LightShinesInTheDarkness

I hate to say it, but for evangelical Christianity to shake its finger at the Roman Catholic "church" today would be rather hypocritical, given the apostasy within true Christianity. The church needs to look to her own sickness and see to her own sins before she can say anything about Catholicism. We should take care not to let the business of a false church distract us from addressing the wretched condition of the true church, which is embracing and teaching anything and everything, out of greed, selfish ambition and ignorance. The church needs to remember what she believes and who she serves before she can be fit to tell others what they should believe and who they should serve, lest she be guilty of winning others to a false Christ, and of "Christianizing" spiritually unregenerate people, just like the Catholics have been doing for centuries. I would see people come to the Lord in truth, and to be instructed in and walk in the faith that was delivered to us, as it was delivered to us; but I have no zeal for adding more dead bodies to the unspiritual, unScriptural monster that evangelical Christianity has become, to make it prosper, for the pleasure of the deceived and of the people who are profiting from their deception, just as the Roman Catholic "church" does from its converts. You must know what Christianity teaches in order to teach others to follow it. And you must teach Christ correctly in order for others to be able to know what is of Him and what is not. Know your God and the faith well, and you will discern what and who is not of Him, whether it comes to you from Catholicism or from some other sect or cult that claims Jesus but teaches a different Jesus and heresies in His name.

"I tell you, My friends, do not fear those who kill the body, and after that have nothing more that they can do. But I will warn you whom to fear: fear Him who, after He has killed, has authority to cast into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear Him!" (Luke 12:4,5)

In a way, it's a blessing and a disadvantage to have our religious freedoms presently protected by our government in the USA. Christians here have it easy compared to Christians in other parts of the world. But compare the faith and spirituality of those persecuted Christians to the faith and spirituality of the majority of Christians here, and you can see why I say that that blessing can be a disadvantage. The danger to the Christian in the west is not having his or her head chopped off (not yet anyway), but the danger of being choked by the cares and pleasures of life and the deceitfulness of riches; of becoming comfortable in Babylon, being influenced by her ways and enticed by her offerings, and of becoming spiritually wretched like the Laodiceans. It's far better to be poor and persecuted but blessed (as Jesus said), and to lose your head for Christ, than it is to be happy, prosperous and comfortable, but a failure as a saint, and to be vomited out of Christ. Make no mistake about it: There are PLENTY of dangers for Christians in the west, but they are of the spiritual kind rather than the physical kind---and the former is far more dangerous to a Christian than the latter.

He (the antichrist) shall seduce with flattery those who violate the covenant, but the people who know their God shall stand firm and take action. And the wise among the people shall make many understand, though for some days they shall stumble by sword and flame, by captivity and plunder. (Daniel 11:33) Many shall purify themselves and make themselves white and be refined, but the wicked shall act wickedly. And none of the wicked shall understand, but those who are wise shall understand. (Daniel 12:10)

"But behold, some survivors will be left in it (Jerusalem), sons and daughters who will be brought out; behold, when they come out to you, and you see their ways and their deeds, you will be consoled for the disaster that I have brought upon Jerusalem, for all that I have brought upon it. They will console you, when you see their ways and their deeds, and you shall know that I have not done without cause all that I have done in it, declares the Lord GOD." (Ezekiel 14:22,23) After this I looked, and behold, a great multitude that no one could number, from every nation, from all tribes and peoples and languages, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed in white robes, with palm branches in their hands, and crying out with a loud voice, "Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!" ...Then one of the elders addressed me, saying, "Who are these, clothed in white robes, and from where have they come?" I said to him, "Sir, you know." And he said to me, "These are the ones coming out of the great tribulation. They have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. "Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple; and He who sits on the throne will shelter them with His presence. They shall hunger no more, neither thirst anymore; the sun shall not strike them, nor any scorching heat. For the Lamb in the midst of the throne will be their Shepherd, and He will guide them to springs of living water, and God will wipe away every tear from their eyes." (Revelation 7:9,10,13-17)

