JAG**

That was the whole point Douggg that the quote was clearly and obviously wrong. But the LARGER and MORE IMPORTANT point was that it came from the "people on your side" and the people that wrote that pure-speculative stuff believed that it was true and now here you are saying that they were "all wrong." Douggg they will say that YOU are "all wrong" when you say that they are "all wrong." So? So many people "on your side" have their "end time charts" that contradict each other about the fictional imaginary end times "evil man" that they speculate is yet coming. The people that wrote this stuff down there believed it was true. My view is that your end times speculations or no more factually correct that is the end times speculations down below: ____________________ "11. Resurrected Dead? - "Seemed to have a mortal wound" : Some Bible expositors believe this mortal wound refers to the pagan Roman Empire, which died in the past but will be revived in the end times. Others say a historical character of the past, such as Nero, Judas Iscariot, Mussolini, Hitler, or Stalin, will come back to life and fulfill the role of the antichrist in the end times. Others say the antichrist will actually be killed and then resurrected. Still others say that perhaps the antichrist will be severely wounded, and Satan will supernaturally heal this wound. Perhaps he will simply appear to be killed, though he really is not, and through satanic trickery will appear to be resurrected." https://www.biblestudytools.com/bible-study/topical-studies/the-rise-of-the-antichrist.html

That is incorrect. I do not put curses on anyone. JAG Wrote: "One more thing Douggg, you will from now on, have to "live with" the FACT that you will ALWAYS KNOW that you were unable to produce a Bible-Verse that made the connection with the Bible's mention of antichrist in John's epistles with any other parts of the Bible. You will live out your days KNOWING that I just spoke the absolute truth to you."__JAG That is not a curse. That is a fact. I presented you with a FACT. Best. JAG

The Bible does not mention the European Union. The Bible does not say a single word about the European Union -- all of that up there is nothing more than your personal assumptions and personal speculations. Not a single word of that up there makes any connection to the antichrists mentioned by John --- yet you still use the word "antichrist" based upon your personal speculations that what you posted up there is connected to the antichrists mentioned by John. __________________ My view it that your post up there is a great help in establishing the truth of my Opening Post and the truth of the title to this thread. This remains unrefuted , , , Proposition: There Is No Bible-Verse Argument For A Future Antichrist. , , , and the FACT is that you do NOT have a Bible verse that connects John's antichrists mentioned below , , , 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 . . . with any of these down there? ■ Daniel 7 ■ 2 Thess 2 ■ Revelation 13 ■ the book of Revelation ■ Ezekiel ■ the "false prophet" ■ the "harlot" ■ the "beast" ■ the "little horn" ■ the "man of sin" {the "man of lawlessness" -- in 2 Thess 2} , , yet you still use the word "antichrist" in your speculations. JAG

{1} That is an unfriendly hostile remark , , "Get off your Clydesdale high horse" {2} It is about ME and is directed at ME personally. {3} That is not something that you would say to a brother if you had kind-hearted feelings toward him. {4} You and I disagree on a very minor point of doctrine. Are you aware that there are no major Christian creeds that even mention the fictional imaginary "end times" , , "evil man" ? So its not like you and I disagreed on any major Christian doctrine. {5} One gentlemen in this thread said this about me "rudely dismissive. I have heard that behavior called narcissistic psychopathy. I think it more just plain bad. I have to hand it to you...dancing around a critical fact in rigid determination to remain willfully ignorant is impressive" {6} You accused me of teaching false doctrines merely because we do not agree on a minor point {7} I do not feel that I am a victim. I merely speak the truth, namely both me and my views have been demonized {made to appear evil} simply because we disagree on this imaginary "boogie man" that some speculate will appear in the future {8} But I do not ask that you stop it. I just point it out. {9} I defend my title and my Opening Post as best I can. It is not my fault that some posters in this thread pay no attention to what my title and Opening Post actually says but rather ignore them both and proceed to post as if the title and Opening Post were not actually there. So? So I have no choice but to repeat my points over and over again. {10} This Opening Post and his title is NOT on the general subject of antichrist or antichrists --- rather that there is no Bible-Verse argument for a future antichrist. And there is NOT one. There is no Bible Verse that connects the antichrists mentioned in John's epistles with any other parts of the Bible , , and that is a FACT. Best. JAG

