Romans 15:4

[jmwhalen]

"Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples...." 1 Corinthians 10:11

"For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning...." Romans 15:4

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Some miscellaneous thoughts on eschatology, FYE(For Your Edification-"to build up"-Acts 9:31; Romans 14:19, 15:2; 1 Cor. 8:1, 14:26; 2 Cor. 10:8, 12:19, 13:10; 1 Thessalonians 5:11; Ephesians 4:12,16,29; 1 Timothy 1:4).

1. As you well know, the OT is the LORD God's "picture book", His object lessons, pointing to some phase of the person or work of the Lord Jesus Christ and our relation to Him. The word "ensample" is from "tupos"-our English word "type." And as you know, Joseph is a type of Christ. In Psalms 81:5 we read that Joseph was ordained by the LORD God as a testimony, or a type, in all his Egyptian experiences. I have seen many studies re. the analogous and typical relations between the Lord Jesus Christ and Joseph before(as I am sure you have also), but the following solidifies the millennium viewpoint, and supports the certainty that there will be the Great Tribulation-again refuting the preterist theology. Genesis Chapter 42: In verses 1-3, Joseph's brethren, because of great tribulation, were forced to seek out Joseph for help. Similarly, the Jews, during the Great Tribulation, amid great tribulation, shall call upon Him who is Lord(Deut. 30:1,2 and others). In verse 7,Joseph punished his brethren before he revealed himself to them. Similarly, the Lord Jesus Christ will punish the Jews prior to revealing Himself to them(Mt. 24:21,30 and others). Notice this is in chapter 42 of Genesis- one chapter for each month of the Great Tribulation: Daniel 7:25; Rev. 12:6, 12:14, 13:5.

Also notice that the book of Job( which means "one persecuted"), is a type of the Great Tribulation. It also has 42 chapters. Job is "...upon the ground seven days and seven nights....:(Job 2:13), one for each year in Daniel's 70th week. Job is in Edom per Lamentations 4:21-this is where Israel will be in the Great Tribulation per Isaiah 34:6 and Isaiah 63:1 and the book of Obadiah . Idumea=Edom=descendants of Esau: Gen. 32:7-"Then Jacob was greatly afraid and distressed...."-This is a picture of "...the time of Jacob's trouble...." of Jer. 30:7, with Esau as a type of the anti-christ pursuing Jacob(Israel) in the Great Tribulation. The one who persecutes Job will be the same one who persecutes Israel during the Great Tribulation.

These "types" of the surety of a future Great Trib. and 1000 year reign of the Lord Jesus Christ(and the false doctrine of the preterist view) are imbedded throughout the Holy Bible.

2.

Columbo: The Case of the Sinless Man on Earth

or

Evidence there will be literal "thousand year"(Revelation 20:2- 7) reign of the Lord Jesus Christ-"... as the days of heaven upon the earth...."(Deuteronomy 11:21)

By John M. Whalen

All Christians should agree that The Lord Jesus Christ was the only man that has ever walked the earth to this point in time(2005) who had no sin: 2 Cor. 5:21; Hebrews 4:15,7:26; 1 John 3:5; Luke 23:4; John 18:38,19:4-6. Is this not a "basic doctrine" of Christianity, and a pre-requisite for the Lord Jesus Christ being our kinsman-redeemer? Notice:

"Who did no sin, NEITHER WAS GUILE FOUND IN HIS MOUTH(emphasis mine)". 1 Peter 2:22

But notice:

"Jesus saw Nathanael coming to him, and saith of him, Behold an Israelite indeed, IN WHOM IS NO GUILE!(emphasis mine)" John 1:47

How is this possible-Nathanael is characterized as a man on earth "in whom is no guile"?

The solution:

Part of the definition of a prophet is "one who speaks for another"(for eg., Moses speaking on behalf of the LORD, Aaron speaking for Moses-Exodus 4:12,15("put words in his mouth"),16("thy spokesman"); 7:1; Deuteronomy 18:18("will put my words in his mouth").

