dad2

We know. Try to understand that most people think of the tribulation as the time immediately before Jesus returns

No idea what you are talking about, sorry. You had mentioned those dwelling in safety were eternal. Not me. Do take a hint about the topic though...tks

You mean those people you say were 'eternal'? Now they have swords? Anyhow we will disagree. Your opinion was heard. The thread centers around the time of the tribulation. The question is before or after or during. Not centuries and centuries before or after, thanks

You may have a point

Who says anyone can beat plowshares back to swords when God is ruling the earth? Not the bible! No swords were mentioned in Rev 20 as you were shown. Swords and tons of them were totally involved in the Eze invasion. Your claim that the people living in peace were eternal is also nonsensical. You think some king in the rule of Jesus would have weapons and then try to attack spirits with them?

Last time I checked there was this famous peace deal that earmarked the tribulation? This is news to you?

If there are no places that are walled why mentioned unwalled places? Yes they have weapons in the Eze invasion. Ezekiel 39:9 And they that dwell in the cities of Israel shall go forth, and shall set on fire and burn the weapons, both the shields and the bucklers, the bows and the arrows, and the handstaves, and the spears, and they shall burn them with fire seven years: So many it will take seven years to burn them!! You are not even close. Eze states explicitly they have swords you are not even close again. Ezekiel 38:4 And I will turn thee back, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed with all sorts of armour, even a great company with bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords: In fact they ALL have swords!!!! Don't waste our time with fringe foolishness that is off topic.

Those verses do not even address the issue of the tribulation and I showed six ways from Sunday it is IMPOSSIBLE for the Eze invasion to be after He returns.

Yes there is a battle of god after the 1000 years. However, despite your shrill pretense at representing 'the word of God' there is a problem with claiming the Eze invasion happens after the millennium. They beat their swords into plowshares after He returns. Ezekiel 38:4 And I will turn thee back, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed with all sorts of armour, even a great company with bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords: In this battle there are plenty of swords. Not some few that people managed to sneakily make in the millennium. (as if anyone could get away with anything in that time when we rule and watch over things). Look at Rev and let's see if swords are even mentioned!? Golly gee, no, not even one sword was mentioned! Revelation 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, Revelation 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. Revelation 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. The land that is attacked in Eze is one brought back from the sword. There is no swords at all in the millennium. Ezekiel 38:8 After many days thou shalt be visited: in the latter years thou shalt come into the land that is brought back from the sword Strike two! The world also in the millennium will be restored and beautiful. Ezekiel 38:12 To take a spoil, and to take a prey; to turn thine hand upon the desolate places that are now inhabited Hardly fitting to call anywhere desolate places then. Strike three. Also a few points in this verse clue us in. Ezekiel 38:16 And thou shalt come up against my people of Israel, as a cloud to cover the land; it shall be in the latter days, and I will bring thee against my land, that the heathen may know me, when I shall be sanctified in thee, O Gog, before their eyes. The latter days usually refers to a certain time and not the 1000 years that I remember, no? Also there are no heathen as the world will be covered with the knowledge of the Lord and he will be right there ruling! That time near the end of the tribulation is also known for the great shaking that will happen. Ezekiel 38:19 For in my jealousy and in the fire of my wrath have I spoken, Surely in that day there shall be a great shaking in the land of Israel; To further pinpoint the time it says this "..the mountains shall be thrown down, and the steep places shall fall, and every wall shall fall to the ground. " Then once yet again it makes it clear it is not the millennium Ezekiel 38:21 And I will call for a sword against him throughout all my mountains, saith the Lord God : every man's sword shall be against his brother. NOT the millennium. In verse 38 yet more confirmation it is the tribulation plague time. Ezekiel 38:22 And I will plead against him with pestilence and with blood; and I will rain upon him, and upon his bands, and upon the many people that are with him, an overflowing rain, and great hailstones, fire, and brimstone. Yet another proof is that when the battle of gog and magoag happens it is not the time when fire from heaven comes down and kills them ALL! Ezekiel 39:2 And I will turn thee back, and leave but the sixth part of thee, and will cause thee to come up from the north parts, and will bring thee upon the mountains of Israel: There are more clues, but if you don't get it yet there is no use wasting time on it. Speaking of which the thread is about the timing of the Eze invasion being before or after the Tribulation, not fringe theories based on nothing that is is some other time entirely.

I see. OK so after the Tribulation there is peace until after the 1000 years are over. Then some rebels are destroyed. There is no battles other than that judgment after the tribulation. Unless maybe you are thinking in that extra 75 day mop up period after He returns that Daniel mentioned? If so, no, there could be no nations coming against Jerusalem after He returns and after Armageddon! Maybe a few rats trying to run or some such...

See last post.

Yes, Gog is also there. All you need to do now is figure out what gog is. He is also invading before Jesus comes. It is not one or the other.

Once He raises them and saves them, no enemy will ever bother them and they will be helping Him rule. If a leader invades them that tells us that it is before they are saved. Certainly.

Evil kings actually do not invade countries composed of resurrected people. Once He saves them no one will ever touch them again. They will bow down in the dust offering to lick their feet. You are confused in your timelines.

I see. Maybe I'll go back and look at that and guess if I get time

The context is an evil king thinking about invading Israel. The thoughts in the head of a probably possessed king are not declarations of God! God says they will be safe after they come to Him and He protects them. Not before.

Who is resurrected in Eze 38 and 39? As for the witnesses in the end, we are told they die and are resurrected. That is news?

Some think it is right before or at His return. I notice the verse before says this Zechariah 13:6 And one shall say unto him, What are these wounds in thine hands? Then he shall answer, Those with which I was wounded in the house of my friends. Verse where it says when they show up? If God says He will be glorified in nations He will. The question is when? They lie of course, that is their native tongue. But if the event was not till the end of the tribulation they would have been lying about other things.

It happens when Jesus rules them as their God after they repent Except leveling mountains and every wall and killing all invading forces etc must be seen by the world. No cloaking that. The very next verse says this 1 Corinthians 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. What happened to Jesus? His body was raised. We will be like Him. I assume you mean the Rapture. Having a cold does not make you disappear though. Some do not understand it having not seen it. The things in Eze could not be cloaked and the bible does not say or hint they are

---- It says He will. When that happens David will rule them, they will obey etc etc etc ----it doesn't say 'cloaked' it says God will be glorified.

The thread is about the when.

Look at the times the word safe is used in Scripture. Name a few where it refers being eternal?

The who doesn't tell us when

2 Samuel 18:29 And the king said, Is the young man Absalom safe? And Ahimaaz answered, When Joab sent the king's servant, and me thy servant, I saw a great tumult, but I knew not what it was. This was not talking about out of body after life eternal life. Nor was any other of the many many verses in the bible using the word safe doing so.

That seems kind of pushy for a Christian position.