farouk Posted July 6, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 26 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 6,580 Content Per Day: 12.12 Reputation: 3,361 Days Won: 31 Joined: 11/18/2022 Status: Offline Share Posted July 6, 2023 1 minute ago, Shilohsfoal said: Tribulation saints are members of the body of Christ and therefore are members of the church. But you are right,it does relate to the tribulation saints because that is when their 42 months persecution begins by the little horn. Daniel 11:33-35 Wise leaders will give instruction to many, but these teachers will die by fire and sword, or they will be jailed and robbed. During these persecutions, little help will arrive, and many who join them will not be sincere. And some of the wise will fall victim to persecution. In this way, they will be refined and cleansed and made pure until the time of the end, for the appointed time is still to come. @Shilohsfoal Thanks for your post. I was thinking of Matthew 24.21: "For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be." This verse in context does seem to be about a unique future event, which seems to be about the tribulation saints rather than the church. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shilohsfoal Posted July 6, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 153 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 5,881 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/22/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted July 6, 2023 1 minute ago, farouk said: @Shilohsfoal Thanks for your post. I was thinking of Matthew 24.21: "For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be." This verse in context does seem to be about a unique future event, which seems to be about the tribulation saints rather than the church. Ahh.The great tribulation caused by the abomination of desolation,takes place at the end of the 42 months persecution of the saints. The abomination of desolation is placed in Jerusalem 1290 days after the daily sacrifice is abolished.Daniel shows that the saints are delivered at that time and the dead are raised.Look closely and compare what Jesus said about great tribulation in Mathew 24:21 to what I highlighted in Daniel 12:1. Mathew 24:21 21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. Daniel 12:1-2 And at that time Michael the great prince shall stand up, that stands over the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of tribulation, such tribulation as has not been from the time that there was a nation on the earth until that time: at that time thy people shall be delivered, even every one that is written in the book. And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to reproach and everlasting shame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewardofthemystery Posted July 6, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 114 Topics Per Day: 0.33 Content Count: 975 Content Per Day: 2.81 Reputation: 266 Days Won: 2 Joined: 06/02/2023 Status: Offline Author Share Posted July 6, 2023 12 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said: Who said anything about a temple or animals? Daniel 11:31 31 “His armed forces will rise up to desecrate the temple fortress and will abolish the daily sacrifice. Then they will set up the abomination that causes desolation. You did, can’t you even remember what you just posted?😊 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shilohsfoal Posted July 6, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 153 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 5,881 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/22/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted July 6, 2023 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Stewardofthemystery said: You did, can’t you even remember what you just posted?😊 I posted nothing about a rebuilt temple and animals . Far as I'm concerned the Jews don't make animal sacrifices and there is already a building where you believe a building will be built.Some people call it a temple.Alot of people pray there. Edited July 6, 2023 by Shilohsfoal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewardofthemystery Posted July 6, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 114 Topics Per Day: 0.33 Content Count: 975 Content Per Day: 2.81 Reputation: 266 Days Won: 2 Joined: 06/02/2023 Status: Offline Author Share Posted July 6, 2023 22 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said: I posted nothing about a rebuilt temple and animals . Far as I'm concerned the Jews don't make animal sacrifices and there is already a building where you believe a building will be built.Some people call it a temple.Alot of people pray there. You quoted Daniel 11:31 below, AS IF this is some “future prophecy”that is yet to be fulfilled, It has already been fulfilled! Daniel 11:31 31 “His armed forces will rise up to desecrate “the temple”fortress and will abolish “the daily sacrifice.” Then they will set up the abomination that causes desolation.” You do know there used to be “daily sacrifices” offered in the Old Temple that was destroyed by the Romans in 70 ad don’t you?👀 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shilohsfoal Posted July 6, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 153 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 5,881 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/22/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted July 6, 2023 1 hour ago, Stewardofthemystery said: You are looking for things to come that have already been fulfilled. How are you supposed to know what is coming if you don’t understand what is already past? When you find that imaginary man sitting in the imaginary temple, and you see the imaginary army that is going to come and destroy the imaginary temple ending the animal sacrifices, be sure to let us know ok?😝 What year are you claiming Christ came anyways?You didn't say what year you believe all this took place. 15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) 16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: 17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: 18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. 19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! 20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: 21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. 23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. 24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. 25 Behold, I have told you before. 26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together. 29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shilohsfoal Posted July 6, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 153 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 5,881 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/22/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted July 6, 2023 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Stewardofthemystery said: You quoted Daniel 11:31 below, AS IF this is some “future prophecy”that is yet to be fulfilled, It has already been fulfilled! Daniel 11:31 31 “His armed forces will rise up to desecrate “the temple”fortress and will abolish “the daily sacrifice.” Then they will set up the abomination that causes desolation.” You do know there used to be “daily sacrifices” offered in the Old Temple that was destroyed by the Romans in 70 ad don’t you?