Shilohsfoal

Daniel 8:9

And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.
 

They say send more weapons to the little horn in the pleasant land because he's God's chosen and he is our ally .

Thats where his power comes from

Daniel 8

²⁴ And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise, and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people.

So many times have I been accused of hating the beast.I don't hate the beast,I simply don't worship the beast.I see it for what it is.

Once everyone in the land of Israel are receiving the mark of the beast,what are these people going to be saying then?

I'm sure they will still be telling me I hate the beast.

30 minutes ago, Jedi4Yahweh said:

You are blinded by your hate for Israel.  Israel has always wanted peace and has bent over backwards at their expense to help facilitate peace with its neighbors.  Hamas does not want peace nor is willing to even discuss peace with Israel.  They want the complete annihilation of the Jewish state and its people.  In fact the Israeli concert Hamas invaded and killed so many people at was an event supporting peace between Israel and Palestinians.  You talk about how Israel is intentionally targeting women and children which is absolutely absurd...but you got Hamas who literally is targeting women and children and murdering them in cold blood yet you turn a blind eye and point the finger at Israel.  The spirit of hate you represent towards Israel is not of God.

So they were having an event promoting peace on land they took from palestinians.lol

And no I don't hate Israel.I love Jesus.

I dislike the beast which calls itself Israel.

Been worshiping the beast long have you?

Daniel 8

²⁴ And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise, and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people.

Sing a song of his power and might.

I can see this thread is turning into a beast worshiping thread

2 hours ago, Jedi4Yahweh said:

There is collateral civilian damage in every war and Ukraine is not an exception.   Israel has always taken great strides to prevent collateral damage.  On the other hand Hamas and other Islamic militant groups do not have a care in the world if you are a innocent civilian (man, women, teenage, or child) or military target, they will kill you regardless and with much gladness for Allah.  If you don't see the difference your the one that is blind.   

In fact, Hamas does even care about killing their own people using them as human shields, using schools, hospitals, and masques for missile launch sites and military hideouts.  I was reading reports where Israel was forewarning civilians in Gaza to leave the area before the bombing, but Hamas would not let them leave and even killed the ones who tried to leave.

False

Israel is shooting first and asking questions later.

Proof of this is Israel soldiers shooting and killing three unarmed ,unshirted Israeli hostages carrying a white flag with their hands up.They were not human shields or whatever nonsense you can make to to justify murder.

Yes your eyes are blinded.Maybe someday your eyes will be opened to the truth.But that day is not today.

1 hour ago, Jedi4Yahweh said:

I agree 100%...but do you have the same sentiment that US is giving weapons to Ukraine?

Ever since Israel went to war with Hamas after the deadly attack.  We have heard global leaders demanding Israel to cease fire or else and that Israel must come to a peace agreement with Hamas. 

Where is this same demand for Ukraine and Russia to come to a peace agreement?  Nope, all we hear is that we need to continue too fund the war Ukraine.

Ukraine isn't targeting civilians like Israel is Ukraine is targeting Russia military and infrastructure.Israrl is bombing everything .Just the other day they targeted three food aid trucks.Israrl has killed civilians in hospitals ,houses and even a church.

If you can't see the difference between Ukraine's fight with Russia's millitary and Israels fight with Palestinian women and children then there's a problem with your eyes.

The rest of the world can see the problem,why can't you?

10 hours ago, Jedi4Yahweh said:

 

Do you have the same sentiment regarding US sending weapons to Ukraine?

I believe the US should sit down with Ukraine and Russia and find a deal.Maybe give Russia some land and let the rest of Ukraine enter NATO.

Russia is not going to loose the war.It will nuke Ukraine before it loses so the best thing for Ukraine is to end it.

Give Putin a little win so he can save face and end the conflict before Putin decides to wipe Ukraine off he map.

6 hours ago, Jonathan Dane said:

Says who?

Here's a list of the world's largest empires. If you scroll down to the Timeline of the largest empires at the time, you see that Rome was the largest from 250 to 300 A.D. Prior to 250, only China was larger. We're talking about the Western and Middle Eastern biblical world that involved Daniel's people, THE JEWS, not the Far East. 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_empires

Besides, I didn't say it was the largest or "the best," whatever the heck that means. LOL. I said it was "larger than its predecessors."

Says everyone who knows.Anyone who says Rome was the world power of its day has never heard of the Han dynasty.They are mostly ignorant of the world .