You can post anything you want to post and say anything you want to say but , , , , , , what is important is the title of my Opening Post and the title of this thread. This remains unrefuted , , , Proposition: There Is No Bible-Verse Argument For A Future Antichrist. , , , and the FACT is that you do NOT have a Bible verse that connects John's antichrists mentioned below , , , 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 . . . with any of these down there? ■ Daniel 7 ■ 2 Thess 2 ■ Revelation 13 ■ the book of Revelation ■ Ezekiel ■ the "false prophet" ■ the "harlot" ■ the "beast" ■ the "little horn" ■ the "man of sin" {the "man of lawlessness" -- in 2 Thess 2} The Bible mentions antichrist in ONLY these 4 instances. 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 So we MUST make a clear and solid CONNECTION between John's antichrists and other parts of the Bible --- otherwise we have to give up the name "antichrist" and just issue a proclamation that the imagined future "evil man" is called whatever anyone wants to call him --- just don't call him THE "antichrist" or antichrist. Why did I post all the above to you? Because you quoted my entire Opening Post which is all about what I just posted to you. This remains unrefuted , , , Proposition: There Is No Bible-Verse Argument For A Future Antichrist. Also this , , , When you speak of "The antichrist" you are referring to a future "evil man" that is described in various and contradictory ways by a large number of people on your side , , , here below is just one {1} sample among hundreds of other far-fetched pure-speculative descriptive examples without so much as one single Bible-Verse that actually says what is put forth. Note the speculation tone of this passage below: "11. Resurrected Dead? - "Seemed to have a mortal wound" : Some Bible expositors believe this mortal wound refers to the pagan Roman Empire, which died in the past but will be revived in the end times. Others say a historical character of the past, such as Nero, Judas Iscariot, Mussolini, Hitler, or Stalin, will come back to life and fulfill the role of the antichrist in the end times. Others say the antichrist will actually be killed and then resurrected. Still others say that perhaps the antichrist will be severely wounded, and Satan will supernaturally heal this wound. Perhaps he will simply appear to be killed, though he really is not, and through satanic trickery will appear to be resurrected." https://www.biblestudytools.com/bible-study/topical-studies/the-rise-of-the-antichrist.html How can you take such as that up there seriously? I don't get it? ``

You will be interested in knowing that some folks on your side have made a list of who this "end time" , , ,"evil man" , , might be? ____________________ Start quote. This list is a run-down of the key figures we are watching with great suspicion. Basic biographical information is shown and reasons given why any of them might fit the role of the antichrist" https://www.unsealed.org/2015/02/know-your-candidates.html End quote {1} Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi Title & Position: Caliph Ibrahim; founder and leader of the Islamic State (IS/ISIS {2} Alexis Tsipras Title & Position: Prime Minister of Greece {3} Barack Obama Title & Position: {former} President of the United States {4{ Emmanuel Macron Title & Position: President of France, Prince of Andorra {5} Jared Kushner Title & Position: Senior Advisor to the President, de facto Chief Negotiator for Middle East Peace {6} Javier Solana Title & Position: Former Secretary-General of the WEU, NATO, and the Council of the EU {7} Justin Trudeau Title & Position: Prime Minister of Canada {8} King Abdullah II Title & Position: King of Jordan {9} Tayyip Erdogan Title & Position: President of Turkey {10} Vladimir Putin Title & Position: President of the Russian Federation {11} Zoltan Istvan Title & Position: Founder of the Transhumanist Party and candidate for U.S. President Source: https://www.unsealed.org/2015/02/know-your-candidates.html

Douggg, here is some more wild far-fetched personal speculation about the fictional imaginary "evil man" of the "end times" --- the Bible does NOT teach a single word of mere man's imaginations-namely that stuff down there. Say, talking about "false doctrines" how can you possibly endure stuff like this down below? Passed off as being "God's word"? And this below is highly typical of the folks who teach that there is to be an "evil man" "world ruler" coming in the "last days" , , , , Start quote. He Will Be A Man Of Prosperity a Political Genius - Dan. 11:43; Rev. 13:16-17. The Antichrist will eventually control the wealth of the world. He will bring prosperity to those who have lived in poverty. The Antichrist may make great strives to end world hunger. That most people under his reign will be better off financially that they were before he rose to power D. He Will Be A Man Of Power - Rev. 13:7-8 These verses tell us that Antichrist will eventually rule the entire world. Conquerors down through the ages have sought this lofty goal without success. He will achieve it! What men won't recognize, or won't care about is the fact that he receives his power from Satan himself, Dan. 8:24. He will become so large in the eyes of humanity that they will literally worship him as their god. A. He Will Attack The People Of God - Dan. 7:25 The Antichrist will break his covenant with Israel and will attack the people of the Lord. He will try to do what Hitler, Stalin and others failed to do: exterminate the Jew. More than anything, this man will hate everything having to do with God and Jesus Christ. He will lash out at the Jews and try to completely destroy them. End quote. https://www.bible-truth.org/msg175.html

