gerhard eber

Yes! but in EXODUS the only recording of the historical event in pagan Egypt where days were sunrise days and the feast of unleavened bread was first time BEGUN; not in the references from times after and the passover had been institutionalised, when the feast was continued to "ordinance". Even although in Exodus already, characteristics of the ordinance or institution can be seen, which is understandable because Exodus was written long after the exodus and first passover had happened.

Just show me your text saying ‘~Jesus was crucified on a Friday.~’

This is a classic! Fantastic! Really fantastic...

Thank you for returning post. Let us start with you last remark, ‘~One is referring to the start of the 7 day feast, and the others refer to the Passover. Are these all referring to one and the same day?~’ and reduce it into a question whether ‘~the 7 day feast~’ is ‘~the Passover~’ or not? Some say only ‘~the 7 day feast~’, is ‘~the Passover~’; Others say, only the day when they killed the lamb for the passover feast was ‘the passover’. And so there is much confusion. But go back to Exodus 12:2 where “the First Month for you”, ‘Abib’ was the first thing instructed in connection with the passover, and it follows like daylight follows night that Deuteronomy 16:1 would say, “OBSERVE the month of Abib”. “Observe” it for what or as what? “Observe” the whole month for being and as being ‘Passover Month’! Compare Exodus again, in 34:18, “the feast of unleavened bread shalt thou keep. Seven days thou shalt eat unleavened bread as I commanded thee IN THE TIME OF the month Abib…” “IN THE TIME OF the month Abib…” When was that? It was with the exodus at the unrepeatable event of the first ever passover, and therefore in the ‘Passover Month’ -- the whole of the First Month. The month Abib per se therefore was “passover” and “passover” per se was the month Abib “…for in the MONTH Abib thou camest out from Egypt.” But “Moses said unto the people, Remember this DAY in which ye came out from Egypt … this DAY came ye out in the month Abib. … Thou shalt terefore keep this ordinance (the passover) in its SEASON (time / month / days / day) from YEAR to YEAR.” Now watch your words, ‘~This scripture refers to the 14th at evening: *[[Exo 12:18]] KJV* In the first month, on the fourteenth day of the month at even, ye shall eat unleavened bread, until the one and twentieth day of the month at even. Simple logic concludes that the time of day, "at even", must be the same hour, whether viewed as the first hour or the last hour of the 14th AND 21st days of the month to arrive at 7 days of u leavened bread.~’ Absolutely RIGHT! This has been the point where nobody ever has been prepared to obey the TEXT. Here is where the neverending surmisings begin! But obey the Word of God and accept the God-given and therefore eschatological IMPERATIVE WHOLE of the “three days thick darkness” of the Passover of Yahweh “on the fourteenth day”? Never! In Exodus, “THREE DAYS” IN ONE : In Exodus, “on the FOURTEENTH day of the First Month FOR YOU … THIS THAT SELFSAME WHOLE DAY BONE-DAY … ye shall remove leaven … KILL the passover … and in your houses stay”; In Exodus, “on the FOURTEENTH day of the First Month FOR YOU … THIS THAT SELFSAME WHOLE DAY BONE-DAY … the LORD BROUGHT Israel OUT” and they forever left behind the sacrifice “eaten” and “that which remained … burnt with fire” to ashes and dust, BURIED in the past! In Exodus, “on the FOURTEENTH day of the First Month FOR YOU … THIS THAT SELFSAME WHOLE DAY BONE-DAY … the LORD brought Israel OUT and brought them IN” and “planted” them “IN the land the LORD had sworn He would give you”. Thereafter until “Christ Our Passover”, THESE “three days” were continued “to their season” by “ordinance”… “On the head first day … PASSOVER “the fourteenth THIS THAT SELFSAME WHOLE DAY BONE-DAY … ye shall remove leaven … KILL the passover … and in your houses stay”; “On the fifteenth THIS THAT SELFSAME WHOLE DAY BONE-DAY … first day seven days ye shall EAT … IN THAT NIGHT the flesh with … unleaven bread”; “On THIS THAT SELFSAME WHOLE DAY BONE-DAY … the sixteenth day of the First Month they made an END … cleansed the Inner Part (Most Holy Place His Name) of the House of the LORD … and sanctified … WENT IN THE KING … and began the Song of the LORD with trumpets…” and continued FEAST until … “seven days there shall be no leaven found in your houses.” Re: ‘~So, when other scriptures refer to "the 14th day at evening", such as…~’ In Exodus 12:6 “in the evening” comes from ‘ereb’ “late (in the daylight-time)”. In Leviticus 23:5 and Numbers 9:5, “at even” comes from ‘behn-ha-arba-yim’ “between the (latter) quarters of days” which is also meaning “late (in the daylight-time)” but ‘behn-ha-arba-yim’ cannot like ‘ereb’, also, have the meaning of “late (in the night)”. ‘behn-ha-arba-yim’ only and always means mid-afternoon, like when the quails fell in Exodus 16:12. So, “the first day they always had to kill the passover AND REMOVE LEAVEN on” Mark 14:12 Matthew 26:17 Luke 22:7 is one and the same day referred to in John 13:1 “the day before the feast” and in 1Corinthians 11:23, “The Night in which the Lord was betrayed” and “the third hour” 9AM later on THAT SELFSAME DAY still, was crucified.