In faithfulness, by God's grace, there is only victory, whether it be by death or by life. Whoever would save his life will lose it, but whoever loses His life for the Lord's sake will keep it. Here is a call for the endurance of the saints, those who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus. And I heard a voice from heaven saying, "Write this: Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from now on." "Blessed indeed," says the Spirit, "that they may rest from their labors, for their deeds follow them!" (Revelation 14:12,13)

What the Lord said to His people then: Thus says the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel: "Add your burnt offerings to your sacrifices, and eat the flesh. For in the day that I brought them out of the land of Egypt, I did not speak to your fathers or command them concerning burnt offerings and sacrifices. But this command I gave them: 'Obey My voice, and I will be your God, and you shall be My people. And walk in all the way that I command you, that it may be well with you.' But they did not obey or incline their ear, but walked in their own counsels and the stubbornness of their evil hearts, and went backward and not forward... "So you shall speak all these words to them, but they will not listen to you. You shall call to them, but they will not answer you. And you shall say to them, 'This is the nation that did not obey the voice of the LORD their God, and did not accept discipline; truth has perished; it is cut off from their lips. " 'Cut off your hair and cast it away; raise a lamentation on the bare heights, for the LORD has rejected and forsaken the generation of His wrath.' (JEREMIAH 7:21-24,27-29) What do you think He is saying to His people now? (Read the prophets, and see for yourselves that the spirit and ways of most of God's people today parallels that of the people of Israel in the time of the prophets. You know what God did then; what do you think He is getting ready to do to those who are following in the footsteps of those who were given to us as an example of what NOT to do?)

Do not be surprised... When multitudes of Christians take the mark of the beast. When pastors, friends and loved ones, who may or may not in fact be born again, take the mark and try to persuade you to do the same---telling you whatever they may to justify their actions and to persuade you: "For the sake of your children! What sort of parent would allow their children to go hungry! Is that what God would want? Do you think He is a monster, that it would be His will for His children to suffer, and innocent children, to not be able to eat or to lose their home, because their parents---who are responsible to provide for and protect them---refuse to take a mark? Didn't Jesus say that He would never leave us or forsake us, and that nothing can separate us from His love?" Beware. People who will tell you these things are deceived themselves, and even being used of the devil, unbeknownst to them, to try to convince you to do what will be your undoing. You will save neither yourselves nor your children by taking the mark, and you will perish spiritually. Do not be deceived. Remember Eve. And do not be surprised if church buildings all over the world, from the smallest to the greatest, are razed or set on fire, by order or encouragement of the government of the antichrist---as though God has turned His back on His people. The truth of it is that He hated what was being done in them, and they were an abomination to Him and an insult to His name; and by the hands of wicked men, He ordained that they should be destroyed and set on fire, as a testimony to the whole world that they did not honor Him and that He was not pleased with what was being done in them in His name: All the abominations that you now see in the churches, and the apostasy, in perverting the gospel and departing from and twisting the teachings of the faith, and making them whatever people want them to be to serve their own ends and to allow them to carry out the evil and unholy desires of their flesh and of their minds. And on top of all of these abominations, which you now see, there will be yet another---the greatest of them all---when the people of God forsake Him and take the mark of the beast to save their lives on earth, and to avoid persecution, and when they bow down with the nations to worship the image of the antichrist: The abomination that makes desolate. And so shall they be left when they do it. The very thing that God declares in His word will happen to anyone who does this abomination, will happen to them also---though they quote every verse in the Bible to justify their faithlessness and rebellion, as they do now for other things. So bear in mind, if and when the church buildings are destroyed, that it was the hand of your God that did it, through the hands of evil men, and His own mouth that gave the command---just as it was in the days of those who were before us, who we have as an example in the Scriptures, but fail to understand that we are following in their footsteps. It will not be because Satan has triumphed, that they will be torn down or set on fire, but because of the evil of God's people that they will be torn down, by God's own will. And it will be a testimony to the whole world, and to you, that this is so---that you may be ashamed of your rebellious ways and of your flagrant sins, and self-deception, and of the abominations that you used these houses for, and the sins you kept fresh in them, while calling on the name of the Lord and praising Him, to His dishonor and displeasure. And do not be deceived by the many Christians---true or professing---who will take the mark and try to persuade you to do the same, telling you that no harm will come to you. They will be deceived. Believe the words of your God, and not the words of men over God's, as you have made a habit of doing. We have good reason to believe that the very same thing that happened to the sanctuaries of Israel whenever they rebelled against the LORD will happen to us also, for the same reason. So no one should be surprised if it does. God is consistent in His ways. And if and when the people of this world rejoice and mock at the destruction of them, saying that it is because the God of the Christians is not God and because Christians are not the people of God that the churches are razed and God does not prevent it or take vengeance on those who destroy them, remember that it is because God was displeased with the churches that He commanded that they be destroyed, and not because He has no power to prevent it. He never wanted them. He always wanted the hearts and lives of His people---but He got buildings instead, and sacrifice instead of obedience. And all manner of evil was being committed in the churches in His name. The nations may exult over the destruction of the churches, but they will be foolish in doing so; for if the judgment of God begins at His household and sanctuary, and He does not spare His own people who rebel against Him, what will He do to those who have never known Him and have not obeyed the gospel? The cup of His wrath will come around to them also.

