kenny2212

4 hours ago, warrior12 said:

Ok. So you see why the man of God was killed.  The man of God telling the king what the Lord commanded him not to do was not a sin.  You fail to see, that the moral of that situation was, the man of God, did not obey the Lord commandments. It has nothing to do what the other prophet sons overheard.   

The Lord can and does allow trials to his servants, even us here, so , this may have been a test for the man of God and he did not stand steadfast on the word of God and paid the consequence.  Really hope you see that.  Thanks for the talk.

The events that led to his disobedience to the Word of the Lord wouldn't have happened if he hadn't shared that information with the king, which the sons of the older prophet heard and told their father. 

If the man of God had just said that he didn't want food, without telling the king "For so it was commanded me by the word of the Lord, saying, 'You shall not eat bread, nor drink water, nor return by the same way you came.' ", the sons of the older prophet wouldn't have heard that to tell their father. Sharing of this info led to the subsequent events that led to his death.

I'm not saying that telling the king what the Lord commanded not to do was a sin, I'm saying it was unwise. It was a precursor to following events.

40 minutes ago, warrior12 said:

You are still in denial of the fact, the reason the man of God was killed, was of his disobedience of the Lord told him not to do.  Does not matter what the older prophet knew, the man of God died because he went away from what God told him not to do.

I showed you in scripture black and white. Come on, this is very obvious. Why are you still defending the idea, that a prophet should not reveal himself.

The Lord is the Lord of host, he can send his prophets in any place he chooses and no one can touch them if he does not want them to be harmed.

 

I know he was killed because of his disobedience but the older prophet wouldn't have known his whereabouts if his sons hadn't told their father what they heard the man of God tell the king.

4 minutes ago, warrior12 said:

The man of God was killed, because of "DISOBEDIANCE".  He disobeyed the word of the Lord.

Surely kenny2112, you have read the whole chapter in full.  Plus the man of God was sent there on assignment by THE LORD.

1 Kings 13. 1 And behold, a man of God came out of Judah by the word of the Lord to Bethel.

1 Kings 13   English Standard Version

²⁶ And when the prophet who had brought him back from the way heard of it, he said, “It is the man of God who disobeyed the word of the Lord; therefore the Lord has given him to the lion, which has torn him and killed him, according to the word that the Lord spoke to him.”

The older prophet knew of the movements of the man of God from Judah because his sons told him what they heard the man of God tell the king. 

9 hours ago, warrior12 said:

No, that was not why the prophet was killed by a lion in that episode.  The title of the chapter said it plainly.  Maybe, you can post  again why the prophet died.

1 Kings 13:7-9 (NKJV) - 7 Then the king said to the man of God, "Come home with me and refresh yourself, and I will give you a reward." 8 But the man of God said to the king, "If you were to give me half your house, I would not go in with you; nor would I eat bread nor drink water in this place. 9 FOR SO IT WAS COMMANDED ME BY THE WORD OF THE LORD, SAYING, 'YOU SHALL NOT EAT BREAD, NOR DRINK WATER, NOR RETURN BY THE SAME WAY YOU CAME.' "

1 Kings 13:11 (NKJV) - Now an old prophet dwelt in Bethel, and his sons came and told him all the works that the man of God had done that day in Bethel; they also told their father THE WORDS WHICH HE HAD SPOKEN TO THE KING.

The man of God shared too much information. Mixing the mundane with work.

8 hours ago, warrior12 said:

God has an array of beings that he uses for his purposes.  The angels serve in many different capacities and are invisible beings, that can manifest into the physical as God uses them in his work.   

Prophets on the other hand are God messengers whom he uses to proclaim his warnings, decrees and other to his servants here on earth.  This is what I at least see in the historical accounts in the bible.   

Anyway thank you for your replies.

You are right. But Mundane Matters need to be separated from Work.

31 minutes ago, FJK said:

What's the purpose of being a Prophet then?  Why would God send a Prophet  and keep himself and his prophecies a secret from the people?

Did the Prophets of old keep themselves and their prophecies secret from others so that nobody knew of them?

Maybe I'm not understanding what you're saying, but that is what comes to me as I read your post.

To what end should they be known? Their prophecies should of course be known but not they themselves. Being known is what led to the death of the Man of God who God sent to prophesy at Bethel (1 Kings 13).

10 hours ago, warrior12 said:

There are many on youtube, and other medium, the Church and other who say they are, but as I asked you the questions before, how are they really known.

It's not God's aim that his prophets be known in the world and by humans as prophets. Like I said, being a prophet is God-ward. One is a prophet because God says that one is a prophet. 

Why would people want to know if an individual is prophet? How does it benefit the knower or the known? So that the knower can heap all of their life's spiritual problems on the known? Only God can really solve spiritual problems. A true prophet shouldn't seek to be known by people.

God definitely knows the true prophets. 

3 hours ago, warrior12 said:

How do you define a prophet in today's language, or what yardstick is used to determine who is a prophet. what attributes does a prophet has to have before he can hold that title.