Yes, I do. But it isn't '~by the Hebrew reckoning of time~' but by God's and the Bible's reckoning of time and days and dates. So it isn't '~the number of the day (that) changed at sundown~', but the NAME of the week-day which was its number in the series of the seven days of the WEEK that changed at sundown. Or it was '~the number of the day~' or DATE of the day of the MONTH, that '~changed at sundown~'. [With the exception in the case of the 430 years in Egypt for Israel.]

IF but we all agreed! Yes, to the earth's rotation according to the order of the creation, for the people of God '~the night in which the Passover was eaten, and the following daylight hours in which they left Egypt in haste, are one and the same day.... The 15th~', but not in the land of darkness and worshippers of the sun! Do not forget the LORD saved the People of God out from that corrupted system and gave them his Laws and ordinances including the true day-cycle from evening after sunset to afternoon before sunset. The passover and the exodus were the two things with which God did just that!

Correct, Numbers 33:3 says that it was the 15th; Exodus 12:6-14:12 says it was the 14th. It is not a matter of either or; both are correct; you only have to see how both are correct; until you do you haven't seen the truth in either.

Instituted after the event, yes, but commanded before. Exodus 12:17, "And ye shall observe the feast of unleavened bread; for in this selfsame day have I brought your armies out of the land of Egypt." "Feast" obviously simply meaning "eat" the ulb and the flesh of the sacrifice together indeed after "the very first day ye shall have removed leaven" Exodus 12:14-15.

Exodus 12:8, "Eat the flesh in That Night roasted with fire with unleavened bread with nothing else, bitter just like that ... Thus shall ye eat it --the flesh and ulb-- your loins girded, your shoes on ... for I will pass through THIS NIGHT" as it happened "midnight That Selfsame Night TO BE OBSERVED ... (when) it came to pass that all the hosts of the LORD WENT OUT FROM the land of Egypt."

What you say here is true of the exodus, the first and last and only one passover event in history. It occurred from within Egypt to out of Egypt to within the Canaan side of the Red Sea. In Egypt the upcoming sun was the people's god which they DAILY worshipped. so the first halve of the Egyptian day is its daylight part. Israel was commanded to KILL the sacrifice "on the fourteenth day of the First Month for YOU", NOT for the Egyptians! Israel had to EAT the sacrifice in the NIGHT IN EGYPT "on the fourteenth day in the evening" after sunset. It can only have been after the daylight halve of the fourteenth during which they had killed the sacrifice and which STILL is being called "That Night ... the fourteenth day of the First Month ... FOR YOU ... in the evening ... That Night solemnly to be observed". But now God ordered Israel, "even the first day" (the 14th) they had to have the passover killed daylight time "mid-afternoon" 'behn ha arba-yim', and "shall (have) put away / removed leaven", "in This Selfsame Day I have brought your armies out". They could not have removed leaven in the night after they began to move out; they had to have removed it "in This Selfsame Day..." but before the LORD "...brought your armies out" after "midnight (when) the LORD smote all the firstborn ... and Pharaoh called BY NIGHT and commanded, Rise up, get ye forth". So the LORD had commanded Israel to smear blood on the lintels after they had killed the sacrifice and before sunset before they entered their homes to eat the passover: all in "That Night" before midnight; all in Egypt and all "on the fourteenth"... which clearly shows it was impossible that both things could be done in the SAME night! Therefore LATER ON TWO nights, began to be observed, the first one, at its beginning, "EVENING ... on the first day without leaven ... when they killed the passover" Mark 14:17,12 Matthew 26:20,17 Luke 22:14,7 John 13:30,1 = 1Corinthians 11:23, "The Night in which the Lord Jesus was betrayed". the second night on "the first day of seven days ulb was to be eaten" on the "Selfsame BONE-DAY" at its BEGINNING at "This That Night of the LORD to be observed" in Exodus 12:41,42, in the NT in John 19:31 to 38 to 39 to 41, in Mark in 15:42-46a, in Matthew in 27:57-59, and in Luke in 23:50 to the second phrase of verse 53.