I appeal to you, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship (or 'reasonable service'). Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect. (Romans 12:1,2) Know ye not that your body is a temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's. (1 Corinthians 6:19,20)

"Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to sin, it would be better for him to have a great millstone fastened around his neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea. Woe to the world for temptations to sin! For it is necessary that temptations come, but woe to the one by whom the temptation comes!" (Matthew 18:6,7) This Scripture brought to my mind women who wear provocative and immodest clothing to church, and otherwise make themselves look "seductive" (I won't use the vulgar common term for it), for the purpose of drawing attention to themselves. Remember that a married man who looks at a woman with lustful intent is guilty of committing adultery with her in his heart, according to Jesus; so how do you think He feels about women who dress to entice them to lust? It is not at all "cute", but evil and careless, pure and simple, and the Lord does not take it lightly.

You, Christian, ARE Christianity. You, and me and everyone in whom the Spirit of Jesus lives. Now look at the state of it, and ask yourself whether you're a part of the problem, or a part of the solution, or simply indifferent to the problem. How does the Lord feel about the state of Christianity right now, and how do you feel about it? If He is grieved and indignant, should you be happy or indifferent? If you really love your brothers and sisters in Christ, and not yourself, hide not your face from disgrace and spitting and tell them what their pastors and other Christians aren't telling them, for their potential good, instead of keeping silent in order to have their approval and protect yourself from discomfort or rejection: Point them back to the teachings of the faith that was once for all delivered to the saints---ALL of the teachings--- and don't just smile and nod as they defy them. Jesus certainly isn't smiling and nodding about it. Is there anything commendable about 2 Timothy 3:1-5? Do you see abundant holiness when you look at Christianity? Do you see New Testament Christianity around you? Does it look like what you read when you study the instructions and examples of the word, or are they like two strangers with the same name? (And before you tell yourself that things aren't really that bad, and that it's not such a big deal, remember the Lord's message to the church in Ephesus. Is your standard of what is acceptable God's standard? It benefits you to find out and to make sure that His standard is yours. Read that NT again.) Be holy yourself, and exhort and warn your brothers and sisters to do likewise, for their good, just as the Bible itself does and tells us to do, and pray for them.