The Lord Jesus Christ was a prophet, "the prophet": Deut. 18:15;Mt. 13:57,21:11;Mk. 6:4; Luke 1:76,4:24,7:16,24:19;John 1:45,4:44,6:14,7:40,9:17; Acts 2:30,3:22,23,7:37. The definition fits the Lord Jesus Christ's own admission:

"Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things." Jn. 8:28

"For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak." Jn. 12:49-50

"Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works." John 14:10

Thus, the Lord Jesus Christ was fulfilling His role as a/the prophet. He was speaking for His Father in Heaven-the words He spoke were His Father's words, not His(as was true for all the prophets).

"Jesus answered and said unto him, Before that Philip called thee, when thou wast under the fig tree, I saw thee" John 1:48

And notice if we "...search out a matter...."(Proverbs 25:2):

"And Judah and Israel dwelt safely, every man under his vine and under his fig tree, from Dan even to Beersheba, all the days of Solomon." 1 Kings 4:25

" But they shall sit every man under his vine and under his fig tree; and none shall make them afraid: for the mouth of the LORD of hosts hath spoken it." Micah 4:4

"In that day, saith the LORD of hosts, shall ye call every man his neighbour under the vine and under the fig tree." Zech. 3:10

Thus, in John 1;47, the Lord Jesus Christ, in the context of his office "the Prophet", was looking into the future, and providing a glimpse of the ideal conditions that will exist in forthcoming , and promised, millennium kingdom, a time the scripture refers to as the times of "refreshing"(Exodus 31:17, Isaiah 28:12, Acts 3:19), and of the "restitution of all things"(Acts 3:21). This is the enfolding of the promise that the Lord Jesus Christ shall rule from David's throne(2 Sam. 5-"the Davidic Covenant"-the covenant which God made with David at the time he revealed to him that Solomon would build the Temple, of which the reign of Solomon pre-figures the millennium reign-a type). Is this not what the Lord had in mind when He states that "...thou shalt see greater things than these...."(John 1:50)?

This 1000 year reign will be characterized by the righteous reign of the Lord Jesus Christ, and, as J. Dwight Pentecost summarized , a time of peace, joy, comfort, justice, the removal of the curse, no sickness, healing of the deformed, no immaturity, economic prosperity, and Holiness. This holiness will be manifested through the King and the King's subjects, the JEWS. This holiness, this trait of Jews("an Israelite"-John 1:47) having "...no guile", is realization of the promise of the New Covenant, and this is what the Lord Jesus Christ was alluding to in John.

Indeed, the millennium kingdom will be the fruition, the display, and the fulfillment of 3 covenants promised in The Old Testament-the Abrahamic, the Davidic, and the New Covenant. The Lord Jesus Christ was prophesizing partial fulfillment of the New Covenant in John 1:47. Part of the promise of the New Covenant was that the Jews would be given a new heart, and a new spirit:

"But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people." Jeremiah 31:33

"At that time they shall call Jerusalem the throne of the LORD; and all the nations shall be gathered unto it, to the name of the LORD, to Jerusalem: NEITHER SHALL THEY WALK ANY MORE AFTER THE IMAGINATION OF THEIR EVIL HEART(emphasis mine)." Jeremiah 3:17

"Therefore say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; I will even gather you from the people, and assemble you out of the countries where ye have been scattered, and I will give you the land of Israel. And they shall come thither, and they shall take away all the detestable things thereof and all the abominations thereof from thence. And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh: THAT THEY MAY WALK IN MY STATUTES, AND KEEP MINE ORDINANCES, AND DO THEM: and they shall be my people, and I will be their God." Ezekiel 11:17-20

As Columbo would say, "That clears that up!"

3.For your consideration-Daniel's resurrection: If it not literal, should we not spiritualize the rest of the Holy Bible="mental gymnastics"?

