Which is the fairy tale: Faith or Science?

[AWBS]

If by a "fairy tale" you mean something without logical basis, then faith would seem to be the fairy tale here.

 

As Tim Minchin states,

Science adjusts its views based on what's observed
Faith is the denial of observation so that belief can be preserved.

 

Science attempts to reflect reality as best as possible, while faith does not necessarily do so.

[Guest shiloh357]

If by a "fairy tale" you mean something without logical basis, then faith would seem to be the fairy tale here.

 

As Tim Minchin states,

Science adjusts its views based on what's observed

Faith is the denial of observation so that belief can be preserved.

 

Science attempts to reflect reality as best as possible, while faith does not necessarily do so.

Actually that is bogus.  Faith is by nature, evidentiary and logical.

 

If for example, let's say I had a friend who had always been trustworthy and has never been known to lie or make up fanciful stories. He  tells me this morning that last night, he saw a flying disc with blinking lights around it hovering in his backyard.   Would it give me the ability to believe in extra-terrestrials?   Probably not.    My faith would rest in his integrity.   I would have the faith to believe that he believes that he saw what he claims to have seen.  I cannot deduce from his claim that extra-terrestrials exist, but I would not draw the conclusion that he is lying. My faith in his integrity has a logical basis, and remains solid even if I think he is mistaken about what he saw. 

 

Faith does't operate in the realm of imagination.  I think that the hang up with skeptics stems, in part, from an unwillingness to distinguish between what is invisible and what is imaginary.  That is why comparing a belief in God is often erroneously compared to believing in fairies or flying pink unicorns or the like.  It is an attempt oversimplify what faith is. Faith operates from a known  evidentiary track record.  To believe something for no reason at all isn't faith;  it's most often, presumption.  And presumption gets folks in a lot of trouble. 

[Guest]

Faith

 

Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hebrews 11:1

 

It's On Our "What's For Dinner" Menu

 

So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Romans 10:17

 

~

 

If by a "fairy tale" you mean something without logical basis, then faith would seem to be the fairy tale here.

 

As Tim Minchin states,

 

Science adjusts its views based on what's observed
Faith is the denial of observation so that belief can be preserved.

 

Science attempts to reflect reality as best as possible, while faith does not necessarily do so.

 

~

 

Science Examines Creation

 

The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork. Psalms 19:1

 

And Never Comes To A Correct Conclusion

 

By the word of the LORD were the heavens made; and all the host of them by the breath of his mouth. Psalms 33:6

 

Whereas Scientism Attempts To Condemn Jesus Christ

 

And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ: Ephesians 3:9

 

And Fails Miserably

 

Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created. Revelation 4:11

 

~

 

Believe

 

That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.

 

He came unto his own, and his own received him not. But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: John 1:9-12

 

And Be Blessed Beloved

 

Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light. Matthew 11:28-30

 

Love, Joe

[Fez]

simply  put.....  niether

Amen to that!

[EndSeeker]

My question is is the fairy a just a fairytale?

when anyone says fairytale that itself has origin as well, "fairies" or the winged-lady-butterfly is a mystic fairy.

Fairies have a long and winding history in witchcraft and the occult. often known as

souls of the pagan dead. . some sources depicted fairies as real people, almost
synonymous with witches. Fairies arent always the size of "Tinkerbell"

 

more occult and mysticism consider
fairies are either: earthbound unbaptized souls; guardians of the souls of the dead; ghosts of venerated ancestors;

fallen angels condemned to remain on earth; nature spirits, or small human beings.
They are said to have magical powers and to consort with witches and other humans with supernatural powers. . ."
and readily link demons and fallen angels with fairies.

Fairies also represent the disembodied spirits of Halloween, and
Christians knew them to be "demons".

 

Also.. In Ireland, all the sidh or fairy hills (grave mounds) were said to open up on the occasion of halloween
and insisted that it was impossible to keep the fairies underground on halloween. Since these fairies were simply
pagan spirits, the church naturally insisted that demons were abroad on Halloween.