I posted this already in this forum, but thought I would post it again here for the potential benefit of anyone who may not have read it, as it is relevant to this topic. May the Lord use it to bless you. (P.S. I love you all; God is witness. If you only knew. I do not post things to scare people, and I am not a pessimist. But I won't lie or flatter people either (does the Holy Spirit do these things?); and what benefit is it to you for me to tell you anything other than the truth, even if it is unpleasant or frightening? There is nothing to fear except refusing to obey the Lord. If you love Him, and are faithful to Him, all things will work together for your good, and nothing will be able to separate you from His love. That should be great encouragement to you. But it will not be great encouragement to the person whose heart is set on himself and his own way, who wants God's promises and blessings without having to abide by His conditions for receiving and keeping them. And that is something I will never offer anyone, because God does not offer it to anyone. If that is what you want, you won't get it from me; but there are plenty of people who will tell you such things. And they are deceived, and/or liars. I want you to reap God's blessings and not His judgment, and I want you to keep your inheritance and not lose it. The people who are tickling your ears are worthless to you. God still expects and desires a holy people and a pure bride; and He will have one, one way or the other---whether by those saints whose robes are soiled washing them, or by those who refuse to wash their robes being cleaned out of His temple and His land. Make sure that you are on the Lord's side---the winning side---and not the side of the rebels and the fools.) 20 SIMPLE BUT GOOD HEART-SEARCHING, SELF-EVALUATING QUESTIONS FOR CHRISTIANS (No need to answer these on the thread; just think on them and answer them honestly for yourself before the Lord.) 1. Are you "successful" according to God's values and objectives? 2. When was the last time you told Jesus that you loved Him? (And meant it?) 3. What is your heavenly "savings account" balance? 4. Does God choose your wardrobe? 5. Does God choose your music? 6. Does God approve of what (and how) you eat and drink? 7. Do you judge other "wisdom" and knowledge by God's Word, or vice versa? 8. Is your chief aim and highest goal in life to please God? 9. Would you rather be away from the body and at home with the Lord? (Honestly.) 10. Do you LOVE your enemies? 11. Would you welcome a needy brother or sister into your home to stay? 12. Do you compromise God's word to do "God's work"? 13. Do you care more about the approval of people than about the approval of God? 14. Is Jesus your most prized possession? 15. Which of the seven churches in the Revelation would your church be? 16. Do you preach the whole counsel of God? Or just the parts people want to hear? 17. Do you practice what you preach? 18. Do you love God His way---according to what He says love for Him is---or according to your own notion of what love for Him is? 19. Are you making the best use of your Master's time? 20. If you had to give an account to the Lord TODAY, would you have any regrets?

"...The eyes of the LORD run to and fro throughout the whole earth, to give strong support to those whose heart is blameless toward Him." (2 Chronicles 16:9) Grace be with all who love our Lord Jesus Christ with love incorruptible. (Ephesians 6:24)

