Understanding Israel in Prophecy!

[Guest EPHRIAM777]

I love reading all these interpretations of Israel in prophecy.

I have a question for Ephraim...

I once read a book by Herbert Armstrong, he believed that that Ephriam and Mannaseh represented the United States and England. He added that it was the fullfilment ot the physical blessing of one being a great nation and the other being a company of nations. That they will possess the gate of their enemies and have great resources. That the younger would be greter than the eldest brother.

What do you think?

Also, I dont remember who mentioned it, but the refernce to Dan as a serpent in its way does refer to travel and is not a reference to the lineage of the anti-christ.

Thanks, Joe

Eph replies...

Well ol' Herb was a nut and alot of what he said is just as goofy...!

But that doesn't mean everything he said was wrong...!

Ever notice Acts 16:17:18..??

The Damsel doesn't say anything wrong does she..Read what she says...Do you find anything wrong with what she says..? I can't..What she does is "join em" in order to smear them with HER bad reputation..!

See if Satan can't beat you..he'll send a few nuts to like this woman to "smear" the truth you DO bring...Now back to Ol Herb..!

Ol' Herb was right on a few things..but wayyy out in left field on others..!

Want another example..?  How about JIM JONES ...remember him..??   He "said" he was a Pastor sent from God...and he taught and preached right from the Bible too...Does that mean he really was a man of God..??

Answer..NO he wasn't...Now when he said Jesus was the son of God was he lying..? No but the REST of what he said didn't line up with scripture and he convinced those around him HE was right and got them to drink the kool-aid..remember..?

He took a truth of God and bent it out of shape..THAT doesn't mean the truth he did use was wrong..!

Just like Brit-Am..British Israel..and the Yar Davidy types take a truth and bend it so after awhile IF you even bring this up...your painted and pigeoned holed into being one of them...!

I'm not..one of them...! BUT the truth is the truth...!

The "travel" point about Dan was made by me...just so ya know..!

See people don't read the Bible...They don't know the birthright was "split" in two...They don't know..and if ya try to wake em up..right away your a 'Herb Armstrong' type..

Quickly your brushed aside...then back to sleep they go..never knowing God hasn't fulfilled many prophesies He made to Abraham through the Jews..because they were never promised them..Israel was..When the birthright split... in..GEN 48 and 49..! Joseph recieved The blessing when Reuben lost it..(( Because Joseph was a ""Firstborn"" son..not of Leah..but of Rachel ))..Reuben lost his right of "firstborn son" birthright for chasing after a maid of his father Jacob..! Next in line by age and birth was SIMEON..but he was a second born son..Joseph was a "first born" son of Rachel..so HE was next and not Simeon..

SEE 1 CRON 5:1:2..for that...!

1 and 2 Cronicles BTW was written mainly to Judah..NOT to Israel..! So Judah's own historical record states that JOSEPH recieved "THE" blessing...Judah recieved his "part" of the now split birthright in GEN 49:10...that was ALL he got..the right to rule and reign..NOT to be as the "sand of the sea"..THAT blessing/promise went to Joseph and HIS sons..not to Judah and his..( Judah's son's are mentioned in GEN 38 specifically because of the birthright and to know who's who )..1 and 2 KINGS was written to ""Israel"" which was the 10 northern tribes..

It's like having a history of North America..one is written by Canada...and the other is written by the USA..Cronicles was for Judah..and Kings..was for Israel..

THEY are different..at least different to God...!

Thats why the Jews (Judah)..have NEVER been as the sands of the sea in numbers..They never "posessed the gates" of their enemies..ect ect

Tell m who owned the Panama Canal..The Straights Gilbraltar..The Suez Canal...Hong Kong...Cape Horn...Cape of God Hope..?  Who ruled the seas with a great Navy..? Who rules the skies of this world now with great fighter Jets..and Satellites..or the seas today..?

Which people took and take the word of the Lord around the world telling people of Jesus Christ...??? The Jews..? The Chinese..?  Hmm..who..??

Who has never been defeated in war...The Jews..?

IF Jews are also Israel then God sure lied about them and their promises...!

WE as Christians know that can't be a possibility..Sooooo..

Who is "Israel"...then...?

Well for that ya gotta wade through the Bible..and watch out for nuts like Armstrong...who twist things..!

[Guest EPHRIAM777]

Eph writes...

See God gave Abraham a bunch of promises..and if he misses just ONE..Then God broke his promise..Which then we could rightly say to ourselves.."IF God lied to Abraham..He might be lying to me too"..So when Jesus said he would return..maybe he lied to me too..!

See where that one lie can lead us..Right into NON Faith in God..and BTW we would be right to judge God a liar IF it can be proven he lied to Abraham..and didn't keep those promises to him..!

BTW God swore to himself that HE would keep these promises to Abe GEN 22:16..So he's under the gun to come through on them..!

Now who has the blessing given in GEN 12:3..? Not the Jews..how have they been a blessing to all the families of the earth..? Did they take the word of the Lord around the world..? Do they preach Jesus Christ to lost souls..??

NO...Since the ONLY blessing FOR the world can be to take the message of JESUS CHRIST to the world..Jews haven't done that..So they aren't the ones who are a blessing to the world..Therefore that promise isn't TO them..!

So who else..?? Have the Chinese taken the message of Jesus Christ to the world..?

NO...They're vast in numbers..like the sand of the sea..But they've had the message brought TO them..!

What about the African peoples..Have they taken the message of Jesus Christ to a lost world..?..No they too have had the message of Jesus brought TO them..!

What about the Arabs..? Nah their stuck on Mohammad worship and Allah..they don't profess Jesus Christ to others..so they can't BE a blessing on anyone with that garbage..!

So who's left..They have to be LARGE in numbers..not some little amount..!   India..They sure have alot of People..Like GEN 22:17..but they don't teach Jesus to the world..They've had Jesus preached TO them..They don't enmass OBEY the Lords voice either as GEN 22:18 says..So their ruled out..!

What vast amount of people are left..? Oh and BTW where ever these folks are will be WEST of Jerusalem..not East..Because God said so in Jer 18:17 they will be scattered with an ""east"" wind..Well an east wind blows you westward...not eastward..! So start looking west of Jerusalem..

That also knocks out China..Japan..India..!

..AND..Since Jesus commanded that the Gosple go to the Lost sheep of the House of Israel in MATT 10:6...Then it stands to reason that the first places the Gosple was preached at..Those would be the Lost Sheep of Israel...!

Paul you'll find in Acts 16:6:8..was refused by the Holy Spirit to go east into Asia..or north..towards Bithynia...He was allowed to go WEST (following those blown by that east wind no doubt)...and that took him right smack into Western Europe..

Hey..!!  Who sends missions around the world..teaching ALL people about Jesus Christ..??  The Jews..the jews send missions teaching about Jesus Christ..?? Not to my knowledge...they don't..!

Would people who teach Jesus Christ's Gosple be considered a blessing to the world..?? Or is the Jewish message ABSENT of any mention of Jesus Christ the correct "gosple"..? And how is that a blessing to the world..??

Do you know of VAST "sands of the sea" type numbers of Jews ((who don't preach Jesus BTW))...fulfilling that promise made to Abe..?

SEE ya can't have it both ways...IF the Jews message ""without"" Jesus Christ Gosple is the correct one...Then as Paul said WE (( Christians )) preach a lie...and WE are still in our sins..!

Selah...! ( pause for a moment and think of that )

Remember this is about WHO is Israel..not a post hating Jews..The first "Christians" were Jews..it's just that Jews can't BE Israel..and fulfill ALL the promises God made to Abraham..!