 

My point is, the devil/demons etc is a lot easier to prove existence of than God, being that satan is of this physical world

and God is of the spiritual realm, unseen and eternal, and as you should know one cant exist without the other

Edited November 30, 2013 by EndSeeker

[EndSeeker]

also in reply to the title of this topic "which is the fairy tale: Faith or science?"

a better question is What is science: Faith or fairytale?

because if you trust science then thats a huge leap of faith, and the science that refutes

God and His ceation, that science is a fairytale, as all fairytales are made by man

think about it, the bible is obviously credible with evidence to support it.

(tho it was written with mens hands, its written or "inspired" by God so never the less its the Word of God)

 

but then science comes along like swiss cheese and claims there is no higher power

and we just exist autonomously and there is no consequence of unmoral action other than what we

decide by our own hands, and if there is no absolute evil or sin, then we can do what we like

but alot of its illegal and the government profits from your errors, while what they do is "just"

they now remove religious freedom, and take God out of schools and teach kids evolution, etc,

science treats life as a fairytale, some wonderland we temporarily enjoy, be happy, obey or not who cares anymore

and die. now thats a fairytale, and its pretty messed up.

I remember i heard somewhere that satan is autonomous and he is that way so its confirmed we have free will

and we can choose to be a slave to the world or a servant of God.

and autonomous goes with the argument why evil exists, its necessary

but in a sense life is a fairytale because this life is not the "real life" we are temporary,

 

so what is science - faith or fairytale? well, don't have faith in their fairytale.

i think they say our bible is that because of our salvation, and heaven is greater than we can ever imagine

and fairytales come from imagination, but that doesn't make it any less real than it is.

even science comes from imagination, its distorted truth, for all we know all the fairytales of actual fairies

could be real, but its most likely distorted truth, oh and also of course there is Christian science where God is evident,

and that has a credible origin.

so yeah this was on my mind, and thought i'd add it in, i probly couldve said it better in some parts but you catch my drift right?

but i think i'll just end with this...

2 Corinthians 4:16-18

For which cause we faint not; but though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day.

For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory;

While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

Edited December 1, 2013 by EndSeeker

[LatentAuthor]

also in reply to the title of this topic "which is the fairy tale: Faith or science?"

a better question is What is science: Faith or fairytale?

because if you trust science then thats a huge leap of faith, and the science that refutes

God and His ceation, that science is a fairytale, as all fairytales are made by man

think about it, the bible is obviously credible with evidence to support it.

(tho it was written with mens hands, its written or "inspired" by God so never the less its the Word of God)

 

Why is the the bible "obviously credible"?

 

but then science comes along like swiss cheese and claims there is no higher power

 

No scientific theory claims there is no higher power, though many scientific theories now explain things that we used to attribute to higher powers.

[EndSeeker]

glad you asked, well for one the OT contains 300 prophecies concerning the coming of the Messiah,

all of which were fulfilled by Jesus Christ. and history shows the bible to be historically accurate as well as archaeologically and geographically correct.. History shows Jesus was in fact a real person, even Richard Dawkins knows

he existed. and his theories are also like swiss cheese, he has no idea what or where the missing link is and also cannot explain how everything exists "just because"

also you may find the story of Lee Strobel interesting, he was an atheist who was a legal reporter for the Chicago Tribune

and built a "case for Christ" to claim Jesus wasn't a real person, but he did his research for 2 years and no matter what the conclusion

he had an open mind and traveled across the world. and he found the evidence that Jesus was real and also that He was who He claimed to be, so now Lee is a Christian.

the evidence for Jesus' resurrection - history also shows that Jews, Romans, and Christians all agreed that His tomb was empty

and no one would have had interest in hiding the body, that would have been breaking Roman law, if i remember right, i read that long ago, anyway many people saw Jesus after his resurrection...Also all but one of Jesus' disciples died martyr's deaths (Judas) because they taught Jesus was resurrected. None of them renounced their belief. so in other words they died for Him..

All were also proved to be real people. a simple google search should clear all that up. so yeah everyone in the bible were real people, the bible is the beginning of time itself, you know something back then happened, nothing else and no other book i know of claims anything different that happened in those times, so its obviously credible. and I would die for it.

[LatentAuthor]

 

glad you asked, well for one the OT contains 300 prophecies concerning the coming of the Messiah,

all of which were fulfilled by Jesus Christ.

 

Isn't it possible that the writers of the gospels were aware of these prophecies? 

 

and history shows the bible to be historically accurate as well as archaeologically and geographically correct..