Who said Joshua equates "the 9th day at even" with the 10th day of the month? In any case, what's the point? So what? What has the 9th and 10th days of the Seventh Month to do with the 14th and 15th days of the First Month?

The Jews to this day have their passover preparation meal; they call it the Bedikat Gamets (or something), eaten in the night of the fourteenth day. But the Passover Jesus said He "with desire desired to eat" with his disciples before He would suffer death, was his Suffering-of-Pascha-of-Yahweh from that He "knew the hour" at the table already until "This, your day and the power of darkness". "And it was the sixth hour and there was darkness over all the earth until the ninth hour ... when Jesus cried with a loud voice and said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, He gave up the ghost."

All Bible days '~of the calendar begin at sundown~' EXCEPT for the 430 years Israel was in exile in Egypt WHEN AND WHERE all days began and ended sunrise. Exodus shows, in fact, expressly dates, '~the night in which the Passover was eaten, and the following daylight hours in which they left Egypt in haste~', "This That Selfsame Whole Day BONE-DAY" sunrise to sunrise, "the FOURTEENTH DAY of the First Month", not '~the 15th~'. The Book of Joshua which contains the historically earliest mention of "the fifteenth", was written many years after the forty years in the desert after the end of the four hundred and thirty years in Egypt.

Re: '~Exodus 12 seems to include Pesach (Passover) within the seven days of the Festival of Matzah (Unleavened Bread)~' This is hundred percent correct. Exodus 12:6,8 proves it. Also correct. Christians however --like myself-- understand 'passover' and 'feast (or) days of ulb' interchangeable, which I like no one else before have been protesting against. Exodus 12:14 is the ONLY place where the fourteenth day is described as a "feast". The 14th though is also the day to kill the sacrifice, verse 6. The 14th is the ONLY date used in Exodus except in verse 18 where it says "eat ulb on the 14th in the evening until the twenty first day in the evening", that means, eight days, eight times, ulb EATEN. The only explanation for this seeming discrepancy, in my opinion, is two faceted, The evolution or development of the historical into the institutionalised. What was the historical passover? It was a day, "BONE-DAY", 'etsem yom' OF "THREE DAYS DARKNESS" INDISTINGUISHABLE. And "the head first day" in this "BONE-DAY", the 14th, was historically, the last day in the Land of Egypt where and when days were observed from sunrise to sunrise. The situation CHANGED after the original historic passover and Israel got SETTLED in the promised land and DAYS BECAME OBSERVED to Yahweh's order of sunset to sunset. Which explains the irrevocable fact that the day the sacrifice of the 14th was EATEN, ever after in all the remaining Old Testament Scriptures, is actually dated and or by implication confirmed, "on the fifteenth day of the month". For a sketch, see http://www.biblestudents.co.za/books/Book 1, 1 Passover to Crucifixion.pdf page 51. Were I to re-draw this sketch, I would have placed this note, 'The First Day put away leaven 12:6', in the left 'night' column when it in reality happened ... and correct the reference to 12:15!

I used those words because you asked if I wanted a fight. I have no idea who you are. Nevertheless I ask forgiveness that I offended you.

The Fifth Day of the week (Wednesday night and Thursday daylight) indeed was day 1 of the "three days", "days" being 1) THE "three days" of the Passover of Yahweh; 2) these "days" in their Biblical WHOLE being first their nights and last their daylight hours making up the same day-unit and not dividing them up into loose standing halves of different days each.

How tragic! O Lord, be merciful

AMEN Praise the Lord!

