Keith Posted April 10, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 733 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 3,017 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 128 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/01/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/09/1966 Share Posted April 10, 2006 This study is for those of you desire truth and have a heart for God. Am I ready to give an account before the Judgment seat for the stewardship of my life here on the earth? Am I ready to answer for every word and deed during my life? Am I ready to give an account for what I did with the gifts and resources that God gave me? Are we ready to answer for what I did with the call God placed on my life? How many lives have I influenced for His Kingdom? What about the rewards God promised Christians? Who gets them? What determines how I am rewarded? Are we all rewarded the same? Can I plan for my eternity? How? Do these questions make you nervous, scared, anxious, or terrified? Have you had a lot of these same questions but haven't found Biblical answers for them or were maybe even afraid to ask them? Eternity is coming. For the Christian, it's not where we will spend eternity, but how. Scripture is actually pretty clear about this! And what we do with our lives right now dictates how we will spend eternity. You haven't seen me on the boards in some time, and that's because the Lord has gotten my attention with something that has been on my heart for years. His timing finally came around for it and now He's placed a burden in my heart for the following: Are you really ready for eternity? As I said, I've had nagging questions in my heart for so many years regarding eternity and our part in it. What will we do in eternity? What are our rewards? What about eternal judgment? Who is rewarded and who isn't? Who even gets to heaven? How do our lives right now affect eternity? What's heaven like? What's hell like? When I've prayed about these things, I've always gotten the response to wait and I'll know when the time is right for these questions. The time has finally come! God started bringing these questions to my mind again for quite awhile and had me praying about them. So I prayed and kept praying. When He started revealing the answers to me, He led me to a new book that is coming out as confirmation. As a matter of fact, the publishing date is TODAY! Many bookstores aren't even carrying the book yet, but you can order it directly from the ministry, if you want a copy. It will be in bookstores very soon. The book is called Driven By Eternity by John Bevere. (Author of The Bait of Satan, The Fear of the Lord, Drawing Near, etc.,) For those who were put off by the Purpose Driven Life book, don't let the word Driven in the title scare you off. It's not the same. Unfortunately, some will equate them to be the same because they both have the same word, Driven, in their titles. NOTE: I am not here to promote John Bevere or his ministry, but I will be giving him his due, earned credit for his work. I am starting this study because of the reasons I stated above: I've had these questions for years and the Lord has finally said the time for the answers is NOW. It's become a burden in my heart to help get this message out to people. I will be reviewing some of the points in John's book here and I invite anyone who is sincerely interested to participate in respectful, honest discussions of how our lives right now are deciding how we will live in eternity. I will not debate or argue with anyone. Naturally people are free to disagree and state why they do. Please be respectful if you do. If you want to debate/argue a point, please start a separate thread for that purpose. Discussion and debate are two different things and this thread is for discussions and questions. If you find yourself in complete disagreement, as you are free to do, please just move on from this thread. My Personal Opinion: I whole-heartedly believe that ANY person who remotely considers themselves a Christian and believes they will live their eternity heaven MUST read Driven By Eternity! I do not say this lightly. It's a very important and timely book on a very important subject that will absolutely change how you live. A Christian cannot read this book and remain unchanged by it. I will leave it at that for the moment. Much more to come shortly! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted April 10, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 733 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 3,017 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 128 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/01/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/09/1966 Author Share Posted April 10, 2006 What do you think of when you think of eternity? "Forever and ever without end" are the first words that come to my mind, but even those seem to understate it! Mathematically, any number times infinity (eternity) equals zero. So, if you live for 80 years, times infinity, that equals zero time compared to eternity. Same if you lived to be 150 years old. 150 x infinity = 0. A million years seems like a long time, right? Yet, 1,000,000 x infinity = 0. "No one can begin to understand eternity." Job 36:26 Even our dictionaries conflict over their definitions. One says that Eternity means: infinite time. Another says it means: the state of existing outside of time. One describes it as being within time and the other one outside of time. How can that be? Like Job says, "No one can begin to understand eternity." It can't be mentally comprehended! Yet, this is what we all have ahead of us... an eternity. Whether in His Presence or away from it. Heaven or hell, if you will. The amount of time we spend here on this earth doesn't even register on the scale with eternity! Think about the universe for a moment. Stop reading and imagine it. Where is the end of it? What's beyond that? More space? A wall? A substance? What's it made of? Is that the exact end of the universe then? If there is a wall or something there, then what's beyond that? Where is the end? Can your mind take you there? What about a bottomless pit? Imagine falling into a hole and continually falling and falling without ever seeing or hitting the bottom! Falling for an eternity, without end... So wouldn't it make sense to find out what we can know about eternity so we can possibly prepare for it while we still can? Is praying a sinner's prayer enough? Are we "once saved always saved?" What are the Christian's eternal rewards? Can we affect them while still on the earth? How is any of this going to be decided? Is your head spinning yet? If you stick around, I believe you'll find some answers in this thread. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted April 10, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 733 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 3,017 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 128 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/01/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/09/1966 Author Share Posted April 10, 2006 In Driven By Eternity, John Bevere says that we need to listen to the definition of eternity with our hearts, not our minds, because the Bible says that eternity has been planted in our hearts. Do that throughout this thread. Ask the Holy Spirit to help you. He is in contact with our inner man, not our heads. If something you read grips you, stop and meditate on it for a moment. Your word I have hidden in my heart, that I might not sin against You." --Psalm 119:11 We don't read just to get a mental understanding because that can (and usually is) easily forgotten. We hide His word in our hearts through prayer and meditation, thinking about them and considering them. Eternity is everlasting. No end. But it's not just time that never-ends. It's not subject to time. It transcends time. Look at God for the best example. He isn't limited in any way. Not in His power, love, wisdom, knowledge, glory, etc., He self-exists as the Everlasting Father. 1 Timothy 1:17 in the Amplified calls Him the King of eternity. God will never cease (Hebrews 1:10-12) and He will remain the same eternally (1 Peter 1:24-25). Since He is eternal, what He speaks is eternal. He can't lie. If He did, everything would fall apart into darkness because He is light and everything is upheld by His word. So, there can never be a change to what says. That's the sure foundation that we build our lives on. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike2 Posted April 10, 2006 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 258 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/06/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted April 10, 2006 What do you think of when you think of eternity? "Forever and ever without end" are the first words that come to my mind, but even those seem to understate it! Mathematically, any number times infinity (eternity) equals zero. So, if you live for 80 years, times infinity, that equals zero time compared to eternity. Same if you lived to be 150 years old. 150 x infinity = 0. A million years seems like a long time, right? Yet, 1,000,000 x infinity = 0. "No one can begin to understand eternity." Job 36:26 Even our dictionaries conflict over their definitions. One says that Eternity means: infinite time. Another says it means: the state of existing outside of time. One describes it as being within time and the other one outside of time. How can that be? Like Job says, "No one can begin to understand eternity." It can't be mentally comprehended! Yet, this is what we all have ahead of us... an eternity. Whether in His Presence or away from it. Heaven or hell, if you will. The amount of time we spend here on this earth doesn't even register on the scale with eternity! Think about the universe for a moment. Stop reading and imagine it. Where is the end of it? What's beyond that? More space? A wall? A substance? What's it made of? Is that the exact end of the universe then? If there is a wall or something there, then what's beyond that? Where is the end? Can your mind take you there? What about a bottomless pit? Imagine falling into a hole and continually falling and falling without ever seeing or hitting the bottom! Falling for an eternity, without end... So wouldn't it make sense to find out what we can know about eternity so we can possibly prepare for it while we still can? Is praying a sinner's prayer enough? Are we "once saved always saved?" What are the Christian's eternal rewards? Can we affect them while still on the earth? How is any of this going to be decided? Is your head spinning yet? If you stick around, I believe you'll find some answers in this thread. RE: YOUR FIRST POST; I think it was Martin Luther that said. "it doesnt matter if your faith is stronger than mine or mine is stronger than yours, we both have the same treasure in Jesus Christ." I am going to heaven, Christ has given me that. How can an eternity with God get any better than that! Being with God is reward enough! I have often wondered about the "treasures stored up in heaven" but I am afraid that I may be considering those in my selfish, worldly way. As a result of that I have chosen not to fret about it until the Lord decides it is time for me to understand what it means. Right now I am of the opinion that one is not above the other in heaven AND if that were not the case, we would feel total love for each other anyway. Position wouldnt bother us at all. Is it possible we are considering the "treasures" in earthly terms because its the only way we can understand them. Personally, I dont think that heaven would be heaven for eternity if there is a "pecking order" as a result of one soul haveing more "treasures" than another. We shouldnt do good works for any other rewards other than to know we have loved the way Christ wants us to. I really hope that this string gets some far reaching input. RE; YOUR SECOND POST Some things are just too hard to comprehend and we must learn to accept that they simply cannot be understood. EXAMPLE 1 : Where does space end? (man, dont even go there- just accept that it cant) EXAMPLE 2 : How could God always have existed? ( refer to example 1) mike2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted April 10, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 733 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 3,017 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 128 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/01/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/09/1966 Author Share Posted April 10, 2006 RE: YOUR FIRST POST; I think it was Martin Luther that said. "it doesnt matter if your faith is stronger than mine or mine is stronger than yours, we both have the same treasure in Jesus Christ." I am going to heaven, Christ has given me that. How can an eternity with God get any better than that! Being with God is reward enough! I have often wondered about the "treasures stored up in heaven" but I am afraid that I may be considering those in my selfish, worldly way. As a result of that I have chosen not to fret about it until the Lord decides it is time for me to understand what it means. Right now I am of the opinion that one is not above the other in heaven AND if that were not the case, we would feel total love for each other anyway. Position wouldnt bother us at all. Is it possible we are considering the "treasures" in earthly terms because its the only way we can understand them. Personally, I dont think that heaven would be heaven for eternity if there is a "pecking order" as a result of one soul haveing more "treasures" than another. We shouldnt do good works for any other rewards other than to know we have loved the way Christ wants us to. I really hope that this string gets some far reaching input. Mike, I can appreciate where you're coming from because I came from the same lines. This thread isn't a "prosperity, get all you can here or in the next world" kind of thing. The bits I'm laying out now are just part of the foundation for the rest of the message. I hope you'll wait to reserve judgment until the full message has been laid out. As