 

In some cases yes, in others not so much.  There are lots of old stories which reference real places and people, this doesn't make them "obviously credible" does it?

 

History shows Jesus was in fact a real person, 

 

It certainly appears so, but this doesn't make all the stories we have about him credible.  After all, there are real people I can watch on youtube right now claiming to do all kinds of crazy things, but the fact that they are real doesn't make their claims accurate.

 

the evidence for Jesus' resurrection - history also shows that Jews, Romans, and Christians all agreed that His tomb was empty

and no one would have had interest in hiding the body, that would have been breaking Roman law,

 

Isn't it also possible that a group of his followers stole the body and, in the process of traveling at night, were stopped by soldiers for being suspicious.  A fight breaks out and the men carrying the body are killed.  The soldiers don't know or particularly care about them or the body they were carrying, and so leave them in an unmarked grave.  Admittedly, I just made this up off the top of my head, but it fits your claims equally well:  Jesus was a historical person & lots of people say the tomb was empty.  In addition, consider which is more likely:  that a someone rose from the dead or that someone stole his body and was killed in a relatively mundane way?  

 

All this to say, the fact that Jesus likely existed and that many later writers note that Christians believed the tomb to be empty does not show that the bible is credible.

 

if i remember right, i read that long ago, anyway many people saw Jesus after his resurrection...

 

That is the story, yet there are no first-hand accounts of this - only copies of copies of second hand accounts.

 

Also all but one of Jesus' disciples died martyr's deaths (Judas) because they taught Jesus was resurrected. None of them renounced their belief. so in other words they died for Him..

 

Oh?  And you know this how?

 

nothing else and no other book i know of claims anything different that happened in those times, so its obviously credible.

 

No other book makes historical claims that differ from the bible?  

[EndSeeker]

 

 

glad you asked, well for one the OT contains 300 prophecies concerning the coming of the Messiah,

all of which were fulfilled by Jesus Christ.

 

Isn't it possible that the writers of the gospels were aware of these prophecies? 

 

 

and history shows the bible to be historically accurate as well as archaeologically and geographically correct..

 

In some cases yes, in others not so much.  There are lots of old stories which reference real places and people, this doesn't make them "obviously credible" does it?

 

 

History shows Jesus was in fact a real person, 

 

It certainly appears so, but this doesn't make all the stories we have about him credible.  After all, there are real people I can watch on youtube right now claiming to do all kinds of crazy things, but the fact that they are real doesn't make their claims accurate.

 

 

the evidence for Jesus' resurrection - history also shows that Jews, Romans, and Christians all agreed that His tomb was empty

and no one would have had interest in hiding the body, that would have been breaking Roman law,

 

Isn't it also possible that a group of his followers stole the body and, in the process of traveling at night, were stopped by soldiers for being suspicious.  A fight breaks out and the men carrying the body are killed.  The soldiers don't know or particularly care about them or the body they were carrying, and so leave them in an unmarked grave.  Admittedly, I just made this up off the top of my head, but it fits your claims equally well:  Jesus was a historical person & lots of people say the tomb was empty.  In addition, consider which is more likely:  that a someone rose from the dead or that someone stole his body and was killed in a relatively mundane way?  

 

All this to say, the fact that Jesus likely existed and that many later writers note that Christians believed the tomb to be empty does not show that the bible is credible.

 

 

if i remember right, i read that long ago, anyway many people saw Jesus after his resurrection...

 

That is the story, yet there are no first-hand accounts of this - only copies of copies of second hand accounts.

 

 

Also all but one of Jesus' disciples died martyr's deaths (Judas) because they taught Jesus was resurrected. None of them renounced their belief. so in other words they died for Him..

 

Oh?  And you know this how?

 

 

nothing else and no other book i know of claims anything different that happened in those times, so its obviously credible.

 

No other book makes historical claims that differ from the bible?  

 

1st. No but God was aware.

2nd Yes

3rd Good point but they don't have proper evidence and my faith is too strong to ever turn away,

-and again death, resurrection, ascension. its all there

-"Try and separate a man from his soul, you'll only strengthen his and lose yours"

4th No... Theory is a "blind" mans bible

5th These copies are all the same, hasn't changed from the start. and over 500 people saw Jesus after His resurrection

6th Bible/History/evidence

7th Not that i know of...and you?