After this I looked, and behold, a great multitude that no one could number, from every nation, from all tribes and peoples and languages, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed in white robes, with palm branches in their hands, and crying out with a loud voice, "Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!" ...Then one of the elders addressed me, saying, "Who are these, clothed in white robes, and from where have they come?" I said to him, "Sir, you know." And he said to me, "These are the ones coming out (or 'which came out' KJV) of the great tribulation. They have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb." (Revelation 7:9,10,13,14 ESV) A few important things to note about this passage (and may the Lord make them clear): These people are coming out (or came out) of the great tribulation by martyrdom, not rapture. Jesus is in heaven at this time, and the events that occur at His return (the defeat of the antichrist, the resurrection of the dead and the destruction of the heavens and the earth by fire) are not taking place, but the tribulation is. He is only coming back once, not twice, and the Bible tells us what is going to happen when He comes and when His return will take place. These people had robes (they were saved), and their robes were dirty (they were sinning), and they washed them in the blood of the Lamb by repenting. (These are not unsaved people who repented and were born again, but born-again people who were sinning and repented.) And because they repented, God gave them the grace to lay their lives down for Jesus and to be martyred; therefore they are coming out (or 'came out') of the tribulation. There's no need for a person who has not soiled his robe to wash it. (See the Lord's message to the church in Sardis for example.) And the only people who have robes to wash are Christians, whose robe is Jesus Christ. Christians whose robes are soiled, and who choose to wash them by repenting of their rebellion (that rebellion of the saints which precedes the revealing of the antichrist, which Paul mentions in 2 Thessalonians 2, and which is currently taking place), will be conquerors during the tribulation. But those who do not, will be overcome. Again, it is the Christians who have washed their soiled robes who will come out of the tribulation. What is going to happen to the ones who refuse to wash their soiled robes? Also it (the antichrist) was allowed to make war on the saints and to conquer them. (Revelation 13:7) As I looked, this horn made war with the saints and prevailed over them... (Daniel 7:21) It grew great, even to the host of heaven. And some of the host and some of the stars it threw down to the ground and trampled on them....And a host will be given over to it together with the regular burnt offering because of transgression... (Daniel 8:10,12) This is the judgment of God that is about to begin at His household (1 Peter 4:17): He is going to deliver His rebellious saints who refuse to repent of their rebellion against Him into the hand of the antichrist to be overcome, because they refuse to repent. (Being martyred is not being overcome, but conquering. Taking the mark of the beast and worshiping his image is being conquered.) So then, people of God with soiled robes, heed the admonition of the Lord, before these things begin to come to pass: Blessed are those who wash their robes (or 'that do His commandments'), so that they may have the right to the tree of life and that they may enter the city by the gates. (Revelation 22:14) Again, one must first have a robe in order to wash it; and if it needs to be washed, that means it is dirty. (See the Lord's message to the church in Sardis.) Christians, this admonition is for you. What do think is going to happen to Christians who do not wash their soiled robes or do His commandments? Follow holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord. Unholy Christians will be cut off from the city of the Lord.

He who is often reproved, yet stiffens his neck, will suddenly be broken beyond healing. (Proverbs 29:1) Blessed is the one who fears the LORD always, but whoever hardens his heart will fall into calamity. (Proverbs 28:14) Whoever conceals his transgressions will not prosper, but he who confesses and forsakes them will obtain mercy. (Proverbs 28:13) Whoever rebukes a man will afterward find more favor than he who flatters with his tongue. (Proverbs 28:23) Faithful are the wounds of a friend; profuse are the kisses of an enemy. (Proverbs 27:6)

Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God. (1 Corinthians 6:9-11) "When the unclean spirit has gone out of a person, it passes through waterless places seeking rest, but finds none. Then it says, 'I will return to my house from which I came.' And when it comes, it finds the house empty, swept and put in order. Then it goes and brings with it seven other spirits more evil than itself, and they enter and dwell there, and the last state of that person is worse than the first. So also will it be with this evil generation." (Matthew 12:43-45) For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. What the true proverb says has happened to them: "The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire." (2 Peter 2:20-22)

Before you raise your hands to praise the Lord, make sure your hands are holy. I want you to picture something: A sanctuary, full of people, with their hands in the air, praising Jesus. Some of them spent the whole week watching pornography. Some of them are lusting after the women or men in the congregation in their hearts, or even committing physical adultery with them in secret. Some of them are covetous. Some of them are overweight due to incontinence. Some of them are self-indulgent, and haven't read more than a few pages of the Bible all week, as they've been pursuing fun and entertainment, and making plans for more of the same. The wives aren't obeying their husbands; the children aren't obeying their parents; and the men aren't obeying Christ. Some of them are harboring grudges, or are slanderers or gossips. Some of the men have long hair; and the women are wearing outfits that show off their bodies, and jewelry, and have made-up faces and fancy hairstyles, or short cut hair. And they're all chanting and shouting, "Praise the Lord! Thank You, Jesus!", including the women, who are supposed to be silent, by command of the very Lord they're praising. But Jesus is not at all pleased with their praise; it's disgusting and insulting to Him. It's no pleasing fragrance to God, but rebellion and iniquity! Put those hands down until they're clean. THEN raise them and praise the Lord. Otherwise, you're dishonoring Him. I desire then, that in every place the men should pray, lifting holy hands without anger or quarreling; likewise also that women should adorn themselves in respectable apparel, with modesty and self-control, not with braided hair and gold or pearls or costly attire, but with what is proper for women who profess Godliness---with good works. (1 Timothy 2:8-10) "Has the LORD as great delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices, as in obeying the voice of the LORD? Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice, and to listen than the fat of rams. For rebellion is as the sin of divination, and presumption is as iniquity and idolatry." (1 Samuel 15:22,23) But understand this, that in the last days there will come times of difficulty. For people will be lovers of self, lovers of money, proud, arrogant, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, heartless, unappeasable, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not loving good, treacherous, reckless, swollen with conceit, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, having the appearance of Godliness, but denying its power. (2 Timothy 3:1-5) (Are you among them?) "God opposes the proud, but gives grace to the humble." Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you. Draw near to God, and He will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded. Be wretched and mourn and weep. Let your laughter be turned to mourning and your joy to gloom. Humble yourselves before the Lord , and He will exalt you. (James 4:6-10)

