Hinds Feet

That's not a farfetched thought by any means. AI is man's creation, and is seen as a glory for man. This goes back to the Tower of Babel, and how the people wanted to make a name for themselves. AI is man's greatest attempt to make a name for themselves. Its a one-up on God type of thing. A 'look at us. We made something better than a natural creation!' And of course man will use this to boost themselves, where people will become something like cyborgs. We may even have genetic engineering soon as well. A return of the Nephilim through genetic modification. (Yall look up designer babies) All these things will be possible in the near future, and all these things is man trying to give God the business.

Why do you separate what God told Noah concerning not consuming blood, from what God told Noah about shedding human blood? It's pretty straightforward. Genesis 9:4-6 states.... "But you shall not eat flesh with its life, that is, its blood. Surely for your lifeblood I will demand a reckoning; from the hand of every beast I will require it, and from the hand of man. From the hand of every man’s brother I will require the life of man. Whoever sheds man’s blood, By man his blood shall be shed; For in the image of God He made man." It is very clear that the life of all flesh, not just animals, is in the blood. Now obviously with Scripture, blood plays one of the most pivotal, if not the most pivotal role concerning the faith. During the Passover, we know the people of Israel placed blood on their doorposts, so the destroyer wouldn't take their firstborn. Now obviously there is something spiritual that went on there. It's not like God was telling Moses and the people of Israel to go through the motions for the fun of it. In the same way, Jesus had to literally come to earth and pour out His blood. Was all of that just for show? Or is there something spiritual concerning blood? Now, concerning the thought that a soul can only inhabit a fully functioning body, we know this can't be the case. As we know, sin has done a number on the world. There are people who are born without limbs, faulty organs, and other diseases that causes disability. However, we would not say someone without a fully functioning body, has no soul/spirit. I would say if movement is not a indicator God placed a person's soul/spirit into their body, then what is? We could then argue no one has a soul/spirit. And concerning animals, the Bible doesn't say animals do not have a soul. Getting back to Adam, God formed His body, and then breathed into him. Our bodies then are formed in the womb. At some point in that formation, God places the soul/spirit inside the person. I would say if you disagree with this, and point back to Adam, we must also remember that Adam was a fully developed man. He was never a baby, child, or a teenager. If we get too literal with what you say is the pattern, then should we assume a person doesn't have a soul/and or spirit until they turn 25 or the age a person fully develops? These are the things we must think about. The Bible doesn't tell us everything point by point, but it does give us enough to meditate on. From everything I've written on, it is speculated upon with good thought behind it based on Scripture.

Y'all look up what Ai mean in Hebrew. It is not a coincidence that perhaps the most important man-made invention has these two letters as an acronym.

God told Noah and his family that the life of the flesh was in the blood. And He said if someone sheds the blood of a person, by man his blood will be shed. (Genesis 9 : 5-6). So it is the same for all flesh, animals and humans alike. Adam's body was certainly formed before God gave him the breathe of life. Yet, Adam wasn't born like we are. I imagine when God formed Adam's body, it wasn't moving. It's much like the body of a person who has passed away, except Adam's body wasn't deteriorating. Yet once God breathed into Adam, I imagine he began moving. In the same way, we see the fetus moving inside their mother's womb. In terms of movement and activity, that is aligned with Adam. The only difference is Adam didn't have a mother, and was never inside a womb.

For believers, we must remember Jesus knows and have experienced all our pains. He relates to everything we are going through right now, and He was without sin. So, Jesus became human. He knows what we are going through.