In terms of territorial extent and population, the Han Dynasty (China) was bigger than the Roman Empire. At its height in the second century AD, the Han Empire covered approximately 6.5 million square kilometers and had a population of around 60 million people.

7 hours ago, Jonathan Dane said:

Correct about Gog and Magog. (I ironically corrected that in my book revision.) However, my point had to do with Islam. I believe that many Muslims may come to faith in Christ after God miraculously intercedes on the side of Israel. (That may be hopeful speculation on my part.) That battle also may be the catalyst the Antichrist uses to step in to broker a covenant between Israel and her surrounding neighbors.

To suggest that Israel was not destroyed in 70 A.D. is ridiculous. That flies in the face of Jesus's prophecy that not one stone of the temple would be left standing. History tells us that the fire was so hot that the gold melted and poured down between the cracks of the stones. The Roman soldiers literally turned over every stone of the temple to get to the gold.

Saying that Jerusalem was not destroyed because the section of the wall was left standing is like saying that the World Trade Center was not destroyed because a section of the metal pilings was left standing. If that is the apologetic for Islamic End-time Theory, neither does it have more than a few tattered pilings left standing.

Daniel did not mention the "name" Rome. However 

- given that Rome came on the heels of and conquered the third beast, Greece

-given that Rome was more terrifying, powerful, and larger than its predecessors

- given that Rome both nailed Jesus to the cross and destroyed Israel in 70 AD

Rome is the natural deduction.

Rome was not even the largest empire of its time.It was second best of its time.

38 minutes ago, tatwo said:

Fantastic!...<Big laugh> so Shilohesque

Tatwo...:)

Mathew 24:31

And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.

In case you haven't noticed ,the two witnesses are removed from the kingdom before the trumpet is blown.Not when it is blown.

The two witnesses are removed first.

Mathew 13:30

Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.’”
 

And they ascended into heaven in a cloud.

1 hour ago, tatwo said:

Shilohsfoal and whomever...

In regard to Revelation 11...I know "whose witnesses" they are...and I know who is "speaking" in vs. 3 and whose "power" it is that they operate with.

I know what and who the "two witnesses" are...I know who the "two olive trees and the two lampstands standing before the God of the earth" are...I know what the "fire" is that "proceeds from their mouths."

I know what it means to have the power to "shut heaven so that no rain falls"...I know what it means to "turn water into blood" I know what it means to "strike the earth with plagues"...I know what it means to "finish their testimony."

I know what is meant by..."the beast that ascends out of the bottomless pit"...I know what is meant by..."will make war against them overcome them and kill them." 

For those who do not know these things...the hour is later than you realize...and you are likely much more "spiritually immature" that you should be.

Revelation is the book of culminations...and as such...all of these references...symbolic, metaphoric, figurative, literal, analogous, types, and shadows on earth and in heaven are explained, interpreted and revealed from Genesis 1:1 on.

Even still...one must have this "revelation from Yahshua Himself"...the Holy Spirit...if you are a "messenger" you will have received your revelation and understanding of it...if not...you should listen to those who have...that is unless you are one of these who in seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand.  

John 14:21 NKJV  "He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and manifest Myself to him."

Joh 16:13-15 NKJV  "However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come.  (14)  He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you.  (15)  All things that the Father has are Mine. Therefore I said that He will take of Mine and declare it to you."

That's how the Royal Priest Himself set it up...that is how one receives the understanding of "Truth"..."what is to come"..."declaring what is His to me"...

The hour is late and to still be debating scriptural understanding from 100, 300, 500 and more years ago is the folly of being in the outer court of the temple.

Tatwo...:) 

Well,I honestly don't know the two witnesses names yet.But I probably will next year.

2 hours ago, tatwo said:

Shilohsfoal responded to my question...

"Whose witnesses are they" by posting..."Jesus" as their answer.

Tatwo then asked "Who is speaking in Revelation 11:3?" to which Shilohsfoal responded..."Their Lord was crucified" I merely accepted that as your answer.

Caught yourself in the trap of your own tongue/words...which is exactly what I expected would occur since it is how you operate here.

Tatwo...:)

Christ is Lord.

Do you have a problem with that?

17 minutes ago, tatwo said:

No...we were working on your challenge to me...I will quote you verbatim...

"If you show me where Jesus commands his witnesses to kill and torment other people ,then you can say I make things up."

