deist

I disagree with your assertions, yet can see why you would believe them. I have never felt it is my responsiblity to tell someone else that their view is wrong, what I do hope however is that others will see me enjoying an abundant life and wonder, "What's up with diest?" Not that the Christian life is all bundles of joy. Quite frankly, this year has been nothing but horse manure for me, losing my house, all my possessions, all of my families' homes, etc. Yet I've come to realize that most of the stuff lost was just "stuff" and new stuff will come in time to replace it. It's also often a royal pain having to explain away the very IMO un-christian like behavior of the so called Christians that inhabit not only these boards but real life as well. Getting past all that, I find that the majority of Christians DO come down on the side of goodness, even if their views are a bit narrow and arrogant at times. I also like the fact that I have someone with me all the time to talk to, even if I really don't think he necessarily acts on the things I tell him. It is certainly better than the thought that I am just talking to myself! I wonder, however, why someone who has logically rationalized there is no God would even step into a Christian forum? I wouldn't think of going into, say, a muslim forum, or a buddist forum because I'd rationalized they were incorrect. I'd simply think, "they're wrong" to myself, but since they're not hurting anyone else, I'd leave them alone. Kinda like leaving spiders and ladybugs alone, iykwim.

I haven't read through the entire thread but I wanted to comment on this quote: Obviously you or I didn't live with the dinosaurs. Yet you are certain that no man lived with the dinosaurs. How can you be so certain? Do you have FAITH that because scientists have said so that it must be true? If you were not there, then the only way you can be certain is because you are putting faith in a person's ideas. What is so different about that than someone who is putting faith in the ideas of a biblical author? Also, there is a verse in the bible that says something to the effect of "a day in the Lord is like unto a thousand years". Who is to say the bible gave a seven day creation account, that could actually mean many many years in Godly time? What always strikes me about the seven day theory is that the telltale signs of what makes a day- sun and moon- etc. weren't even created on the first day, so how would one even know what a day was without them. I would think the most intelligent view would be to put yourself in the "can't be certain either way" category. There are certainly a lot of scientific "truths" that are at some time or another completely turned upside down. And, just in case you're ready to throw me into the category of "just another Christain nutcase", let me assure you that if I were to posit a guess, I'd come closer to the view of people not living with the dinosaurs. I'd also direct you to a book called "Ishmael" that gives quite a different view of the creation account, one with which I think you could relate. And though not exactly dinosaurs, I'd suggest you taking a vacation to the Mammoth site in South Dakota, where they are daily digging out the remains of several hundred mammoths and other creatures. Interestingly enough, all of the mammoths there have been determined to be male which speaks volumes, imo. Also, just last week, I had the pleasure of being in the La Brea tar pits in Los Angeles. I believe you'd find this place of interest as well. Blessings.

