Creation in 6 literal Days

[JIME]

I would argue that there is a huge amount of cognitive dissonance in your position. If one were to take everything related to creation and genealogy in scripture to be absolutely literal, then one would have to automatically disregard virtually all of science. In fact, we may as well just go back to the days of alchemy, and start teaching again that the earth is the center of the Universe.

I suppose we probably come from different theological camps and thus we are simply going to disagree on subjects like this. I come from the

[Guest yod]

It is a literal 24 hour period because God said it was.

No, He didn't.

He used the word "yom" which has the PRIMARY DEFINITION of "age" or "epoch"

I suppose we probably come from different theological camps and thus we are simply going to disagree on subjects like this. I come from the

[forrestkc]

I would argue that there is a huge amount of cognitive dissonance in your position. If one were to take everything related to creation and genealogy in scripture to be absolutely literal, then one would have to automatically disregard virtually all of science. In fact, we may as well just go back to the days of alchemy, and start teaching again that the earth is the center of the Universe.

I suppose we probably come from different theological camps and thus we are simply going to disagree on subjects like this. I come from the

[Giaour]

"the evening and the morning were the first "yom"?.

How can an evening and a morning be anything other than a 24 hour period as we see it today?

If it were different, then why were we told to follow God's example and work 6 days then rest 1 day?

"It is physiologically impossible for a man to live for 969 years"

There you go again trying to put God in a box.

God can do anything!

[forrestkc]

"the evening and the morning were the first "yom"?.

How can an evening and a morning be anything other than a 24 hour period as we see it today?

If it were different, then why were we told to follow God's example and work 6 days then rest 1 day?

"It is physiologically impossible for a man to live for 969 years"

There you go again trying to put God in a box.

God can do anything!

Of course God can do anything. The universe and everything in it is the product of his will. All I am saying is that I am not a literalist. Whether one is a literalist or not is completely irrelavent as to their personal salvation. However, I believe that the Good Lord gave us intelligence for a reason and I certainly do not believe that he created a huge geological and biological disception either. For me that is the problem, to assume that creation and much of the Old Testament is literal and not allegorical, then I would also have to assume that God for some reason created a grand deception that invalidates the findings of all modern science.

That said, I do not believe that there is anything wrong for someone to believe in litteral creation or even young other creationsim. However, I do believe that it is intellectually dishonest for literal creationist notions to be used in a scientific argument. If creationists want their views considered science, then they need to submit their work for peer review just like what would be required of anyone else in the scientific community. It is not science, it is faith. The body of Human knowledge did not stop with the Bible and the Bible is not a science book.

[forrestkc]

.........LOL. It absolutely changes the core message. LOL. for example, you change the date of the creation by a "mere" 6-7 powers of ten. You throw away all of the historical truths and just look blindly for symbolism. So yeah, it absolutely changes the meaning, else we would not be having this debate. What is the "hidden meaning" of Noah being six hundred years old when he entered the ark? What is the "hidden meaning" of the ark? What is the hidden meaning of him liveing to be 950 years old? You can make up just about anything you want it to be if you claim its all just a metaphor. It would be meaningless.

This discussion just keeps getting broader.

We are intermingling two different fields, science and theology. The early Hebrews were tribal. They passed down stories from generation to generation. It was not until approximately the 5th century BC that they were actually compiled into religious texts. This is where I think our theological viewpoints really diverge. I would suspect that you believe that when the Hebrew Scribes began compiling the books of the Old Testament, that there every word was a literal dictation of God himself.

I do not hold that view. I believe, that those Hebrew Scribes put to paper the Hebrew religious stories that had been passed down from generation through generation. In essense , they were recording the tales of the ancients experiences with God, not being dictated the word of God from God himself. Thus the Old Testament would contain the world of God, not be verbatim word for word the word of God. (I am sure that I will really get it on here for that statement ). This is evidenced by the fact that writing styles vary greatly from book to book in the Old Testament, and the oldest translations currently available have as many variations in wording as there are words in the Old Testament.