Again, great discussion. Different things have been brought into the conversation, namely God's omniscience. For this particular topic, I would say this isn't relevant concerning when a person's life/existence begins. Yes, God knew us before our existence. I would even say why wouldn't He know us? He is our Creator. Though I will say from what has been said concerning God "knowing us", we might have a different take on what that means. Nonetheless, it isn't relevant to our contemplation concerning when life begins. I assume we agree we all had a beginning? Yeah I put more of an emphasis on our spiritual start. I see that as our core being. Even after our body physically dies, our spirit goes to either heaven or hell. In both places, we are conscious with just our spirit. (Of course this is the view most believers have concerning what happens when the body dies. There are those who believe in soul sleep, where our bodies return to dust and our soul/spirit returns to God. In this view, our soul/spirit is nothing more than a type of "force" or "energy" supplied by God.) As to my speculation on when God may put the soul/spirit into the body, yes, its just that. Its based on the idea that the life of a person, is in the blood. Now what I would say, even though this is speculation, its pretty good speculation! Why? Well, spiritually speaking, we know blood is very key in terms of sacrifice for sin. We know when Cain killed Abel, God said Abel's blood was crying out from the ground to Him. Jesus shed His blood, and it washes away our sin. His blood spoke better things than Abel's blood. (Abel's blood cried out for justice/vengeance. Jesus' blood cries out for grace/mercy) There is a lot of spiritual ramifications concerning blood throughout the Bible. All that said, I would still wager God puts the spirit of a person in their bodies, before they are outside of the womb. Just based on what we see from ultrasound images. The fetus moves around, sucks their thumb, and do baby things as far as we can tell. We know from Scripture Esau and Jacob were wrestling with each other in their mother's womb. So I would say there is life there before birth. (spiritual life as well as the body) In Exodus 21:22-23 it reads........ "If men who are fighting strike a pregnant woman and her child is born prematurely, but there is no further injury, he shall surely be fined as the woman’s husband demands and as the court allows. But if a serious injury results, then you must require a life for a life" Here we read in the laws of God, if a baby is harmed in the womb, particularly if the baby comes out dead, then the person must pay with their own life. Life for life. So I would say God places the spirit of the child in their forming body.

I definitely hear you. I don't believe there is evidence in Scripture to say our spirit/and or souls existed before the foundations of the world. I would agree to your on paper analogy. I would say our actual existence began sometime in our mother's womb.

Thanks everyone for your responses! I hear everyone, but I also can't help but wonder are we taking things for granted and just having the traditional view that is not necessarily based on anything in Scripture? (That is perhaps a man driven tradition) I believe the way I view this question is more so from the spiritual side, than just the physical. So that it is the spirit/and or soul of a person, that is the real person. The egg and sperm cells are physical things that we see, and the newly formed cell they become is again something that is physical. On the back end of life, Scripture tells us when a person dies, their spirit leaves the body. The presence of the body we still have, but the person is not there. The real essence of that person is elsewhere. (Heaven or Hell) Jesus even tells us what good does it do us to gain the whole world, and yet lose his soul? For me, all this points to the spirt/and or soul as being the real individual, or at least their core. If this is true, then I speculate perhaps life happens not at conception, but sometime later when the newly forming mass of cells implant itself onto the uterine wall of a woman. I would say the main verse we use to say life begins at conception, is where God tells Jeremiah that before he was "conceived" in his mother's womb, He knew him. Now, we must understand the people's idea of conception back then, is not our understanding of today. Again God told Jeremiah he was conceived in his mother's "womb", and conception as we know it does not take place in the womb. (It takes place in the fallopian tubes.) So if we are being literal with the Jeremiah reference, life wouldn't begin at scientific conception. Some of you also addressed the identical twins and human chimerism problems. Ultimately alluding that God already worked the details out and the process still begins at conception. We could say this, that God already has the details worked out. However, there is a third issue I will now bring up. Many zygotes never successfully implant themselves on the uterine wall. Unlike miscarriages where something happens to the fetus, the actual fertilized cell just never implants itself in the womb. So it's lost in the menstruation cycle, and no one ever knows it existed at all. If life does indeed begin at conception, which includes God placing the spirit of a person inside the fertilized egg, there are countless amounts of people who have died and no one ever knew nor mourned. Of course even with this, we still had a beginning. What does it mean for God to know us before we were conceived or before the foundation of the world? Because God is our Creator, it could mean a couple of things. If I was a great inventor and decided to build a robot, I would have written out all the schematics of that robot, detailing how it would work, it's purpose and so forth. I would know that robot intimately, before I tightened in it's first screw. So it could be like that for God concerning us. He had a plan for each and every one of us, what we were designed to do and our purpose. Now, I'm not saying we are robots, but I believe this is an accurate portrait. Now if our life began the moment God knew us from a conceptual standpoint, we could then argue we always existed just like God. Why? Because when was there ever a moment God didn't know something? And this goes down a different rabbit hole for another topic.