For this is the will of God, your sanctification: that you abstain from sexual immorality; that each of you know how to control his own body in holiness and honor, not in the passion of lust like the Gentiles who do not know God; that no one transgress and wrong his brother in this matter, because the Lord is an avenger in all these things, as we told you beforehand and solemnly warned you. For God has not called us for impurity, but in holiness. Therefore whoever disregards this, disregards not man but God, who gives His Holy Spirit to you. (1 Thessalonians 4:3-8)

I'm weary of the subject, brother. I've done my best to explain it, as I said to Yowm, and really don't have any more to say about it than what I have already said. It's not in my power to make plain to someone what God does not make plain to him or her. All I can do is repeat the Scriptures and pray that He shows people who don't understand them what they mean.

Amen.

Again, this was explained in a previous post. All the Scripture in the New Testament can't make someone understand something God hasn't given him the understanding of. It's not because this truth is not there (it's all through the NT), or because it's not correct, that many Christians do not grasp it, but because the Holy Spirit hasn't given them the understanding of it. I'm not being proud in any way in saying this, just stating a fact. Nor am I confused or deceived about this. Don't believe that a Christian can't do anything to forfeit or lose his or her salvation, because it's not true---no matter how many Christians think it is, and that that is what the Bible teaches. It's not. And there's no benefit in winning a debate if you're wrong. Winning the debate won't change the truth. That's all I'm going to say about this. May God give understanding to those who need it concerning this truth.

That question makes no sense. If you're not faithful to Jesus after taking Him as your Savior, you're not going to stay in Him. And you have to actually be in Him in order to remain in Him. (I explained this thoroughly in a previous response to you.) Only God can give a Christian the correct understanding of this truth; it's as plain as He makes it understood and as confusing and apparently contradictory as He does not. But it is indeed correct and not a false teaching. You don't have to answer my questions. But hopefully others will consider them, and take to heart what I have explained.

You did not answer the questions.

("...Blessed is the one who stays awake, keeping his garments on, that he may not go about naked and be seen exposed!") (Revelation 16:15) Tell me, how can a person who has never been awakened stay awake (or 'watch')? How can a man who has no garments keep them on? Why would Jesus be warning unsaved people, who are asleep (spiritually dead), to stay awake (or 'watch')? And why would He tell unsaved people who are already naked and have no garment to keep on garments that they do not have? The garment is Him. This is for Christians. Likewise with the Lord's warning to the church in Sardis. Unsaved people do not have garments to soil, and they have never been awake, and have never lived. Those Christians in Sardis died because they did not keep the doctrine they had received. The Lord warned those who were about to die to wake up and keep what they had received, lest the same happen to them. If it were impossible for the spiritually living to die again, the Lord's warning would be unnecessary. (Hebrews 6:4-6) Yes, it is possible for a Christian's name to be blotted out of the book of life. Only people whose names are in the book of life (sheep) can have them blotted out of it. The non-elect (goats) never have been and never will be in the book of life. Again, Hebrews 10:26-31.

I realize it's a difficult truth to grasp, but it is no contradiction.