"demonization"-- make it appear to be evil The insults and personal demonization are in this thread. I can go get them _________________ You know very well what the term "demonize" means the way I used it. It means that you and some other posters here on your side of this issue demonized {made it appear to be evil} the message and then demonized me personally. You did that because you emotionally do not like to be faced with the FACT that you can NOT produce a Bible-Verses that makes the connection between John's mention of antichrists below , , , 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 , , , with any other parts of the Bible listed down there , , , ■ Daniel 7 ■ 2 Thess 2 ■ Revelation 13 ■ the book of Revelation ■ Ezekiel ■ the "false prophet" ■ the "harlot" ■ the "beast" ■ the "little horn" ■ the "man of sin" {the "man of lawlessness" -- in 2 Thess 2} _______ It is sinful and evil to teach false doctrines , , , , , , and you will have to "live with" the fact that you accused me of teaching false doctrines merely because we disagree on Christian Eschatology --- especially in light of the fact that I explained to you several times the kind of Christian I am and also explained to you about the 4 different camps of Christian Eschatology. For you to accuse me of teaching false doctrine in light of this below, in my view, is not the good and right thing to do. Here it is again , , , I write the following just for the record , , , , , , and to you Douggg, I am an orthodox Bible believing born again Christian. My wife and I attend a Bible believing Baptist-type Christian church along with our grown children and our 6 grandchildren. I believe the following with all my mind, heart, and soul: I believe in the Holy Trinity of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. I believe in the Deity of the Lord Jesus. That He is fully God. (John 1: 1-5) I believe in the Virgin Birth of the Lord Jesus. I believe in the Resurrection of the Lord Jesus. I believe that the Bible is the inspired word of God and free from all error. (2 Timothy 3:14-17) I believe in the Second Coming of the Lord Jesus. I believe in a coming Judgment. I believe that salvation is by grace through faith in the Lord Jesus' death on the Cross where He died to pay for our sins. Ephesians 2:8 I believe in John 3:16 with all my heart. I believe in all the orthodox doctrinal Protestant Creeds. That is, I am a Bible believing Protestant in my faith and practice. I am an orthodox Bible believing Postmillennialist. I do NOT hold to a single weird or strange or unusual belief. Postmillennialism is a mainstream orthodox Bible believing view of the future of the human race and of the future of the Christian Church. I can easily post a list of the names of dozens of Christian Postmillennial scholars who believe the Bible is the word of God and 100% true --- but who DISAGREE with Premillennialists on what the Holy Scriptures teach with regard to the end time passages. There is nothing unorthodox about Postmillennialism or Premillennialism or Amillennialism or Dispensationalism. There are large segments within Bible Believing Christendom that holds different views of the future of the human race and the future of the Christian Church. There are 4 of them. All 4 are fully orthodox and fully Christian. (1) Postmillennialism (2) Premillennialism (3) Amillennialism (4) Dispensationalism _____________________ May the Lord bless and keep us. May the Lord make His face to shine upon us. May the Lord be gracious unto us. May the Lord turn His face toward us. May the Lord give us His protection and His peace. (Based upon Numbers 6:24-27) JAG _________ One more thing Douggg, you will from now on, have to "live with" the FACT that you will ALWAYS KNOW that you were unable to produce a Bible-Verse that made the connection with the Bible's mention of antichrist in John's epistles with any other parts of the Bible. You will live out your days KNOWING that I just spoke the absolute truth to you. ________ This remains unrefuted , , , Proposition: There Is No Bible-Verse Argument For A Future Antichrist. JAG

Your "end time chart" appears to be very complicated. I tried to see where your "end time chart" took into consideration the following wild far-fetched personal speculations about your fictional imaginary "arch villian" of the "last days" --- but I could not find it on your chart. Can you find it? Start quote. Regarding the imaginary antichrist , , , "11. Resurrected Dead? - "Seemed to have a mortal wound" : Some Bible expositors believe this mortal wound refers to the pagan Roman Empire, which died in the past but will be revived in the end times. Others say a historical character of the past, such as Nero, Judas Iscariot, Mussolini, Hitler, or Stalin, will come back to life and fulfill the role of the antichrist in the end times. Others say the antichrist will actually be killed and then resurrected. Still others say that perhaps the antichrist will be severely wounded, and Satan will supernaturally heal this wound. Perhaps he will simply appear to be killed, though he really is not, and through satanic trickery will appear to be resurrected." https://www.biblestudytools.com/bible-study/topical-studies/the-rise-of-the-antichrist.html

Thank you for posting your chart. I was hoping that someone would start posting "end time charts." Charts such as that up there greatly helps demonstrate the truth of my position that there is not a single Bible-Verse that makes any connection between John's antichrists and any other parts of the Bible. I invite everybody to carefully study that chart and they will discover that there is not , , , , , , a single Bible verse that connects John's antichrists mentioned below , , , 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 . . . with any of these down there? ■ Daniel 7 ■ 2 Thess 2 ■ Revelation 13 ■ the book of Revelation ■ Ezekiel ■ the "false prophet" ■ the "harlot" ■ the "beast" ■ the "little horn" ■ the "man of sin" {the "man of lawlessness" -- in 2 Thess 2} The Bible mentions antichrist in ONLY these 4 instances. 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 So you MUST make a clear and solid CONNECTION between John's antichrists and other parts of the Bible --- otherwise you have to give up the name "antichrist" and just issue a proclamation that your imagined future "evil man" is called whatever you want to call him --- just don't call him THE "antichrist" or antichrist. Why not? Because you have zero Biblical warrant for calling your imaginary future "evil man" the antichrist or an antichrist. Your chart fails to make the vital connection. Your chart is nothing more than personal assumptions and personal far-fetched speculations. So far the following remains unrefuted: Proposition: There Is No Bible-Verse Argument For A Future Antichrist.