👀 There was no daily sacrifice when Daniel wrote this ,and it's not a prophecy about the past.This chapter is about events leading up to the time of the end when the he dead are raised. PS,according to Daniel the daily sacrifice is abolished 1290 days before the abomination of desolation is placed in Jerusalem. Daniel 12:11 From the time that the daily sacrifice is abolished and the abomination that causes desolation is set up, there will be 1,290 days. Didn't happen in 66 ad or 70 ad. And Jesus didn't return and raise the dead in 70 ad as you believe. Edited July 6, 2023 by Shilohsfoal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewardofthemystery Posted July 6, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 114 Topics Per Day: 0.33 Content Count: 975 Content Per Day: 2.81 Reputation: 266 Days Won: 2 Joined: 06/02/2023 Status: Offline Author Share Posted July 6, 2023 6 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said: What year are you claiming Christ came anyways?You didn't say what year you believe all this took place. 15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) 16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: 17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: 18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. 19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! 20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: 21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. 23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. 24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. 25 Behold, I have told you before. 26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together. 29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. I didn’t say Christ came, you are just try to deflect away from the topic of when “the Temple was destroyed and the daily sacrifices ended,” because you don’t understand it has already been fulfilled. The “daily sacrifices” ended with the destruction of the Temple in 70 ad, the Temple was where they used to perform the “ daily sacrifices” (hello!) This is the “daily sacrifices” that ended with the destruction of the Temple Mount by the Roman army. “And to the office of Eleazar the son of Aaron the priest pertaineth the oil for the light, and the sweet incense, and the “daily meat offering,”and the anointing oil, and the oversight of all the tabernacle, and of all that therein is, in the sanctuary, and in the vessels thereof. Numbers 28:24 After this manner ye shall “offer daily,”throughout the seven days, the meat of the sacrifice made by fire, of a sweet savour unto the Lord: it shall be offered beside the continual burnt offering, and his drink offering. Numbers 29:6 Beside the burnt offering of the month, and his meat offering, and “the daily burnt offering,”and his meat offering, and their drink offerings, according unto their manner, for a sweet savour, a sacrifice made by fire unto the Lord. Ezra 3:4 They kept also the feast of tabernacles, as it is written, and offered “the daily burnt offerings”by number, according to the custom, as the duty of every day required; Ezekiel 45:23 And seven days of the feast he shall prepare a burnt offering to the Lord, seven bullocks and seven rams without blemish “daily”the seven days; and a kid of the goats “daily”for a sin offering. Ezekiel 46:13 Thou shalt “daily prepare a burnt offering” unto the Lord of a lamb of the first year without blemish: thou shalt prepare it every morning. Hebrews 7:27 Who needeth not “daily,”as those high priests, “to offer up sacrifice,”first for his own sins, and then for the people's: for this he did once, when he offered up himself. Hebrews 10:11 And every priest standeth “daily”ministering and offering oftentimes the same “sacrifices,”which can never take away sins: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewardofthemystery Posted July 6, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 114 Topics Per Day: 0.33 Content Count: 975 Content Per Day: 2.81 Reputation: 266 Days Won: 2 Joined: 06/02/2023 Status: Offline Author Share Posted July 6, 2023 5 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said: PS,according to Daniel the daily sacrifice is abolished 1290 days before the abomination of desolation is placed in Jerusalem. Daniel 12:11 From the time that the daily sacrifice is abolished and the abomination that causes desolation is set up, there will be 1,290 days. Didn't happen in 66 ad or 70 ad. No, that is your spin. Both the destruction of the Temple and the end of the daily sacrifice happened at “the same time.” That event in 70 ad marked the start point of that “sign” of time. Because carnally men cannot see time as anything but literal they then try to push past prophecy into the future because they do not understand what the Spirit is saying in that “sign” of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shilohsfoal Posted July 6, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 153 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 5,881 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/22/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted July 6, 2023 35 minutes ago, Stewardofthemystery said: I didn’t say Christ came, you are just try to deflect away from the topic of when “the Temple was destroyed and the daily sacrifices ended,” because you don’t understand it has already been fulfilled. The “daily sacrifices” ended with the destruction of the Temple in 70 ad, the Temple was where they used to perform the “ daily sacrifices” (hello!) This is the “daily sacrifices” that ended with the destruction of the Temple Mount by the Roman army. “And to the office of Eleazar the son of Aaron the priest pertaineth the oil for the light, and the sweet incense, and the “daily meat offering,”and the anointing oil, and the oversight of all the tabernacle, and of all that therein is, in the sanctuary, and in the vessels thereof. Numbers 28:24 After this manner ye shall “offer daily,”throughout the seven days, the meat of the sacrifice made by fire, of a sweet savour unto the Lord: it shall be offered beside the continual burnt offering, and his drink offering. Numbers 29:6 Beside the burnt offering of the month, and his meat offering, and “the daily burnt offering,”and his meat offering, and their drink offerings, according unto their manner, for a sweet savour, a sacrifice made by fire unto the Lord. Ezra 3:4 They kept also the feast of tabernacles, as it is written, and offered “the daily burnt offerings”by number, according to the custom, as the duty of every day required; Ezekiel 45:23 And seven days of the feast he shall prepare a burnt offering to the Lord, seven bullocks and seven rams without blemish “daily”the seven days; and a kid of the goats “daily”for a sin offering. Ezekiel 46:13 Thou shalt “daily prepare a burnt offering” unto the Lord of a lamb of the first year without blemish: thou shalt prepare it every morning. Hebrews 7:27 Who needeth not “daily,”as those high priests, “to offer up sacrifice,”first for his own sins, and then for the people's: for this he did once, when he offered up himself. Hebrews 10:11 And every priest standeth “daily”ministering and offering oftentimes the same “sacrifices,”which can never take away sins: So you agree you was wrong when you said the abomination of desolation was placed in Jerusalem already? Becsuse Jesus said he would come at that time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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