In Daniel 12:1-3, 13, we learn that the periods of days that occur during the last of the "Seventy Weeks" include the resurrection of Daniel, does it not? In verse 13, Gabriel

[Dad Ernie]

"Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples...."  1 Corinthians 10:11

"For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning...." Romans 15:4

Greetings J M Whalen,

I agree! And as for attempting to denounce "preterism", I also agree! But as for the rest of it, you defeat your own verses with which you start out. Do you want to "see" an "ensample" of the Great Tribulation? Just read Moses' account of the deliverance of the Jews from Egypt, and the final outcome of the Egyptians as they attempted to pursue the Jews across the Red Sea, which is likened to God's wrath upon Babylon.

There are MANY "types" of Christ besides Joseph given in the OT. Moses was one, Joshua was one. Isaac is the perhaps the most significant, because it was through Isaac that Abraham would be multiplied. Isaac had two sons. The one (Jacob) who was chosen, and the other (Esau) who it is said "I hated". Here we see a picture of Christ (Isaac) who planted the seed in the field of the world, and two crops came up. One of the good wheat, and the other of the tares. It is the tares that will be separated from the wheat when the crop is ready to be harvested - it is kind of ironic here, because in actuality, the wheat is told to "come out of her lest you partake of her sins and the subsequent wrath of God which shall befall her." (my paraphrase).

You see the tares are NOT immediately burned up, for if it was, the fire might cause the wheat to burn up also, so it is set apart for LATER burning. Then the "harvest at the end of the age" occurs, and then judgment comes upon the tares (Babylon).

Now as for Israel being a "type" or "ensample" for us, in most of the NT scriptures, little is actually said about WHEN "all Israel" will be saved. They were then, and even now an example for the "body of Christ", which by the Lord's coming will encompass ALL who are saved, both Jew and Gentile. When you read Romans 11:30-31 you will see that it is the BELIEVERS who will take the Gospel to the Jews (see also Romans 10:14-15) and then read in Ephesians where Christ is building a habitation wherein God shall dwell through His Holy Spirit and it is composed of both Jew and Gentile. So their salvation is no different than ours, HOWEVER, because they rejected Christ, the bulk of the Jews that are going to be saved WILL BE during the time of Jacob's troubles (Deut 4:26-31) which will come upon the whole world and is known as "the Great Tribulation". This time of severe tribulation is shown in Revelation as only lasting 3 1/2 years and NOT the 7 years most believe. The interjection of the time of the gentiles coming into the Kingdom of God occurs during the MIDDLE of the 70th week.

Please give these things some consideration.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie

[jmwhalen]

Thanks Dad Ernie:

"But as for the rest of it, you defeat your own verses with which you start out..."

I did not bring up the question of whether believers will be included in "the Great Trib". The issue addressed is not whether those in Christ will be a part of "the time of Jacob's trouble"(they will not, but that is not what I addressed) The article only addresses whether their will be a literal Great Tribulation, and a subsequent 1000 year reign of the Lord Jesus Christ. You brought it up, so I will adress it once:

"You see the tares ..."

This has no reference to the Body of Christ.

The great confusion among believers, including yourself, (despite how you graciously and eloquently you express your view), is failure to rightly divide the word of truth(2 Tim. 2:15), i.e., confusing the prophetic program, which has as its core the LORD God's dealing with unbelieving Israel and the unbelieving nations in judgement and wrath, which was "spoken about since the world began"(Luke 1:68-70; Acts 3:21-24), from the mystery program as revealed to the apostle Paul, which "was kept secret, hidden(in God, not the OT scriptures) since the world began (Romans 16:25; Ephesians 3:5,9; Colossians 1:26). And hence, many second coming passages(there are 8 times as many references to the Lord Jesus Christ's second coming as opposed to His first) are mistaken for the Rapture. And even more confusion exists regarding when the Rapture occurs in relation to the Tribulation.

I re-iterate:

And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ." Ephesians 3:9

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Much of the confusion in "Christianity" stems from failure to rightly divide the word of truth(2 Tim. 2:15), mainly in not distinguishing in the divisions in the Bible, the most important being the 2 following main divisions:

The prophetic program- which is God's purpose to establish a literal, physical, earthly, Davidic, Messianic kingdom("...as the days of heaven upon the earth