do you think the seven seals are opened before the seven trumpets are played

    • yes
      14
    • no
      1
    • maybe
      1
    • indifferent
      0


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You are wrong about the he who sits on the whirte horse. It is true that the white represants purity and also victory but one must take the whole verse into account by researching each word in that verse. Satan always comes as a knight in shining armor at first to deceive but he has no power to kill. And so it is with Rev 6:2. The white horse represents purity and victory but with no arrows the rider has no power and is simply running a bluff. The words "conquer and conquering" are speaking not of war but of capturing the hearts and minds of people. In the Greek they mean "to come away victorious". Jesus does not need a crown to be given to Him because He received His Crown the day He died on the cross. The rider on the white horse is made royalty when he shows up and is given a crown but Jesus was royalty from the forever.

The rider on the white horse is the Antichrist. Even the pre-tribbers know that.

So Satan comes on a horse representing purity and victory.

Sorry, but I can't seem to find any verses in the Bible which say that Satan is either pure or victorious. In each case the horse and its rider are one, therefore Satan could not be one with a horse that represents purity or victory.

Even pre-tribbers know that. :emot-handshake:

I said that the man on the white horse was running a BLUFF which means that he is not at all pure or victorious but will make himself appear to be pure in order to accomplish his evil designs.

Yet there is nothing in the verse that claims the rider on the white horse was "running a bluff," there is nothing which indicates that the color of the horse is deceitful.

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You are wrong about the he who sits on the whirte horse. It is true that the white represants purity and also victory but one must take the whole verse into account by researching each word in that verse. Satan always comes as a knight in shining armor at first to deceive but he has no power to kill. And so it is with Rev 6:2. The white horse represents purity and victory but with no arrows the rider has no power and is simply running a bluff. The words "conquer and conquering" are speaking not of war but of capturing the hearts and minds of people. In the Greek they mean "to come away victorious". Jesus does not need a crown to be given to Him because He received His Crown the day He died on the cross. The rider on the white horse is made royalty when he shows up and is given a crown but Jesus was royalty from the forever.

The rider on the white horse is the Antichrist. Even the pre-tribbers know that.

So Satan comes on a horse representing purity and victory.

Sorry, but I can't seem to find any verses in the Bible which say that Satan is either pure or victorious. In each case the horse and its rider are one, therefore Satan could not be one with a horse that represents purity or victory.

Even pre-tribbers know that. :thumbsup:

The rider on the white horse brings in false peace he conquers without having to fight. This person also breaks that covenant half way through and causes war against God's people. There is only one who has always attacked God's people and that is Satan, so who ever is on this angel of light (horse) will be a power of darkness at the mid point. He will be given power by the Dragon himself. So whoever it is he is Anti------Christ if he is not for Christ he is Anti------Christ.

Then the white horse would be the only one of the four who false represents something. That doesn't follow the pattern.

Satan has always misrepresented who He really is, so what's the problem.

Would he come out and say straight away. "Hi my name is Satan and I am going to have you all take a mark in your hand or forehead which ever feels comfortable to you. Then I will have you all bow down and worship me as God, but I am going to do this in a way so subtle that you wont know it is happening so you believe the lie I am about to tell you." I don't think so. He comes as an angel of light and he uses the beast as his tool to get the nations of the world to worship him.

Yes, but you cannot base an entire exegesis of Scripture on that one item. There are still conflicts with your interpretation, as I pointed out above,

The other three horses appear because of what the one one the white horse has done. They do not need to be misrepresented or use deception, they are events that happen on the earth. The first seal is represented as a person and this person comes to conquer the world and he does that with a promise of peace and he is given a crown to rule the kingdom. All other horses as I said are events following the actions of this person. He takes peace from the world which causes war, famine and death. I think it is pretty plain to see that he deceives and subdues the world falsely without a battle.

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You are wrong about the he who sits on the whirte horse. It is true that the white represants purity and also victory but one must take the whole verse into account by researching each word in that verse. Satan always comes as a knight in shining armor at first to deceive but he has no power to kill. And so it is with Rev 6:2. The white horse represents purity and victory but with no arrows the rider has no power and is simply running a bluff. The words "conquer and conquering" are speaking not of war but of capturing the hearts and minds of people. In the Greek they mean "to come away victorious". Jesus does not need a crown to be given to Him because He received His Crown the day He died on the cross. The rider on the white horse is made royalty when he shows up and is given a crown but Jesus was royalty from the forever.

The rider on the white horse is the Antichrist. Even the pre-tribbers know that.