far as what Martin Luther said, forgive me, but I think it's wiser to find out what scripture says instead. The fact is that there are rewards and they will be different for all of us. Scripture tells us to be mindful of this and to work towards them. You are correct in saying that we should do our good works for Christ alone. Our motives and attitudes weigh heavily into the judgment. But it is possible to do them for Him while being mindful of the reward. It's not unbiblical to do so. As for what you said that I placed in bold... this could very well be the beginning of the Lord getting your attention to let you know about these things. Pray about it. Some portions of your post will be addressed further into the thread. Rather than jump around in thought, I'm going to stick to an outline. Things should become clearer. As for what is italicized, that is, as you said, your opinion. There isn't anything in scripture that backs that up. I will actually show later on that what you said isn't true. The Bible is clear that there is a "pecking order" of sorts. To the part that is underlined, you are correct. There will be no envy or jealousy. But what we do now, on the earth, is what determines how we will spend eternity. RE; YOUR SECOND POST Some things are just too hard to comprehend and we must learn to accept that they simply cannot be understood. EXAMPLE 1 : Where does space end? (man, dont even go there- just accept that it cant) EXAMPLE 2 : How could God always have existed? ( refer to example 1) mike2 Like I said, the Bible says that no one can begin to understand eternity! My examples were meant to point to exactly that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OpenSky Posted April 11, 2006 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 30 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/06/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted April 11, 2006 Eternity, i have thought about it before, i thought and thought, and i thought some more and you know what i figured out? Nothing! its completely mindblowing, as you have said, no can can begin understanding it. I believe that God has so much in store for us that we will never tire of Him. " Driven By Eternity"....I will try to find it and read it. Anyways. God bless you with your work! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted April 15, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 733 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 3,017 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 128 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/01/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/09/1966 Author Share Posted April 15, 2006 Eternity, i have thought about it before, i thought and thought, and i thought some more and you know what i figured out? Nothing! its completely mindblowing, as you have said, no can can begin understanding it. I believe that God has so much in store for us that we will never tire of Him. " Driven By Eternity"....I will try to find it and read it. Anyways. God bless you with your work! Thank you, OpenSky. I hope you'll stick around for more of this thread because what's to come has me so excited and I whole-heartedly believe that it can bring true Christians into a much deeper intimacy with our Father! What's to come is both very exciting and sobering and you can't help but fully examine your life. I'm going to try to do this in bite-sized portions so there aren't very many long reads. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted April 15, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 733 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 3,017 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 128 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/01/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/09/1966 Author Share Posted April 15, 2006 In Driven By Eternity, John Bevere says that we need to listen to the definition of eternity with our hearts, not our minds, because the Bible says that eternity has been planted in our hearts. Do that throughout this thread. Ask the Holy Spirit to help you. He is in contact with our inner man, not our heads. If something you read grips you, stop and meditate on it for a moment. Eternity is everlasting. There is no end. It's not just a matter of time that never ends because eternity is not subject to time. We miss the full picture if this is the only way we see eternity. To get the best understanding of eternity, we need to look at God Himself. He isn't limited in power, knowledge, wisdom, understanding, glory 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted April 15, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 733 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 3,017 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 128 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/01/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/09/1966 Author Share Posted April 15, 2006 Now that we have a better grasp at what eternity means, what do you think of eternity? Do you ever think about it? Does it seem so far off into the future that you don't think much about it? Do you think that since we'll be with God, it nothing else matters? Is there a plan for eternity? Do we know what it is now? Does anything we do now affect how we'll spend eternity? Or do you just try not to think about it? Through this study, I'm hoping to push you in the direction of thinking about it and finding out what God's Word really has to say on the subject. You may just be surprised. Unfortunately, (to be honest, it's more heartbreaking!) there are a lot of people who aren't building their lives on what is eternal 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted April 15, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 733 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 3,017 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 128 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/01/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/09/1966 Author Share Posted April 15, 2006 On Judgment Day, decisions are going to be made based on how we lined up our lives with His eternal Word. Those decisions will determine how we spend the rest of eternity! Again, there will be no changes to those decisions because they are called eternal judgments. Judgment Day is speeding towards us and it's incredibly sad that so many people haven't investigated this. People have false hopes in concepts, ideas and doctrine that aren't found in the Bible. A lot of people think God will take into account all of the good they've done and measure it against the bad things they've done, hoping the good outweighs the bad and that they'll find favor with God. Others who profess being born again think that they won't have to stand before the Judgment Seat because they proclaim Jesus as their Savior. They think they'll be exempt from any kind of judgment. I think these are the people who are going to be the most surprised 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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