I know some especially in the Pentecostal church uses the term or name to denote their pastor .  So, it really is a matter of first give a description of a modern day prophet as we in today society would use the name and second what really is his role in using that title for.  

Some again when hearing the title prophet, would run the thought that this person gets revelation from God himself in a personal direct matter to warn, foretell if you understand what I mean .   So it's really how we use the term and name prophet and the context or capacity that he uses the title for.  Thanks

 As far as I know, being a prophet is God-ward. One is a prophet only because God holds that individual is a prophet (Jeremiah 1:4). It doesn't matter what humans think, because humans can be wrong. God can never be wrong.

1 hour ago, warrior12 said:

So let's ask the question, what is the role of a modern day prophet ?. Also, what are the qualifications of that prophet, he has to be accurate 100 percent of the time, cause God does not give false prophecies.   

So, if you question there are 8 billion people on earth, and even one is given the gift, it is not to be a secret, it should be to speak and warn or so as the prophets of old.  So, who on earth today has prophesied with an 100 percent accuracy.

Just thought of something, if a man was given one prophecy and it came true in some simple terms, then that can qualify him to  be a prophet. 

Indeed , God does speak to man today, but my question is in what manner does this occur.  Is it audible, where an actual voice is heard, or by spiritual discernment or others.  You see, when someone declares that he is a prophet, in what manner does he declare his message.  Is it in foretelling future events or saying, thus say the Lord.  

If men are untrue in their declaration, then that sure damnation of their souls.

On the other hand, if they truly has received that chosen status, then they cannot be silent and proclaim the message.

The Prophet, whether in the Old testament or the New testament is a conduit for God's voice. God will not speak loud into the air like he did to the Israelites in Exodus 19:19. The difference between the Old testament Prophet and the New testament Prophet is that the Old testament prophet speaks God's Words and proffers a solution (2 Sam. 24:11-13; 18); the New testament Prophet just speaks God's Words (Acts 11:28-30). Now notice Agabus didn't suggest a solution; he just only told them what would happen. His audience took their own initiative.

1 hour ago, R. Hartono said:

That was 2000 years ago.

Matthew 23 speaks of all bunch of hypocrites, the same things nowadays, most socalled prophets are merely profit.

Are you saying that out of the close to 8 billion people on the earth right now there is not one prophet?! Jesus said "Teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age." Why would Jesus tell his disciples to make new disciples if he's just going to ignore the new disciples? There are prophets on the earth right now. I might not be one, you might not be one. We neither might not know of any but they exist on the earth right now. God knows them and they know God. 

"Trust me, it's not at the door. You'll be shocked".

5 hours ago, R. Hartono said:

Of course but there is no more prophet like Jeremiah in OT or Agabus in NT in this modern Times. 

What makes Jeremiah and Agabus so special?

4 hours ago, R. Hartono said:

Its Bible who says Agabus, Judas and Silas were prophets who lived during John the baptist era who was martyred. I agree with that because Bible says it. Its actually the gift of prophecy which is one of the nine gifts of Holy Spirit. Because Agabus, Judas or Silas did not add anything to the Bible.

But if you refer to someone as a prophet in this modern time, its you who claim it, not God.

God message is completed in OT and NT, God do not need to send another prophet to add the Bible.

What goodness for you to claim here is prophet, there is a prophet ?

As God says it the law and the prophet were until John. What do this mean to you ?

 

R. Hartono, we are not saying anybody should add to the bible! What we are saying is if God desires to get a message across to someone, He might send a prophet to them.

Jeremiah 35:15 (NKJV) -  I have also sent to you all My servants the PROPHETS, rising up early and sending them, saying, 'Turn now everyone from his evil way, amend your doings, and do not go after other gods to serve them; then you will dwell in the land which I have given you and your fathers.' But you have not inclined your ear, NOR OBEYED ME.

Acts 21:10-11 (NKJV) -  10 And as we stayed many days, a certain PROPHET named Agabus came down from Judea. 11 When he had come to us, he took Paul's belt, bound his own hands and feet, and said, "THUS SAYS THE HOLY SPIRIT, 'So shall the Jews at Jerusalem bind the man who owns this belt, and deliver him into the hands of the Gentiles.' "

7 hours ago, FJK said:

I can see your point here as a valid one.

But:

In the days of Jeremiah we didn't have Holy Spirit to speak to us, since the Pentecost we do so prophets are no longer needed for God to speak to his creation.

Maybe that is why Jesus warned us of false prophets to come, that we should look out for them and not find ourselves deceived.

Just my thoughts.

The Hebrew word for Prophet is "navi". It means to "to proclaim". The Prophet is the Evangelist under the Old Covenant while the Evangelist is the Prophet under the New Covenant. So, as long as there are still Evangelists, there will be Prophets. Besides - Eph. 4:11 (NKJV) (A New Testament Scripture) - And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers... 

4 hours ago, R. Hartono said:

The gift of prophecy is one of 9 gifts of Holy Spirit. 