In the NT 'Sabbatohn' Genitive Plural by itself, is "the day The Seventh Day" Hebrews 4:4, "the Sabbath" like in Matthew 28:1a "on / in the Sabbath" and in Hebrews 4:9 'keeping of the Sabbath Day'. Also in the NT 'Sabbatou' Genitive Singular by itself refers to "the Sabbath", like in Mark 16:1 'diagenomenou tou Sabbatou' - "after (or) when the Sabbath (The Seventh Day) had gone through". In phrases 'sabbatohn' Genitive Plural like in Matthew 28:1b 'Mian (Hehmeran) sabbatohn' - "First Day-of-the-week", or 'sabbatou' Genitive Singular like in 1Corinthians 16:2 'kata Mian (Hehmeran) sabbatou', "every First Day-of-the-week", 'sabbatohn' or 'sabbatou' obviously just means, "of-the-week".

Young's, especially not in this individual case, is no 'translation'; it is a more literal transcription that does not give the spoken meanings of words, but rather suggest their etymology via orthography.

...is an impossibility--Jesus could not have resurrected twice.

contradiction...

It's of no concern what anyone might think '~important to understand what is meant by a "special Sabbath"~' since there are no words or idea like "special Sabbath" in all of Scripture. But it is true, '~It~' "The Preparation ... on the sabbath ... because That Day was great-day-of-sabbath-of(-passover)" '~was NOT the weekly Sabbath .. that week~'. Having been passover-week, it was '~an additional, special "sabbath"~' if you will, that week. But is is not true, on '~the Pesach (Passover) holiday as per Leviticus 23:5-7; NO WORK WAS TO BE DONE!!~' On the contrary, only "menial work" was forbidden. But MUCH WORK special to That Day was commanded!

Jesus died "the ninth hour", viz., '~3:00 PM~' exactly "between-the-latter-quarters-of-days" [behn-ha-arba-yim] "mid-afternoon". What are you scared of to say it straight? Because, I'll tell you, "the ninth hour", viz., '~3:00 PM~' "between-the-latter-quarters-of-days" [behn-ha-arba-yim] "mid-afternoon the Sabbath .. according to the (Fourth) Commandment .. nearing" EXACTLY, was the time of and on "That Day the Preparation which is (Friday) the Fore-Sabbath" WHEN JOSEPH HAD FINISHED TO BURY THE BODY OF JESUS AND HAD GONE HOME AND SO ALSO THE TWO MARYS WHO HAD ATTENDED JOSEPH'S ENTOMBMENT OF JESUS' BODY! That's why you're SCARED to say it straight, because it's an IMPOSSIBILITY Jospeh could have FINISHED Jesus' interment the very second of his DYING! And so is every Christian that insists on what you insist, that Jesus was buried on the same day He died! Dishonest afraid cowards to FACE THE TRUTH who rather will "MEDDLE WITH THE WORD OF GOD" like the proud and obstinate king Josiah of the Jews. Nowhere ever is it written the Crucified had to be interred before sundown THE SAME day! That's the issue! '~BEFORE the sighting of the first three visible stars~' or not! It's got NOTHING to do with the issue and is irrelevant '~added nonsense~'! And just so is your claim, '~No work was to be done on the Shabbat, and that included the work of moving Yeshua`s body, wrapping it in the linen shroud, laying it in the tomb, and rolling the stone door in front of the sepulcher doorway.~' THIS, was, exactly, what the day "This That Selfsame Whole Day BONE-DAY" of the fifteenth of the First Month was SUPPOSED FOR -- THE INTERMENT OF "THAT WHICH REMAINED" of the passover sacrifice the day before! I refuse to spoon feed supposed to be adults with Scripture indications.

'~...they begin a day at sundown, so why would Yeshua` make a special point of saying "three DAYS" and THEN add "and three NIGHTS?~' ... simply because Jesus related what had happened in the past to Jonas; in other words, Jesus spoke retrospectively. Had the three days and three nights already happened with Jesus when He spoke to the Jews? No; it was still future for Him. Therefore, Matthew 12:40 actually says, "For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly, so WILL the Son of Man (have been*) three days and three nights in the heart of the earth" [*houtohs ESTAI ho Wuios tou Anthrohpou en tai kardiai tehs gehs treis hehmeras kai treis nuktas] because that, '~logically~' IS what Jesus '~should have said~' and actually, DID say '~if that's a sensible "idiom" to a Jew~' or not! So, yes, '~the ORDER is important in the message Yeshua` was attempting to convey!~' And so, let's stick to Jesus' own words and don't go overboard like you do, by adding your own, '~Just as Yonah was thrown overboard and immediately swallowed by a whale of a fish during the day, Yeshua` also died during the day~'.