You are incorrect. John clearly teaches that there is a group of antichrists in his time of the 1st Century. John expands his antichrists from being one individual to being a multitude ,"many antichrists", and puts them in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago. 1 John 2:18-19 "Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour. 19They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us." Note the particulars in 1 John 2:18-19 "this is the last hour" -- a reference to the time of the 1st Century some 2000 years ago "the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come" -- not one "The antichrist" but "many antichrists" "many antichrists" --- so John's antichrists were plural, many antichrists, and not just one "even now" -- John's antichrists lived in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago "have come" -- John's antichrists lived in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago "they went out from us" -- John's antichrists lived in the 1st Century some 2000 years ago "they would have remained with us" -- John's antichrists lived in the 1st century, in the time John lived, some 2000 years ago _____________ Questions: {1} When did John's antichrists come? Answer "even now" in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago {2} Again when did John's antichrists come? Answer: they "have come" in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago {3} What was the number of John's antichrist? Answer: "many antichrists" plural and not just one {4} What did John's antichrist do? Answer: "they went out from us" -- ie they went out from John and the apostles some 2000 years ago Conclusion: John's antichrists were 1st century Christian apostates. ________________ "the singular antichrist person."___Dougggg There is no such thing as a "singular antichrist person" that is connected in any way with this list down below: ■ Daniel 7 ■ 2 Thess 2 ■ Revelation 13 ■ the book of Revelation ■ Ezekiel ■ the "false prophet" ■ the "harlot" ■ the "beast" ■ the "little horn" ■ the "man of sin" {the "man of lawlessness" -- in 2 Thess 2} So? So your imagined "evil man" of the future is pure assumption and pure personal speculation as demonstrated with such as this below: Here below is a sample of what the fictional "The antichrist doctrine" has produced in the world today --- wild far-fetched un-Biblical personal assumptions and personal speculations without so much as one Bible-Verse to connect John's antichrists with any other parts of the Bible. Here is an example of the far-fetched un-Biblical wild speculation about the future fictional imaginary "antichrist" , , , , , "11. Resurrected Dead? - "Seemed to have a mortal wound" : Some Bible expositors believe this mortal wound refers to the pagan Roman Empire, which died in the past but will be revived in the end times. Others say a historical character of the past, such as Nero, Judas Iscariot, Mussolini, Hitler, or Stalin, will come back to life and fulfill the role of the antichrist in the end times. Others say the antichrist will actually be killed and then resurrected. Still others say that perhaps the antichrist will be severely wounded, and Satan will supernaturally heal this wound. Perhaps he will simply appear to be killed, though he really is not, and through satanic trickery will appear to be resurrected." https://www.biblestudytools.com/bible-study/topical-studies/the-rise-of-the-antichrist.html

When we "translate" your comment up there it really means that , , , You do NOT have a Bible verse that connects John's antichrists mentioned below , , , 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 . . . with any of these down there? ■ Daniel 7 ■ 2 Thess 2 ■ Revelation 13 ■ the book of Revelation ■ Ezekiel ■ the "false prophet" ■ the "harlot" ■ the "beast" ■ the "little horn" ■ the "man of sin" {the "man of lawlessness" -- in 2 Thess 2} The Bible mentions antichrist in ONLY these 4 instances. 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 So you MUST make a clear and solid CONNECTION between John's antichrists and other parts of the Bible --- otherwise you have to give up the name "antichrist" and just issue a proclamation that your imagined future "evil man" is called whatever you want to call him --- just don't call him THE "antichrist" or antichrist. Why not? Because you have zero Biblical warrant for calling your imaginary future "evil man" the antichrist or an antichrist. _____________ You have no arguments to refute the above --- so you demonize the message and demonize me personally by accusing me of teaching false doctrines even though I have demonstrated to you that good and true born again Bible believing Christians in the 4 different Christian Eschatological camps disagree on the end times passages. JAG PS You will notice that I have NOT one time insulted a single person in this thread. ALL the insults have come from you and from the people on your side. I have been personally insulted several times in this thread but have NOT replied in kind, not even one time --- and nor will I ever.

