keslc Posted September 27, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 25 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 745 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/27/1976 Share Posted September 27, 2004 I think the problem here is you are saying the scriptures are telling women to submit to all men. I don't think that is the case. I think that yes, Paul was very adadment about women submitting to their husbands, but not all men. I'd say that was reading too much into my post, but then I saw where you got that. Very poor wording on my part. I was talking about Paul's serious stance on submission. From what it seems, to the women, no matter who the husband is, they are to submit. Likewise, women in the church are to submit to the authority, that what we gather from the Bible, is suppose to be male. Also, if we read in 1 Timothy (i think) about how the older women are to treat the younger women and the olde rmen are to treat the younger men, we can learn that in the mentoring situation from the question, it'd be stupid to have a women mentor a man or a man mentor a woman (unless of course that woman is the wife of that man). Anyway, back to clarifying, I do not believe the scriptures tell women to submit to all men. I believe women are to submit to their husbands, and if there is no husband, then within a church setting they should submit to their pastor. Ok, thanks for clarifying! Well, aren't all believers told to submit to authority? (governement, church, etc) Ultimately God's authority? I think that when the Bible is speaking in specific terms of men and women it is talking about the marriage relationship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kabowd Posted September 27, 2004 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 112 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,489 Content Per Day: 0.48 Reputation: 13 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted September 27, 2004 I don't think anyone was advocating that women are supposed to submit to any and every man. That's not what the Scriptures say at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keslc Posted September 27, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 25 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 745 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/27/1976 Share Posted September 27, 2004 I don't think anyone was advocating that women are supposed to submit to any and every man. That's not what the Scriptures say at all. Yep, SuperJew clarified for me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kabowd Posted September 27, 2004 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 112 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,489 Content Per Day: 0.48 Reputation: 13 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted September 27, 2004 Oh, sorry...I was referring to something one of the other guys has said. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keslc Posted September 28, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 25 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 745 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/27/1976 Share Posted September 28, 2004 Oh, sorry...I was referring to something one of the other guys has said. Sorry. oh, no problem! So hard to know what is exactly going on (who's talking to who, etc) over the internet! lol! Take care and God bless you, sis! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shelby Posted October 4, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 16 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 706 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 22 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted October 4, 2004 What about single Women ministers? In our churches case, Shelby, single women officers are still under authority (DC's, THQ's, etc) so we are still within Biblical guidelines. I was just saying I agreed with what the woman missionary did, letting the local men who rose up from her ministry to pastor their congregation in their community. Also, I think the explanation of the passage establishing submission of women to their husbands authority is a more accurate take on that passage. I know Katie. But people keep throwing out the words "Senior Pastor". THere are many in our church who are that and a woman. 2nd, we do have DCs, TCs, etc who are over us who might be men, BUT what about Eva Burrows? That is what I mean. I have read through the discussion after this, (sorry I ahve been on vacation, that is what took so long), and I see that the disticntion has been made between your husband and pastor, verses any man on earth. JMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keslc Posted October 4, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 25 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 745 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/27/1976 Share Posted October 4, 2004 What about single Women ministers? In our churches case, Shelby, single women officers are still under authority (DC's, THQ's, etc) so we are still within Biblical guidelines. I was just saying I agreed with what the woman missionary did, letting the local men who rose up from her ministry to pastor their congregation in their community. Also, I think the explanation of the passage establishing submission of women to their husbands authority is a more accurate take on that passage. I know Katie. But people keep throwing out the words "Senior Pastor". THere are many in our church who are that and a woman. 2nd, we do have DCs, TCs, etc who are over us who might be men, BUT what about Eva Burrows? That is what I mean. I have read through the discussion after this, (sorry I ahve been on vacation, that is what took so long), and I see that the disticntion has been made between your husband and pastor, verses any man on earth. JMHO Hey, girl, hope you had a good vacation! Anyway, I guess I didn't clarify. lol. I didn't mean under MALE authority because there are DC's TC's, generals, etc who can or have been female. My point was that no matter who you are you are under some kind of authority. And I think Biblically ALL christians are called to submit to authority (government, leaders, our bosses, etc), ulitimately God's. As I was trying to say with SuperJew, I think when the Bible is speaking of women submitting to men, specifically it is talking about in the marriage relationship. When you look at the context of that day, though, all leadership was men, so when they were told to submit to other authorities, they happened to be male, but that was not the Biblical qualification. Does that make sense, or did I confuse it more?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papasangel Posted October 4, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 70 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,513 Content Per Day: 0.19 Reputation: 39 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/19/2002 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/27/1959 Share Posted October 4, 2004 In answer to the question when does a boy become a man I will have to say this. A boy becomes a man when he has learned to make sound, rational decisions in his life, accepts consequences for those decisions and has reached the age of legal accountability. That is what I would define as a male adult. I would also add that kindness, generosity and self control is also very important in his life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shelby Posted October 4, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 16 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 706 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 22 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted October 4, 2004 Thanks Kate, clear as mudd. Just kidding. I gotcha, and I figured that is what you meant, I was just clarifying. I think all of the mandates regarding authority in the Bible are to help us to have a better view and perspective of God's authority. The same way having parents reiterates the love God has for us, we can relate (hopefully) to that type of relationship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keslc Posted October 4, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 25 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 745 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/27/1976 Share Posted October 4, 2004 Thanks Kate, clear as mudd. Just kidding. I gotcha, and I figured that is what you meant, I was just clarifying. I think all of the mandates regarding authority in the Bible are to help us to have a better view and perspective of God's authority. The same way having parents reiterates the love God has for us, we can relate (hopefully) to that type of relationship. "Clear as mud" LOL! I have a way of making things "clear as mud", huh? Anyway, yep, I think so too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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