So Satan comes on a horse representing purity and victory.

Sorry, but I can't seem to find any verses in the Bible which say that Satan is either pure or victorious. In each case the horse and its rider are one, therefore Satan could not be one with a horse that represents purity or victory.

Even pre-tribbers know that. :emot-partyblower:

I said that the man on the white horse was running a BLUFF which means that he is not at all pure or victorious but will make himself appear to be pure in order to accomplish his evil designs.

Yet there is nothing in the verse that claims the rider on the white horse was "running a bluff," there is nothing which indicates that the color of the horse is deceitful.

There is nothing in the verse that says that the man on the white horse is Christ iether nor does the verse say anything about the horse or the man representing the preaching of the gospel. There is however scripture that tells us that the antichrist will come proforming what would look like miricles. He will die and be resurrected somehow from death just as Jesus did. He will be the author of a peace treaty with Isreal andhe will be the one who breaks that peace treaty. He will ever call fire down from heaven. He will claim to be the son of God. He will cause a new temple to be built on the temple mount and he will sit himself up in the holy of holies, showing himself to be God. Now if that doesn,t appear to be that which satan is not there is nothing more that

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You are wrong about the he who sits on the White horse. It is true that the white represents purity and also victory but one must take the whole verse into account by researching each word in that verse. Satan always comes as a knight in shining armor at first to deceive but he has no power to kill. And so it is with Rev 6:2. The white horse represents purity and victory but with no arrows the rider has no power and is simply running a bluff. The words "conquer and conquering" are speaking not of war but of capturing the hearts and minds of people. In the Greek they mean "to come away victorious". Jesus does not need a crown to be given to Him because He received His Crown the day He died on the cross. The rider on the white horse is made royalty when he shows up and is given a crown but Jesus was royalty from the forever.

The rider on the white horse is the Antichrist. Even the pre-tribbers know that.

So Satan comes on a horse representing purity and victory.

Sorry, but I can't seem to find any verses in the Bible which say that Satan is either pure or victorious. In each case the horse and its rider are one, therefore Satan could not be one with a horse that represents purity or victory.

Even pre-tribbers know that. :emot-partyblower:

I said that the man on the white horse was running a BLUFF which means that he is not at all pure or victorious but will make himself appear to be pure in order to accomplish his evil designs.

Yet there is nothing in the verse that claims the rider on the white horse was "running a bluff," there is nothing which indicates that the color of the horse is deceitful.

There is nothing in the verse that says that the man on the white horse is Christ iether nor does the verse say anything about the horse or the man representing the preaching of the gospel. There is however scripture that tells us that the antichrist will come preforming what would look like miracles. He will die and be resurrected somehow from death just as Jesus did. He will be the author of a peace treaty with Israel and he will be the one who breaks that peace treaty. He will ever call fire down from heaven. He will claim to be the son of God. He will cause a new temple to be built on the temple mount and he will sit himself up in the holy of holies, showing himself to be God. Now if that doesn't,t appear to be that which satan is not there is nothing more that I can tell you. Sounds like a bluff to deceive 6,000,000,000 people to me. The man on the horse is not Jesus and it isn't the gospel either.

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On 11/19/2007 at 0:20 AM, Fraught said:

the book is sealed, right? things in the book cannot occur until the seals are off, i think. it is a great thing to open the seals - all are grateful and rejoice. Jesus began to open the seals upon his ascension as far as my knowledge goes. we are awaiting only the 6th. this seems to be the biblical reading of the matter. i would go so far as to say that all the seals are off except i would have to think that the quake was localized and it doesn't appear to be from the reading.

 

On 11/19/2007 at 2:36 AM, Isa said:

Please explain your theory on Jesus opening the scrolls upon His ascention. I haven't heard that one before.

Dear sisters Fraught and Isa,

 

Grace and mercy and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

  •      "And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne a book written within and on the backside, sealed with seven seals."(Rev 5.1).

What you told me made me think, sister Fraught. I always thought the seals were open, but now, on second thought, I see that none of the seals have been opened. This will only happen when Daniel's 70th week is about to begin. John saw Jesus open the seven seals because he was transported to our days and experienced all that is to happen.

But, what book is this?

 

  •      "But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased." (Daniel 12.4).

  •      "And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end." (Daniel 12.9).

 

In the hand of the Lord was the book of Daniel, which contains the life of every one who believes in Jesus.