You are incorrect. John expands his antichrists from being one individual to being a multitude ,"many antichrists", and puts them in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago. 1 John 2:18-19 "Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour. 19They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us." Note the particulars in 1 John 2:18-19 "this is the last hour" -- a reference to the time of the 1st Century some 2000 years ago "the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come" -- not one "The antichrist" but "many antichrists" "many antichrists" --- so John's antichrists were plural, many antichrists, and not just one "even now" -- John's antichrists lived in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago "have come" -- John's antichrists lived in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago "they went out from us" -- John's antichrists lived in the 1st Century some 2000 years ago "they would have remained with us" -- John's antichrists lived in the 1st century, in the time John lived, some 2000 years ago _____________ Questions: {1} When did John's antichrists come? Answer "even now" in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago {2} Again when did John's antichrists come? Answer: they "have come" in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago {3} What was the number of John's antichrist? Answer: "many antichrists" plural and not just one {4} What did John's antichrist do? Answer: "they went out from us" -- ie they went out from John and the apostles some 2000 years ago Conclusion: John's antichrists were 1st century Christian apostates.

Here below is your problem in a nutshell: You do NOT have a Bible verse that connects John's antichrists mentioned below , , , 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 . . . with any of these down there? ■ Daniel 7 ■ 2 Thess 2 ■ Revelation 13 ■ the book of Revelation ■ Ezekiel ■ the "false prophet" ■ the "harlot" ■ the "beast" ■ the "little horn" ■ the "man of sin" {the "man of lawlessness" -- in 2 Thess 2} The Bible mentions antichrist in ONLY these 4 instances. 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 So you MUST make a clear and solid CONNECTION between John's antichrists and other parts of the Bible --- otherwise you have to give up the name "antichrist" and just issue a proclamation that your imagined future "evil man" is called whatever you want to call him --- just don't call him THE "antichrist" or antichrist. Why not? Because you have zero Biblical warrant for calling your imaginary future "evil man" the antichrist or an an antichrist. JAG

When I use the expression "John's antichrists" I mean to refer to John's mention of antichrist in these 4 instances 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 ``

You quoted Daniel 7. There is zero connection between Daniel 7 and John's antichrist. The connection between John's antichrists and Daniel 7 is 100% pure personal assumption and personal interpretative speculation. There is no Bible-Verse that connects John's antichrists with Daniel 7 Question: Do you have a Bible verse that connects John's antichrists mentioned below , , , 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 . . . with any of these down there? ■ Daniel 7 ■ 2 Thess 2 ■ Revelation 13 ■ the book of Revelation ■ Ezekiel ■ the "false prophet" ■ the "harlot" ■ the "beast" ■ the "little horn" ■ the "man of sin" {the "man of lawlessness" -- in 2 Thess 2} The Bible mentions antichrist in ONLY these 4 instances. 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 So we MUST make a clear and solid CONNECTION between John's antichrists and other parts of the Bible --- otherwise we have to give up the name "antichrist" and just issue a proclamation that the imagined future "evil man" is called whatever anyone wants to call him --- just don't call him THE "antichrist" or antichrist. Why did I post all the above to you? Because you quoted my entire Opening Post which is all about what I just posted to you. So far the title of my Opening Post and thread remained unrefuted: Proposition: There Is No Bible-Verse Argument For A Future Antichrist. JAG

Agreed. There are many of them. Islam is one. There are many others. eg Jainism You quoted my entire Opening Post and them remarked: "Hmmm. Is there a religion today that denies "the Father AND the SON?" I know there is."___iamlamad /just curious , , , Question: Do you have a Bible verse that connects John's antichrists mentioned below , , , 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 . . . with any of these down there? ■ Daniel 7 ■ 2 Thess 2 ■ Revelation 13 ■ the book of Revelation ■ Ezekiel ■ the "false prophet" ■ the "harlot" ■ the "beast" ■ the "little horn" ■ the "man of sin" {the "man of lawlessness" -- in 2 Thess 2} The Bible mentions antichrist in ONLY these 4 instances. 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 So we MUST make a clear and solid CONNECTION between John's antichrists and other parts of the Bible --- otherwise we have to give up the name "antichrist" and just issue a proclamation that the imagined future "evil man" is called whatever anyone wants to call him --- just don't call him THE "antichrist" or antichrist. Why did I post all the above to you? Because you quoted my entire Opening Post which is all about what I just posted to you.