Now the New Testament is a whole different animal altogether as it first hand accounts. However, the Old Testament in my view, and the view of many theologians, is not. Thus, unlike the New Testament, one could reasonably construe much of the Old Testament as allegorical, not literal.

That said, I am certain we will disagree on this issue. I just figured I should provide the basis for my point of view.

Edited December 16, 2006 by forrestkc

[Guest yod]

"the evening and the morning were the first "yom"?.

How can an evening and a morning be anything other than a 24 hour period as we see it today?

If it were different, then why were we told to follow God's example and work 6 days then rest 1 day?

the evening divided the days...but the Sun wasn't created until day 3

The darkness was evening....there is no record of how long that darkness lasted before God created the Sun.

The Sabbath is an everlasting day (a "yom" can be eternal) according to Hebrews 4. We commemorate this by remembering that God rested from Creation after spending 6 days making the universe. It is entirely within the character of God to give days and seasons which point to something greater than a day or a season just like the Passover was celebrated for millennia before the Great Passover came.

I see no contradiction with a weekly Sabbath doing the same as every other Feast Day.

[Guest]

{{{ would argue that there is a huge amount of cognitive dissonance in your position. If one were to take everything related to creation and genealogy in scripture to be absolutely literal, then one would have to automatically disregard virtually all of science. In fact, we may as well just go back to the days of alchemy, and start teaching again that the earth is the center of the Universe.

I suppose we probably come from different theological camps and thus we are simply going to disagree on subjects like this. I come from the

[Guest]

The Creator

The New Birth

The Cross, The Resurrection and The Ascension

The Return, Out With The Old, In With The New and The Eternal Love Feast

A few questions for "forrestkc" and any other symbolic reader of The Words of Creation.

Teach me, teach me!

Jesus!

Do you see Jesus in these words?

Are these words solid reality?

Are these words symbolic of something else?

What is the "else"?

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

"The same was in the beginning with God."

"All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made."

"In him was life; and the life was the light of men." (John 1:1-4)

"And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth." (John 1:14)

Jesus! Jesus!

Do you see Jesus in these words?

Are these words solid reality?

Are these words symbolic of something else?

What is the "else"?

"Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." (John 3:3)

"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

"For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved."

"He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God." (John 3:16-18)

Jesus! Jesus! Jesus!

Do you see Jesus in these words?

Are these words solid reality?

Are these words symbolic of something else?

What is the "else"?

"When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost." (John 19:30)

"Then took they the body of Jesus, and wound it in linen clothes with the spices, as the manner of the Jews is to bury." (John 19:40)

"Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God." (John 20:17)

"And he led them out as far as to Bethany, and he lifted up his hands, and blessed them."

"And it came to pass, while he blessed them, he was parted from them, and carried up into heaven." (Luke 24:50-51)

Jesus! Jesus! Jesus! Jesus!

Do you see Jesus in these words?

Are these words solid reality?

Are these words symbols of something else?

What is the "else"?

"And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God."

"And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS." (Revelation 19:15-16)

"And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever."

"And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them."

"And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works." (Revelation 20:10-12)

"And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea."

"And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband."

"And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God."

"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." (Revelation 21:1-4)

I would be delighted to learn how deep the symbolic translation of The Word of God has gone.

Also, I would appreciate knowing what these Words of Life are symbolic of!

What is your understanding of their real meaning?

How you are applying your understanding of these Words to your daily life?

Thank you dear poster.

[spiritman]

I just posted this to an atheist in another thread, but it is exactly what you are talking about...

So there is a book that uses the words Adam and Eve to tell the tale of the first man and woman who lived in a natural paradise where they had no concept of things like being naked for example, and when the serpent (universal ancient symbol of evil) talked to the woman and convinced her that she would be like a god if she ate from a tree of knowledge of good and evil, you can't even see that as possibly a story that accurately reflects mankind's rise above the animal kingdom through natural selection?

Here are two words in Hebrew and their meanings...

Eve: 2332. חַוָּה Chavv