This book is of such importance that the four living creatures, the twenty-four elders, all the angels, as well as every creature that is in heaven, on earth, under the earth and at sea stopped what they were doing to praise Jesus when He picked up the book. What book was this, but the book of the Revelation, which contains the story of Jesus' follower, as well as the history of the last seven years of Israel in the present dispensation?

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When one pulls verses out of their context before forming a theory on their meaning, OF COURSE their meaning will be off. We must leave verses in their context to get their true meaning.

What is the context of the first seal? It is chapters 4 & 5. Most people read over these and then totally miss what they are showing us.

First, they show TIMING.

Second, they show the movement of time.

They show a throne room where Christ is NOT SEEN at the right hand of the Father.

They show a search for one worthy to break the seals that ended in failure...the very reason John wept much.

They show us the Holy Spirit still in the throne room, when Jesus said He would send Him down as soon as He ascended.

Then they show us  that suddenly something changed: someone WAS FOUND worthy...in another search.

Then chapter 5 shows us the very moment Jesus ascended into the throne room, after telling Mary not to touch Him.

So, why was Jesus NOT SEEN at the right hand of the Father? This is showing us that this is a vision of the past at the time John was seeing it: Jesus was still on earth.

WHY was "no man found?" This tells us that Jesus had not yet risen from the dead. (a vision of the past.)  

Why was the Holy Spirit still in the throne room? Because Christ has not yet ascended to send Him down.

All this tells us the story of what happened about 60 years previous to John seeing this vision. And it sets the CONTEXT of the first seal: NO ONE can find 2000 years between any of those verses. What this shows us is that the moment Jesus ascended, He got the book and began breaking the seals. 

So the first seal was broken around 32 AD. It was to represent the CHURCH sent out to make disciple of all nations.

The next three seals are to represent the devil's attempts to stop the advance of the gospel. They were limited to 1/4 of the earth in their theater of operation.

The 5th seal is for the martyrs of the church age. We, the church, have been waiting between the 5th and 6th seal for nearly 2000 years now.

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I don't think so

All of the seals are opened just before the tribulation and they are a prelude to the coming judgment

All of the seals take place just after those of the immortals have been made and are not a record of the past 2000 years as you tend to make them

They are just simply a prelude of what is coming .... the time of the coming tribulation during the 70th week decreed for Israel and the world which begins in the 8th chapter of Revelation and ends with this [Revelation 19:19-21 and 20:1-3]

Much of your discussion about the coming tribulation is correct, however your seal rendering is not a part of what is coming 

 

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On 2/27/2017 at 6:44 AM, Leonardo Von said:

 

Dear sisters Fraught and Isa,

 

 

 

Grace and mercy and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

 

 

  •      "And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne a book written within and on the backside, sealed with seven seals."(Rev 5.1).

     

What you told me made me think, sister Fraught. I always thought the seals were open, but now, on second thought, I see that none of the seals have been opened. This will only happen when Daniel's 70th week is about to begin. John saw Jesus open the seven seals because he was transported to our days and experienced all that is to happen.

 

But, what book is this?

 

 

 

  •      "But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased." (Daniel 12.4).

     

  •      "And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end." (Daniel 12.9).

     

 

 

In the hand of the Lord was the book of Daniel, which contains the life of every one who believes in Jesus.

 

This book is of such importance that the four living creatures, the twenty-four elders, all the angels, as well as every creature that is in heaven, on earth, under the earth and at sea stopped what they were doing to praise Jesus when He picked up the book. What book was this, but the book of the Revelation, which contains the story of Jesus' follower, as well as the history of the last seven years of Israel in the present dispensation?

 

I don't think so. I believe the book is the title deed or lease document to planet earth. It was the lease given to Adam and usurped by the devil.  Why do I think this? Because once the 7 trumpets are sounded the kingdoms of earth are taken away from Satan and given to Jesus Christ. In other words, the lease EXPIRES at the 7th trumpet.

It further seems that the seven seals were there to prevent the trumpets from coming if no one would be found worthy to break them. I just picture Satan SO SURE of himself, that he never expected anyone to become worthy to break the seals: after all, no one had EVER escaped hell before Jesus! I believe at least part of what made Jesus worthy was that He rose from the dead and became the redeemer.

It seems then, if no one had ever been found worthy, Satan would remain forever the god of this world. THANK GOD Jesus became worthy!

The moment Jesus ascended, He got the book and began breaking the seals. He stopped at seal five, which will include a LONG WAIT until the church age is finished with the pretrib rapture. Then, and only then, judgment will come with the Day of the Lord.

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