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In a recent conversation, the topic of God's will came up, and I was asked for my thoughts after posting a segment of this chapter. I was unable to respond before the thread was locked, but after talking with George and making sure I wasn't stepping on any toes, I would like to address the question here. @Cletus @Butero Romans 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there injustice on God's part? By no means! 15 For he says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.” 16 So then it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, “For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you, and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.” 18 So then he has mercy on whomever he wills, and he hardens whomever he wills. 19 You will say to me then, “Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?” 20 But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me like this?”21 Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? 22 What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction,23 in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory— 24 even us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles? My thought process begins with Paul's question regarding injustice. For there to be justice or injustice, there must be evidence that is weighed to reach either conclusion. This is where God's foreknowledge enters the picture. When we consider that God not only knows what we do or say, but what we think, and what is truly in a person's heart, then the picture becomes less fuzzy. God's elect, are chosen on what basis? In scripture, the elect are often referred to as the Bride. So we can look to the scriptures regarding God's definition of marriage, and what His expectations are for both the husband and the wife. Ephesians 5:22 Wives, submit to your own husbands, as to the Lord. 23 For the husband is the head of the wife even as Christ is the head of the church, his body, and is himself its Savior. 24 Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit in everything to their husbands. 25 Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, 26 that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, 27 so that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish. 28 In the same way husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. Jesus has perfectly filled the role of the husband, and in order for anyone to qualify as one of the elect, they must fulfill the role of the wife. Submission to God is the key to all of this. God knows each person, and He knows who has the capacity to submit, and who does not. Submission is one of those topics that draws two responses, agreement, or withdrawal. As we speak, this world is full of people who object just to the mere mention of this word, and will argue tooth and nail against this biblical concept which not only applies to everyday life for families, but more importantly to our relationship with the Lord. It is not open to debate, it is God's will. If the idea of submission offends you, then you have some serious issues to work through with God, because He requires it. God is looking for a faithful bride, one that will love Him as He deserves to be loved. He chooses those who have the capacity and heart to love Him, this is His elect. God does not create people to destroy them, people destroy themselves because they love themselves more than they love God, and for this reason they will not relinquish the illusion of control and submit to God. Notice what is said in verse 22 from Romans 9. Romans 9:22 What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, God has endured with much patience, what does that mean to you? To me, it is an illustration of what is said elsewhere in scripture, that God wants none to perish, so He is patient with all, but not all will love Him in return. They are vessels of wrath because of their rejection, and they were not created for destruction, they are prepared for it by their own actions. This is summarized in scripture as well. Romans 1:19 For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. 21 For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Romans 1:24 Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, 25 because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen. Romans 1:28 And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done. 29 They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. They are gossips,30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, 31 foolish, faithless, heartless, ruthless.32 Though they know God's righteous decree that those who practice such things deserve to die, they not only do them but give approval to those who practice them. These excerpts from Romans 1 display the difference in God creating someone for destruction, or allowing someone the freewill to destroy themselves. They do so because they lack the capacity to truly love anyone other than themselves and their fleshly desires. So God gives them over to their desires, and they prepare themselves for destruction. What more can God do to present Himself as the perfect husband than what He has already done? The answer is nothing. This verse sums it up best I think. Matthew 6:21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. God bless