This serves as a case in point Shiloh...not only do you just "make things up" you are scattered all over in the thoughts of your soul Shilosfoal.

Tatwo...:)

Yet,you still have not showed one verse where Jesus tells anyone to kill and torment people 

You have not met the challenge.

I'm still waiting for you to post that quote of Jesus.

8 hours ago, warrior12 said:

 

A question for you.  In verse 2 "and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months>"  Who is being referred to there ?.   

What is the meaning of this verse, can you explain it ?.

The gentiles treading jerusalem.under foot for forty two months is the king of the norths armed forces.

Revelation 11:31

³¹ “His armed forces will rise up to desecrate the temple fortress and will abolish the daily sacrifice. Then they will set up the abomination that causes desolation.

AKA

Revelation 13

¹¹ And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.

¹² And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.

¹³ And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,

The saints in Israel are imprisoned and murdered during those 42 months.

51 minutes ago, Jonathan Dane said:

I am exiting the weeds. (These conversations only end when one does.)

General observation: Your hermeneutic does not align with a single biblical scholar I am aware of. That does not make it wrong but only suspect.

Your applications of these passages contain novel and specific (detailed) application, as when you say, "the beast attacks the U.S." These kinds of statements are not inherent to the text themselves (exegesis) but are the conclusion of presuppositions that stem from your novel system of interpretation, resulting in eisegesis. Why does the Beast attack the U.S.? Because your foregone presumption based on your "system" demands that it does. I think your foregone conclusions are incorrect. And when I try to show you that from the text, you move on to the next "proof text." No offense intended, but I have had a ministry to the cults for years. I've seen this tactic often.

My basic hermeneutic and system of theology aligns with those found at seminaries such as Dallas Theological and Grace Seminary in Southern California, which align with dispensational theology from its inception. Where I vary is on the minutia—identifying the AC before the Rapture. That's pretty much it. 

At the end of the day, I will sooner pin Jello to a wall than pin you down. Again, I am all too familiar with these kinds of exchanges.

I mean you no offense. I appreciate your passion and interest. I just think you have some fundamental weaknesses in your hermeneutic, and hence, your system.

The beast from the abyss attacks the US right here.Its because you believe the beast that ascends from the abyss is the king of the north,you can't understand who attacks the king of the north.lol

Perhaps you should try to understand the past before trying to understand the future.Read about the the US /Iraq wars in the bible and you might start understanding more.

Daniel 11:40

At the time of the end the king of the South will engage him in battle, and the king of the North will storm out against him with chariots and cavalry and a great fleet of ships. He will invade many countries and sweep through them like a flood.

Daniel 11:44

But reports from the east and the north will alarm him, and he will set out in a great rage to destroy and annihilate many.

This is when the US armed forces place the abomination that causes desolation.(Nuke)

Look closely and you can see the lake of fire.

"And they ascended into heaven in a cloud."

1 hour ago, WilliamL said:

Nope. This Man of Sin is destroyed at the Parousia (2:8), which is also the time of the Rapture. 1 Thes. 4:15-17

The Beast does not ascend from the Abyss (Rev. 11:7; 17:8) until after the Abyss is opened at the 5th Trumpet (Rev. 9:1-2). Whereas the raptured saints are seen in Rev. 7 in heaven (7:9ff), before the trumpets are blown.

PS

Here is where the man of sin comes to his end.Notice the verse after his end the rapture and resurrection takes place 

Daniel 11:45

And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.

Daniel 12:1-2

And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt

#1-Man of sin comes to his end-

"yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him."

#2-Rapture-

"at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book."

#3-Resurection-

"many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt"

1 hour ago, WilliamL said:

Nope. This Man of Sin is destroyed at the Parousia (2:8), which is also the time of the Rapture. 1 Thes. 4:15-17

The Beast does not ascend from the Abyss (Rev. 11:7; 17:8) until after the Abyss is opened at the 5th Trumpet (Rev. 9:1-2). Whereas the raptured saints are seen in Rev. 7 in heaven (7:9ff), before the trumpets are blown.

The beast from the abyss attacks Jerusalem and kills the two witnesses 3.5 days before the resurrection.

That's the same day the abomination of desolation  Is placed in Jerusalem by the armed forces  of the man of sin.Evidence the abomination of desolation is used on that day is the great earthquake in Jerusalem and the cloud that ascends into heaven from Jerusalem on that day.