John expands his antichrists from being one individual to being a multitude ,"many antichrists", and puts them in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago. 1 John 2:18-19 "Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour. 19They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us." Note the particulars in 1 John 2:18-19 "this is the last hour" -- a reference to the time of the 1st Century some 2000 years ago "the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come" -- not one "The antichrist" but "many antichrists" "many antichrists" --- so John's antichrists were plural, many antichrists, and not just one "even now" -- John's antichrists lived in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago "have come" -- John's antichrists lived in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago "they went out from us" -- John's antichrists lived in the 1st Century some 2000 years ago "they would have remained with us" -- John's antichrists lived in the 1st century, in the time John lived, some 2000 years ago _____________ Questions: {1} When did John's antichrists come? Answer "even now" in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago {2} Again when did John's antichrists come? Answer: they "have come" in the time of the 1st century some 2000 years ago {3} What was the number of John's antichrist? Answer: "many antichrists" plural and not just one {4} What did John's antichrist do? Answer: "they went out from us" -- ie they went out from John and the apostles some 2000 years ago Conclusion: John's antichrists were 1st century Christian apostates.

Douggg, You have no Bible-Verse arguments that can connect John's antichrists with any other parts of the Bible, so you then seek to demonize the message with accusations of "false doctrine teaching " ---and in so doing you also demonize me because it is a sin to be a proclaimer of "false doctrine teaching" I write the following just for the record , , , , , , and to you Douggg, I am an orthodox Bible believing born again Christian. My wife and I attend a Bible believing Baptist-type Christian church along with our grown children and our 6 grandchildren. I believe the following with all my mind, heart, and soul: I believe in the Holy Trinity of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. I believe in the Deity of the Lord Jesus. That He is fully God. (John 1: 1-5) I believe in the Virgin Birth of the Lord Jesus. I believe in the Resurrection of the Lord Jesus. I believe that the Bible is the inspired word of God and free from all error. (2 Timothy 3:14-17) I believe in the Second Coming of the Lord Jesus. I believe in a coming Judgment. I believe that salvation is by grace through faith in the Lord Jesus' death on the Cross where He died to pay for our sins. Ephesians 2:8 I believe in John 3:16 with all my heart. I believe in all the orthodox doctrinal Protestant Creeds. That is, I am a Bible believing Protestant in my faith and practice. I am an orthodox Bible believing Postmillennialist. I do NOT hold to a single weird or strange or unusual belief. Postmillennialism is a mainstream orthodox Bible believing view of the future of the human race and of the future of the Christian Church. I can easily post a list of the names of dozens of Christian Postmillennial scholars who believe the Bible is the word of God and 100% true --- but who DISAGREE with Premillennialists on what the Holy Scriptures teach with regard to the end time passages. There is nothing unorthodox about Postmillennialism or Premillennialism or Amillennialism or Dispensationalism. There are large segments within Bible Believing Christendom that holds different views of the future of the human race and the future of the Christian Church. There are 4 of them. All 4 are fully orthodox and fully Christian. (1) Postmillennialism (2) Premillennialism (3) Amillennialism (4) Dispensationalism _____________________ May the Lord bless and keep us. May the Lord make His face to shine upon us. May the Lord be gracious unto us. May the Lord turn His face toward us. May the Lord give us His protection and His peace. (Based upon Numbers 6:24-27) JAG Proposition: There Is No Bible-Verse Argument For A Future Antichrist.

Read that quote at the bottom to see what the fictional imagined "THE antichrist notion" has produced in the world today--- wild far-fetched un-Biblical personal speculations --- now for the answer to your question. ____________ I have answered that question several times and will answer it again. There is no such thing as some future evil world ruler that is to come that will be called THE antichrist --the claim that there is to be some future THE antichrist is pure personal assumption and pure personal interpretative speculation --- because there is no Bible-verse connection between John's antichrists and these parts of the Bible , , , ■ Daniel 7 ■ 2 Thess 2 ■ Revelation 13 ■ the book of Revelation ■ Ezekiel ■ the "false prophet" ■ the "harlot" ■ the "beast" ■ the "little horn" ■ the "man of sin" {the "man of lawlessness" -- in 2 Thess 2} The Bible mentions antichrist in ONLY these 4 instances. So you MUST make a clear and solid CONNECTION to John's antichrists ---otherwise give up the name "antichrist" and just issue a proclamation that your imagined future "evil man" is called whatever you want to call him --- just don't call him THE "antichrist" or antichrist. 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 _____________ There were many antichrists {plural} in John's day and also many antichrists here in our day. ____________ Here below is a sample of what the fictional "The antichrist doctrine" has produced in the world today --- wild far-fetched un-Biblical personal assumptions and personal speculations without so much as one Bible-Verse to connect John's antichrists with any other parts of the Bible. "11. Resurrected Dead? - "Seemed to have a mortal wound" : Some Bible expositors believe this mortal wound refers to the pagan Roman Empire, which died in the past but will be revived in the end times. Others say a historical character of the past, such as Nero, Judas Iscariot, Mussolini, Hitler, or Stalin, will come back to life and fulfill the role of the antichrist in the end times. Others say the antichrist will actually be killed and then resurrected. Still others say that perhaps the antichrist will be severely wounded, and Satan will supernaturally heal this wound. Perhaps he will simply appear to be killed, though he really is not, and through satanic trickery will appear to be resurrected." https://www.biblestudytools.com/bible-study/topical-studies/the-rise-of-the-antichrist.html

