BeyondET

1 hour ago, RV_Wizard said:

STRAW MAN!!!  The evening and the morning is a single rotation of the earth, as it is now.  As I pointed out, the moon is NOT that bright and the sun existed at the same time so your argument is foolish.

That's a straight up lie.  I didn't insert Genesis 1:3.  It has been there for over 400 years.  In fact, as you can see here, EVERY Bible version says the same thing.  Stop pretending verses you don't like aren't there.  It really makes you look foolish.

As you seem to be incapable of learning, evening and morning are caused by a single rotation of the earth in relation to a light source which was there from day one.  The "big light in the sky" is nothing more than you and your Crayolas.

I've asked many times without getting an answer.  Is there ANYTHING in the Bible with which you agree?

Maybe it's not pointing to a rotating earth roughly 24 hours day. But a point during a day that time can only be known with a mechanical clock.

Which they didn't Have back then. There's 18 minutes of light each day in the evening and morning that during those two periods time was elusive unknown with rudimentary time keeping devices before the invention of the mech clock.

Without the sun breaking the horizon or after setting over the horizon the sun will not cast a shadow so to gauge with sundials which is what they used back then.

It means nothing to today's calendars and time keeping but it was a big deal to them and aware of the unknown period of time and the issue with keeping them aligned. It amounts to around 54 days a year.

1 hour ago, dad2 said:

Not everything was instant. But the heavens and earth were created on day one. The stars on another day etc. That was creation time and there is no other. It isn't like creation was some ongoing process. It was done after the six days, all of it. Any moving and creating God does now is not that any more. Any stars born or dying is not part of some creation process. A baby being born is a result of humans being created in creation week. So anyone claiming the universe or man got here by a process of evolving or etc is false. Just because God had finished the earth and heavens in week one does not mean He was then dead or not doing things after that.

If you lived an infinite life and had the ability to create anything you want, why on earth would you stop?

The Lord surely didn't declare didn't I?.

Jeremiah 23:24

23.“Am I only a God nearby,” declares the LORD, “and not a God far away?

24.“Can a man hide in secret places where I cannot see him?” declares the LORD. “Do I not fill the heavens and the earth?” declares the LORD.…

5 minutes ago, dad2 said:

There is an end. The heavens all roll up like a scroll one day. Yes God is still working. But not on the project He finished in creation week. The heavens and earth were finished. Any volcanoes or changes in the earth are just things that happen in a created earth. And the ebb and flow of the universe happens in an already created universe. Both were created instantly and at a certain time. Both will end at a certain time. No one can look at a star being born and imagine that this was some process that created the universe or some such, or that such things will end it. God started it and will end it. He has a lot of works going on but none of them involve finishing what was already finished in creation week.

Scripture doesn't say it was instantly otherwise there would be just 1 day.

I will agree the universe was before any stars. Stars are in the universe along with alot of other things.

57 minutes ago, dad2 said:

When man multiplies, new souls come as a result. God has a hand in many things in this creation, but that doesn't mean He was wrong when it says the things of creation week were all finished.

Gen 2:1

   Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.

2  And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

That did not mean all men that ever would exist was already made, or that every star that would die out or be born had already done so. All the earth and universe was finished, and set in motion.

 

In Gen 1 it said In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

By chapter 2 it was finished.

 

God resting is an example for humans, no human can work everyday their whole life.

there are new host appearing even today. If it is finished there is no end, because the end would have already happen at day six.

If Jesus is preparing a place for people surely God is still working.

48 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

Since the Bible was written for people in the Middle East and nobody could live at the poles without protective clothing that hadn't been invented yet, I'd say that wasn't a problem.  Now, they have these things called "clocks."

Bear skin with hair is enough protection from cold area's.

Where does scripture say it was written for people in the middle east only?

People migrated all over the place during Cains time. To islands other continents etc. There are verses about it.

1 hour ago, dad2 said:

He finished the creation by Gen 2. He commanded people and animals to multiply, and apparently even stars and be born. The nice thing about creation is that He made it to reproduce and change etc.

How about the soul?

Preparing a place 

5 hours ago, RV_Wizard said:

That's true, and nobody to witness it until day six.  Without light, though, how would we know when the day began and ended?

How do people know at the poles, where there is only one sunset and one sunrise each year. Either the sun is below the horizon or above the horizon for 6 months.

Or on a space station?

7 hours ago, dad2 said:

All the things mentioned in Gen 1 were already completed. Of course each new baby is a new creation, etc. That was how He created things, to reproduce. But the creation of man and animals and birds and fish and the stars and earth etc was finished by the first verse of Gen 2.

Well you can get a treat this year, if you peer up at the constellation Corona Borealis, over the next several months a new star will appear in the night sky.

56 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

I can think of two possibilities.

1.  The light was the sun.  From the beginning, the sun was formed to give light to the earth.  When the stars were formed on day four, the moon was formed also to light the earth at night and to be used for seasons and cycles.  