6 minutes ago, Jonathan Dane said:

Well, Judas was certainly a "type of Christ" and who is also called the Son of Perdition (John 17:12)

Acts 17:12 (KJV) says that Judas went "to his own place."

Rev 11:7 depicts a "beast arising from the pit."

There is a link between Judas and the Antichrist as they are the only two called the Son of Perdition." Exactly WHAT is the nature of that link remains to be seen.

2 Thess 2 depicts the Man of Sin in the temple proclaiming himself "God," which I believe coincides with the Beast arising from the pit. 

Do I believe DT is that "thing?" Not in totality. But he is the candidate.

The beast that raises from.the abyss attacks the United states and Israel.

Same as the king of the south in Daniel 11:40.It takes place 3.5 days before the US nukes Jerusalem along with the rest of the middle east.

11 minutes ago, Jonathan Dane said:

"Jerusalem will be trampled underfoot by the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled." (Luke 21:34)

Trump has not given the  Israeli government  the gentiles yet.

The gentiles occupy Jerusalem for 42 months.They don't govern it.

Revelation 11:2

² But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

1 minute ago, Jonathan Dane said:

There is a historic "Little Horn" (Antiochus Epiphanes) and an end-time Little Horn (the Antichrist, whom I believe is Donald Trump). Both are PERSONS.

But again, you're dodging. I asked you where (as in "elsewhere") in the Bible a system of government was called by the masculine pronoun "HE." You are now arguing in a circle by using your previous false assumptions regarding the Little Horn as an answer to my question. 

Well,as I have showed ,the king of the north does not govern the land of Israel which is given to.the saints 

He moves the tabernacle of his palace (embassy)to Jerusalem.But he doesn't govern it.

The little horn does.

Mathew 23:34-38

Therefore I am sending you prophets and sages and teachers. Some of them you will kill and crucify; others you will flog in your synagogues and pursue from town to town.

And so upon you will come all the righteous blood that has been shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar.
Truly I tell you, all this will come on this generation.

Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing.

Look, your house is left to you desolate.

Just now, Jonathan Dane said:

The saints pictured here in the geographical location of Israel, the "beloved city" being a reference to Jerusalem.

And who governed the land of Israel before it was given to those saints?

Daniel 7

²⁵ And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

²⁶ But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end.

²⁷ And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

I will give you a hint,it's not Donald Trump.

4 minutes ago, Jonathan Dane said:

Okay. Very good. And since this thread is so long, remind me where exactly the "Little Horn calls itself Israel." No hoops. Just a verse or two will do. Thanks.

If you don't want to believe Israel exists,that's fine with me.

46 minutes ago, Jonathan Dane said:

Can you show me one other place in Scripture where the masculine pronoun "he" is used to describe a "government?" I do not claim to be either a scholar of Hebrew or Greek, but I think you are making serious tense errors with the grammar. Can you also show where the Bible says that "systems" are thrown into the Lake of Fire as is indicated for the Beast and False Prophet in Rev. 19:20?

I can show you two different kings called by the same name.

Daniel 11:36

The king will do as he pleases. He will exalt and magnify himself above every god and will say unheard-of things against the God of gods. He will be successful until the time of wrath is completed, for what has been determined must take place.

In scripture this man is called the king of the north.You call his by the name Donald Trump.But there are other kings of the north who lived in the same house.For instance.Before Donald Trump came to power,there was a raiser of taxes who lived in that house.Do you call him.donald Trump or Barack Obama?

And before the raised of taxes there was another king of the north in scripture who invaded the south and turned to an island and took many.Do you call that king of the north Donald Trump or do you call him GW Bush?

And we can go back to the first mentioned king of the north who's fortress was destroyed.Do you call that king of the north Donald Trump or do you call him Ronald Reagan?

See there have been many kings of the north in scripture,not just one.But they are all called ,king of the north.

It's the same with the little horn.There hasnt just been one prime minister ,but many.The person who was prime minister when the little horn defeated the three other horns is not the same prime minister today.

28 minutes ago, Jonathan Dane said:

What happens at the end of Rev. 2o takes place at the end of the Millennium. You are playing mix-and-match with biblical texts.

The point is,their location.

Do you not realize where those saints live and the kingdom that was given to them 1000 years before?

Revelation 20

⁹ And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

Where are these saints and who governed that land before they received it?