The antichrists mentioned in John's epistles were in John NEAR FUTURE and NOT in John's FAR OFF FUTURE. Pure speculation about John's "future" yet to come antichrist is NOT a COMPELLING argument because the Biblical text nowhere in John's epistles gives any indication that John was saying that the antichrist was in John's FAR OFF FUTURE. That means that John's antichrist appeared in John's NEAR FUTURE and in fact John's epistles clearly support the NEAR FUTURE interpretation. Evidence to support the NEAR FUTURE interpretation is the clear statements in John's epistles that certainly and COMPELLINGLY identify John's antichrists as JOHN'S PRESENT DAY Christian apostates. John clearly said the following about them, and about his present time of the first century: (1) "this is the last hour" (written over 2000 years ago and clearly not a reference to the year 2020) "this is the last hour" is a clear reference to the time when John wrote that, namely the first century. (2) "even NOW many antichrists have come." (John's antichrist were there in the first century) (3) "they went out from us, but they did not really belong to us, For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us, but their going showed that none of them belonged to us" In (3) up there John is clearly speaking about his time of the first century and clearly does NOT have reference to some future time period. So? So the Bible is CLEAR that John's antichrists were first century Christian apostates.

If you want to read some strange far-fetched assumptions and speculations of mere men regarding the fictional character of a future THE antichrist, here is one source: Start quote. https://www.biblestudytools.com/bible-study/topical-studies/the-rise-of-the-antichrist.html 4. Roman Revival - Comparing this text with Daniel 7:16-24 we conclude that the antichrist will rise up from ten kingdoms that will constitute a revived Roman Empire, the final form of Gentile world power before Christ returns. ________________________ 11. Resurrected Dead? - "Seemed to have a mortal wound" (13:3): Some Bible expositors believe this mortal wound refers to the pagan Roman Empire, which died in the past but will be revived in the end times. Others say a historical character of the past, such as Nero, Judas Iscariot, Mussolini, Hitler, or Stalin, will come back to life and fulfill the role of the antichrist in the end times. Others say the antichrist will actually be killed and then resurrected. Still others say that perhaps the antichrist will be severely wounded, and Satan will supernaturally heal this wound. Perhaps he will simply appear to be killed, though he really is not, and through satanic trickery will appear to be resurrected. __________________________ 12. World-Wide Attention - "The whole earth marveled as they followed the beast" (13:3): This event will no doubt make headlines around the world. Internet videos of the event will go viral. Television reports of the event will be shown around the clock. _________________________ 1. The genius of the antichrist. Scripture reveals that the antichrist will be a genius in intellect (Daniel 8:23), commerce (Daniel 11:43; Revelation 13:16-17), war (Revelation 6:2; Revelation 13:2), speech (Daniel 11:36), and politics (Revelation 17:11-12). Source: https://www.biblestudytools.com/bible-study/topical-studies/the-rise-of-the-antichrist.html End quote. ____________________ JAG Writes: The above is just some of the wild assumptions and speculations of mere men regarding the fictional THE antichrist that they predict will come in the future. The article at the link had 13 major points and did NOT one time even attempt to produce a single Bible-Verse that made the connection to any of John's antichrists but totally IGNORED that and proceeded to issue one mere-human-proclamation after another incorrectly assuming that there was a connection between John's antichrists and , , , , ■ Daniel 7 ■ 2 Thess 2 ■ Revelation 13 ■ the book of Revelation ■ Ezekiel ■ the "false prophet" ■ the "harlot" ■ the "beast" ■ the "little horn" ■ the "man of sin" {the "man of lawlessness" -- in 2 Thess 2} _________________ In 1988 Ian Paisley, Evangelical minister and founder of the Free Presbyterian Church of Ulster, made headlines in an infamous manner by accusing Pope John Paul II as the Antichrist during one of the pope's speeches before the European Parliament, which at the time Paisley was member of. His accusation, and the reactions of both Pope John Paul II and other members of the European Parliament, was recorded on video.[78][79] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antichrist#Old_Believers