2. The light was NOT the sun.  The light was a single entity from which the rest of the universe came, and from which the sun and moon came was well.  Because all the other particles were scattered over the universe to become the newly created stars, there was nothing left of the entity called light but what is now our sun.

In either case, there was light on day one.  Because there was light and because the earth was rotating, as it does now, there were evening and mornings to form the days of creation.

Well the first two days, don't even need light to shine on earth. There was no dry land called earth.

15 minutes ago, dad2 said:

Not sure what that means. What does creation week have to do with today?

It means He is still creating.

5 hours ago, RV_Wizard said:

Genesis 1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.  That's how we know there was light on day one.  There is no great mystery.  God said it, and it happened.

Where is that light today is it shining on earth?

7 hours ago, dad2 said:

Yes. All the same day. When it was finished all that was made was made.

Indeed including today.

Genesis 2:4

8 hours ago, RV_Wizard said:

There was light on day one.  The earth was already in rotation, which is why there was an evening and morning; the first day.  Light was then what the sun is now.  The question is, did God re-form the universe in Genesis 1:14-17, or did God FINISH forming the universe.  In the latter explanation, the sun was already there.  Regardless of what it was called, there WAS light on the earth on day one.

Well He is always working.

2 hours ago, dad2 said:

^{Gen 1: 14} And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

¹⁵ And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.

¹⁶ And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

¹⁷ And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,

¹⁸ And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.

¹⁹ And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.

Yea He made planets too, the wandering stars.

6 hours ago, RdJ said:

It doesn't say they immediately grew. Looks like it in Genesis 1, but I think Genesis 2 is zoomed in.

 This is the [a]history of the heavens and the earth when they were created, in the day that the Lord God made the earth and the heavens, 5 before any plant of the field was in the earth and before any herb of the field had grown. For the Lord God had not caused it to rain on the earth, and there was no man to till the ground; 6 but a mist went up from the earth and watered the whole face of the ground.

And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being.

Life in God’s Garden

8 The Lord God planted a garden eastward in Eden, and there He put the man whom He had formed. 9 And out of the ground the Lord God made every tree grow that is pleasant to the sight and good for food.

Or zoomed in about the garden the place where it didn't rain.

3 minutes ago, dad2 said:

Most stars probably have been here since Adam's day. I see no reason why some stars may not have been created to 'explode' we don't really know. I am sure God has reasons and a method to the things we observe out there.

All stars are before Adam.

2 minutes ago, dad2 said:

And God's light is unknown by man at this time, yet it lights New Jerusalem in the future. I see no reason why His light also did not light the earth in creation before the sun was created. He did hover over the seas at that time.

Well I see Genesis in a different order of days. 1,2,4,3,5,6, I like to take the guessing out of the equation about how plants grow without sunlight.

1 minute ago, dad2 said:

I think stars were created. Just like man was created. That does not mean new people are not produced since then. That does not mean that no new stars came to exist since then. Many things in creation were made to produce new life and new materials etc. The cycle was that stars were created and that one day probably relatively soon, they will cease to exist. That is the cycle of stars! Of course any stars that were made after creation or recently have a shorter lifespan than older ones that were made thousands of years ago. Why? Because if the heavens are rolled up like a scroll to exist no more and new heavens are created, all the stars cease to exist. Some may have been 'born' only weeks before that time. Other stars will have been here from the beginning. So when the heavens fold up, all stars end, new and old. That is the cycle of stars.

The star named.Methuselah is one of the oldest stars known. Been around since the beginning.

I agree stars have a lifespans of life and death, the latter is quite violent.

4 minutes ago, dad2 said:

Light does not mean sun. It can refer to the sun. In the time before the sun was made, the light was not sunlight. So when plants were created there was no sun yet.

Yes you're right my apologies 

Quasars are among the most luminous objects in the known Universe. 

22 minutes ago, dad2 said:

Science has no idea what stars really are. Their whole stellar evolution thing is a crock. Since no distances are known, then even for a so called black hole out there what do we have? We have something affecting things that is unseen. How big it really is we cannot know since that would require knowing distances. etc

So you don't think stars have a life cycle? Are all the lights still here today from the beginning?

With instruments the effect on matter around is detected. They are rough assessment of its effect.

7 minutes ago, dad2 said:

There is no stage of creation where the sun does what science claims will happen. That is fiction.

Let there be light stage one birth, there's other stages in scripture. I can post some if you like.

1 minute ago, dad2 said:

In other words no one really knows either way. That destroys the origin models of science, so I'll take it.

Now it comes down solely to belief. For those who believe in Scripture we can rule out any old ages such as millions or billions of years.

No light can be physically measured. There's no model involved.

14 minutes ago, dad2 said:

 

As for black holes the same is true for them as for stars. We do not know the distance to any star or black hole. Therefore all calculations are out the window in regards to how time exists there as well.

Huh well I see you do believe in science after all, as for stars and black holes.

6 minutes ago, dad2 said:

That is the fairy tale, yes. The reality is that the sun will be fine as long as God deems it needed, or even for a decoration if not needed for us.

I never said it wouldn't be fine until that stage of God's creation.