I believe there would be large agreement among those on this thread that the thread would be much better off without your input. You've done nothing to help emeraldgirl with her questions. You've done nothing to further the cause of Christ. You've done everything to promote disharmony and yet you remain quite smug with your responses. To the casual observer, you appear a bit "off" in your ablitlity to make coherent sentences, but perhaps you are suffering with something that makes you a tad mentally unstable. I hope you have seen a physician. Emeraldgirl, I share many of the same questions as you and at this time find myself not in the camp of the believers of inerrancy. However, since I've spent much of my life in this camp, here is how I would offer a response to your questions if I were still in that place. Pointer, you'd do well to study up here: 2 Chronicles 36:9 "Jehoiachin was 8 years old when he began to reign..." vs. 2 Kings 24:8 "Jehoiachin was 18 years old when he began to reign.... Your Bible has fixed this, too, if it's not KJV. 2 Samuel 24:1 Says that God incited David to take a census. vs. 1 Chonicles 21:1 Says it was Satan that incited David to take a census. Matt 27:5 says Judas hanged himself vs. Acts 1:18 says Judas bought a field; there he fell headlong and his body burst open and all his intestines spilled out. John 1:18 "No man hath seen God at any time..." anyway, WHO is Jesus??? vs. Exodus 33:11 "And the Lord spake unto Moses face-to-face, as a man speaketh unto his friend." and Genesis 32:30 "And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel; for I have seen God face-to-face, and my life is preserved..." What about moral contradictions? Exodus 21:12 "Anyone who strikes a man and kills him shall surely be put to death." vs. Matthew 5:39 and Romans 12:17 "Do not repay any one evil for evil." Lev. 26:7-8 "You will pursue your enemies and they will fall by the sword before you." vs. Luke 6:27,28, 35 "But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you...But love your enemies, do good to them and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High, because He is kind to the ungrateful and wicked." Isaiah 45:7 (KJV) "I make peace and create evil..." (God speaking) The NIV helped this along some, but not much, by retranslating it "I bring prosperity and create disaster..." How about this picture of God? Exodus 4:24 "At the lodging place on the way, the Lord met Moses and was about to kill him." This passage comes out of nowhere and makes no sense. There are many references to mythical creatures in the KJV Bible, but these have been edited by newer translations. (I guess the scholars found it embarrasing to say that unicorns would walk in Babylon...) Isaiah 34:7 Unicorns Isaiah 13:21 Satyrs Numbers 13:32-34 Giants Jeremiah 8:17 Cockatrices The contradictions on the Resurrection account are many and this is already getting long, so I'll leave it at this. Yes, the contradictions on the Resurrection can be a bit disturbing, but one thing is clear: All agreed Jesus died. All agreed Jesus arose from the dead. All agreed that many saw him after his resurrection. There are no books out there from people of the time that says. "I was there and let me tell you that these apostles are a bunch of liars because they killed him and he is still dead." Hope that helps.

Thank you! I can't speak for the other two, but for my part, as Christ forgives, so shall I forgive you for this statement. I wish you peace for your soul.

I haven't read the other replies, but here's my answer: Like many Christians, I was taught this belief, almost brainwashed with it you might say and accepted it fully as a child. As an inquisitive adult, however, I often find my questioning leads me away from the belief. So what is it then that draws me back? Ever so often, I encounter those calling themselves Christian that just seem to "shine" with everything I see that Christ embodied. Although so often I just have to wade through so many Christians that are arrogant, sometimes hostile even, because they have mistaken the great commission as instruction to them to "beat" Christianity into other non-believers. More recently, I have seen Christ through an army of volunteers. I live in the Katrina zone. Much of the region looks like it did the day after the storm. I know many that wouldn't have survived had they depended on the government to help them. They have survived because of the many ordinary people that have come to help. And you know what? I've never seen groups of Hindus, Buddists, Muslims, scientologists, atheists, etc. volunteering their time here for the cause. The common bond I've witnessed among the thousands of volunteers is that they all have a belief in Christ.

I've been reading the banter back and forth in this thread and have found it to be totally amusing. Emeraldgirl, your posts just shine with the clarity of an excellent writer and are a pleasure to read. Pointer, you have provided me with the image of a fat hen who has gotten her feathers ruffled and has now sauntered off to preen herself. It must be difficult acknowledging everything you have trusted in is a bit more shady and less concrete than you have been led to believe. So, did emerald girl put words in your mouth? You've said:"90% or more of people who call themselves "Christian" are not Christian, imv. A Christian 'devours' Scripture". I'd think emeraldgirl was correct in stating that you think only a tiny bit of people are actually Christian. If that is not what you think, then you should put into words what you do think, because to the lurker, it appears emeraldgirl is on the mark. I also got a gut laugh out of your reasons, pointer, for not addressing emeraldgirl's list of errors and contradictions. Your response is so typical of Christians who just simply can't admit that there are no answers and that these errors are concrete proof that the bible is indeed a book that is fallible. How could these errors and contradictions be "out of context" as you suggest? Afterall, the title of this thread is "Biblical Inerrancy". If the contradictions emeraldgirl has posted are not correct, then you should be able to show concrete proof that they are in error. You cannot, so you simply try to belittle emeraldgirl. Amazing, considering you are the one who displays the label "Christian."