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1 Corinthians 12%3A8-10&version=KJV 

But does not make someone a prophet like John the baptist or other Old Testament prophets like Moses, Elijah, Jeremiah etc.

Because the Law and the prophets were until John.

Prophets of Old Testament communicated directly with Elohim. Which is a big difference.

I did not open his link, its insecure. So i don't know what Kenny is referring to.

 

The only way there would longer be any prophets is if God no longer speaks to his creation.

Jeremiah 35:15 (NKJV) -  ¹⁵ I have also sent to you all My servants the prophets, rising up early and sending them, saying, 'Turn now everyone from his evil way, amend your doings, and do not go after other gods to serve them; then you will dwell in the land which I have given you and your fathers.' But you have not inclined your ear, NOR OBEYED ME.

Connect the dots.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1YMfFlZ3makADciZas1zRmUsaTwXTeO7AqgYExUtliOo/edit?usp=sharing

4 hours ago, Montana Marv said:

My vengeance for others was nailed on the Cross.  We are to ask for forgiveness for those who harm us, not revenge.   Their blood should have been avenged 2000 years ago when Jesus died on the Cross, not in the future.  Yet if they are not N.T. Believers filled with the Holy Spirit as we are, then they can ask for retribution.

In Christ

Montana Marv

So no reward for wrongdoing? One may forgive but God will still reward. Only repented deeds will not be rewarded. Forgiveness frees the victim, repentance frees the perpetrator.

1 hour ago, Montana Marv said:

I look at these under the Altar by their request.  Avenge our blood

If one looks at Stephen the first Church Martyr who was stoned. His request; Lord do not hold this sin against them.  Big contrast,  both ends of the scale.

We as Believers are to bless and not to ask for a curse upon someone.  For we already know, Vengeance is mine, says the Lord.  No need for us to ask for retribution as members of the Church, the Bride of Christ.  They must be a malignancy of the true Church then, or not of the Church at all.

In Christ

Montana Marv

The souls under the altar didn't ask for vengeance, they asked how long till vengeance. There's a significant difference between asking for vengeance and asking how long till vengeance. Surely the Lord will repay.

Romans 12:19b (NKJV) - For it is written "Vengeance is Mine, I will repay," says the Lord.

So the issue isn't asking for God to avenge (for he will), the issue is being able to wait patiently for the time when He avenges.

Revelation 6:9-11 (NKJV) - 9 When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held. 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, "How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?" 11 Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed. 

7 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

Could someone, anyone, give me a SINGLE verse


showing us to be spirits without bodies at anytime or in any place?

Luke 24:39 (NKJV) - Behold My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself. Handle Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones (a body) as you see I have." (Emphasis mine)

Spirit - The NON-PHYSICAL part of a person regarded as their true self and as capable of SURVIVING PHYSICAL DEATH OR SEPARATION.

8 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

"For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living." Romans 14:9 KJV

Might (modal verb) - Used to express the POSSIBILITY that something will happen or be done.

Jesus Christ is already the Lord of believers and it is POSSIBLE He will become the Lord of former unbelieving (of which we are all part) believers.

21 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

8And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things

Yes of course Angels have bodies; spiritual bodies.

25 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

29Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.

30For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

31But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying,

32I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.

I understand what you're saying. Notice Jesus said "In the Resurrection." One gets a spiritual body at the Resurrection not before.

34 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

Show it

The Parable of the Rich Man and Lazarus (Luke 16:19-31).

39 minutes ago, Selah7 said:

Yes.  Don’t forget about the millennium.  Many unbelievers who never had a chance will be taught and converted at this time.

Sinners are rebellious against the Lord. They refuse to put themselves under the canopy of the Lord. Our Lord Jesus Christ is not their Lord.

Ezekiel 2:3 (NKJV) - Then He said to me "Son of man, I am sending you to the children of Israel, to a rebellious nation that has REBELLED against me; they and their fathers have TRANSGRESSED against me to this very day.

33 minutes ago, Selah7 said:

Yes, I read it.   uh, but what are trying to point out?

IS OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST THE LORD OF UNBELIEVERS TOO?

37 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

I am not erasing this time.  God help.   OK

Abraham and Lazarus chatting both having died and their first bodies going back to dust.  

WHAT bodies are they in?  Since I can't erase again, I'll just stop with that




 

DeighAnn, when people die now their spirits (disembodied) live on. At the Resurrection they get spiritual BODIES (their physical bodies, spirits and souls get changed into spiritual bodies).

The spiritual body is one entity unlike our present tripartite (spirit, soul, body) existence.

All spiritual bodies can die. One would have to eat the fruit of the Tree of Life to live forever.

Genesis 3:22-23 (NKJV) - Then the Lord God said, "Behold, the man has become like one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever"- 23 therefore the Lord God sent him out of the garden of Eden to till the ground from which he was taken. 

What Paul meant by "immortality" is not being able to grow old and die.

Why spirits don't die in hell now is because they are DISEMBODIED (no body) spirits. You guys should connect the dots. 

I am of the viewpoint that all creation is subject to God, the Creator.