So, this thread doesn't concern the topic of abortion. I would say very clearly life is present by the time a woman finds out she's pregnant. No, this thread is about what time specifically does a person's life come into existence? Scripturally speaking, when do you speculate it might happen? Of course the popular phrase is "life begins at conception". However, if we are talking about scientific conception (fertilized egg cell), there are many problems with that saying. And by this I mean spiritual problems. Take for instance the existence of identical twins. Identical twins are the result of one zygote (fertilized egg) splitting into two separate embryo cells. If a person's life began at conception, identical twins would essentially be sharing the same soul and or spirit. There's also the case of human chimerism where two different zygotes (two separate fertilized eggs) fuse together into one embryo. For such a person as this, they would essentially have two souls and or spirits in their single body. So these are a couple of problems with life beginning at scientific conception. Here is what I say, Scripturally speaking. We are told by God that the life of all living creatures, is in the blood. Genesis 9:4-5 states.... "But you must not eat meat with its lifeblood still in it. And surely I will require the life of any man or beast by whose hand your lifeblood is shed. I will demand an accounting from anyone who takes the life of his fellow man:"....... This is what I figure. We don't know specifically when an individual's life begins. However, at the stage where blood is present in the newly forming human, we can be assured life is there. So this happens, according to our best science, around 2 weeks after conception. Also, another reason why I argue life doesn't begin at conception is Adam's own creation. God formed Adam from the dust of the earth. Even though Adam's body was fully developed, Adam didn't become alive until God breathed into him the breath of life. Now obviously this is spiritual in nature, and Adam officially became a living person. I believe it is very much similar in terms of new life today. At conception, the beginnings of a body take place, but there is no spirit/soul attached to it. Then sometime after two weeks of development, God places an individual's spirit into the newly forming body. This is when life begins.

I would say its not so much God created a mature universe, but an ordered universe. The "age" of it's appearance is based on scientific observation and reasoning. The problem with science is, it doesn't take God into account at all. It is solely based on testable observation. And if something is based on our sight, that makes it extremely limiting in terms of whole truth. At the end of it, I don't see an old universe (one that is billions of years old) and an old earth (over 4 billion years old) as being compatible with what is said concerning God in Scripture. Think about it in this way for instance...... Scripture says Jesus is coming back soon and will reign on earth for a thousand years. (Some believe He will reign in heaven for a thousand years, but I disagree. He's already reigning in heaven) After that, there will be one final stand for the devil before he is thrown into the Lake of Fire. Following that, all the unrighteous dead will be judged and meet the same fate. Then God will create a new heavens (I believe the universe) and new earth, and the Father will finally be among His people on the earth. Question, will this new heavens and new earth take billions of years to form? When God melt the elements of the old universe, will that take billions of years or more? According to science, the universe will continue on for trillions of years, with us long dead, as well as all the stars in the universe. That is the projection by science. As believers knowing Jesus is coming back, we can say science's projection of the universe will not happen. If it's projection is wrong, why not also say it is wrong concerning the history of the universe? This is the limits of our sight and observation. In truth we walk by faith and not by sight.

Can I ask you something. Did Jesus violate any law by touching an unclean person? (The man with leprosy)

The spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak. The power to live comes from our spirit. That is our new nature in Christ. If you truly believe Jesus died our death on the cross and rose again for our justification, then you are saved. So again, if you believe God accomplished this with Jesus. (Convinced) Yet, we still have these bodies we live in, and there is no power in it. You need to live by the power Jesus gave us, which is His perfection He lived while on the earth. This is a spiritual nature. So how do we do that? By hearing Jesus words, and thinking on them. Talk about them with others. (Are there other believers in your life?) The more you hear and speak His words, the more active your new nature will be. However if you are alone, it will be more difficult. (Particularly if you are around things that can distract you) Because you are here speaking with us, that alone says you're saved. Continue to pray and receive God's daily grace. They are new every morning, so continue to rest in Him. May you be blessed with every spiritual blessing in Christ. Also, a nice song to listen to is "Desert Rose" by Whiteheart.

Perhaps the bankers are anyone we see doing good in the world. For us, that might be charities. So if we support causes we know are doing good and helping others, they might be the bankers. Though I imagine we would better understand who the bankers might be, if we fully know what the talents represent. The master gave the servants talents (money), and two of the servants used that money to produce more money. So what do the talents represent in the parable? If we know what they represent, I believe that will answer who the bankers are.