Dr. Benjamin B. Warfield, one of Christendom's most accomplished and distinguished theologians, provided 3 helpful insights on John's antichrists. {1} John takes his antichrists out of the future and puts them into the present time of the 1st Century. 1 John 2:18 1 John 2:22 1 John 4:3 2 John 7 1 John 2:22-23 Who is the liar? It is whoever denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a person is the antichrist—denying the Father and the Son. No one who denies the Son has the Father; whoever acknowledges the Son has the Father also. 2 John 7 "I say this because many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist 1 John 2:18 and 1 John 4:1-6 and 1 John 2:22-23 and 2 John 7 describes a 1st Century heretical movement, and does NOT predict any future antichrist. _______________________ {2} John expands his antichrists from being one individual to being a multitude {"many antichrists"} 1 John 2:18-19 Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour. They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us _______________________ {3} John reduces his antichrists from being only antichrists persons to being a heresy, that is to say, a heretical movement of the 1st Century 1 John 4:1-6 "Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world. You, dear children, are from God and have overcome them, because the one who is in you is greater than the one who is in the world. They are from the world and therefore speak from the viewpoint of the world, and the world listens to them. We are from God, and whoever knows God listens to us; but whoever is not from God does not listen to us. This is how we recognize the Spirit of truth and the spirit of falsehood." Conclusion: John's antichrists were 1st Century Christian apostates. Proposition: There Is No Bible-Verse Argument For A Future Antichrist

1 John 2:18-19 "Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour. 19They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us."___1 John 2:18-19 _________ Note the particulars in 1 John 2:18-19 (1) "this is the last hour" That compellingly refers to the time of the first century. It CANNOT refer to the year 2020. That would be an absurd interpretation. It CANNOT refer to any future time. Just as it could not refer to the year 950 A.D. Or to the year 1200 A.D. Or to the year 1880 A.D. Or to the year 2018 A.D. It MUST refer ONLY to the time it was written, namely the first century. (2) "even NOW many antichrists have come" The "NOW" refers to the time of the first century. It CANNOT refer to the year 2020. That would be an absurd interpretation. It CANNOT refer to any future time. Just as it could not refer to the year 450 A.D. Or to the year 1100 A.D. Or to the year 1680 A.D. Or to the year 1760 A.D. It MUST refer ONLY to the time it was written, namely the first century. (3) "MANY antichrists have come." "Many is plural. There were many antichrists that had ALREADY come in the time of the first century. It CANNOT refer to any future time. It CANNOT refer to the year 2020. That would be an absurd interpretation. Just as it could not refer to the year 450 A.D. Or to the year 1000 A.D. Or to the year 1480 A.D. Or to the year 1260 A.D. It MUST refer ONLY to the time it was written, namely the first century. (4) "They went out from us. but they did not belong to us" This compellingly is a reference to the first century, when John wrote 1 John. It CANNOT refer to any future time. It CANNOT refer to the year 2020. That would be an absurd interpretation. Just as it could not refer to the year 450 A.D. Or to the year 850 A.D. Or to the year 1380 A.D. Or to the year 1860 A.D. It MUST refer ONLY to the time it was written, namely the first century. JAG Conclusion: John's antichrists were 1st Century Christian apostates.

Douggg, You have no Bible-Verse arguments that can connect John's antichrists with any other parts of the Bible. so you then seek to demonize the message with accusations of "holding a false doctrine teaching"---and in so doing you also demonize me because it is a sin to hold and proclaim "a false doctrine teaching." _______________________ Douggg, I write the following to you. I am an orthodox Bible believing born again Christian. My wife and I attend a Bible believing Baptist-type Christian church along with our grown children and our 6 grandchildren. I believe the following with all my mind, heart, and soul: I believe in the Holy Trinity of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. I believe in the Deity of the Lord Jesus. That He is fully God. (John 1: 1-5) I believe in the Virgin Birth of the Lord Jesus. I believe in the Resurrection of the Lord Jesus. I believe that the Bible is the inspired word of God and free from all error. (2 Timothy 3:14-17) I believe in the Second Coming of the Lord Jesus. I believe in a coming Judgment. I believe that salvation is by grace through faith in the Lord Jesus' death on the Cross where He died to pay for our sins. Ephesians 2:8 I believe in John 3:16 with all my heart. I believe in all the orthodox doctrinal Protestant Creeds. That is, I am a Bible believing Protestant in my faith and practice. I am an orthodox Bible believing Postmillennialist. I do NOT hold to a single weird or strange or unusual belief. Postmillennialism is a mainstream orthodox Bible believing view of the future of the human race and of the future of the Christian Church. I can easily post a list of the names of dozens of Christian Postmillennial scholars who believe the Bible is the word of God and 100% true --- but who DISAGREE with Premillennialists on what the Holy Scriptures teach with regard to the end time passages. There is nothing unorthodox about Postmillennialism or Premillennialism or Amillennialism or Dispensationalism. There are large segments within Bible Believing Christendom that holds different views of the future of the human race and the future of the Christian Church. There are 4 of them. All 4 are fully orthodox and fully Christian. (1) Postmillennialism (2) Premillennialism (3) Amillennialism (4) Dispensationalism _____________________ May the Lord bless and keep us. May the Lord make His face to shine upon us. May the Lord be gracious unto us. May the Lord turn His face toward us. May the Lord give us His protection and His peace. (Based upon Numbers 6:24-27) JAG Proposition: There Is No Bible-Verse Argument For A Future Antichrist