artsylady

1 hour ago, hmbld said:

Renewable energy sounds great, but only the rich can actually afford it.  They can not stand on their own.  I've seen newer reports than the one I'll link here, but can't seem to locate them right now.

Like I said, more dollars need to go into it to make it more affordable and efficient. 

 

"In addition to the federal government, which has spent $150 billion in the last five years, states also heavily subsidize the industry by offering tax breaks and 538 rebate programs.

 

However, solar energy will only contribute 0.6 percent of total U.S. electricity generation in 2015, the TPA’s report said.
 

I don't have a lot of time to read the subsidies link, but isn't this just  about subsides to those individuals getting solar?    Not what I meant at all.  I mean grants to scientists, engineers, innovators.  Not just solar either... wind, water, whatever.   Oil is not a renewable resource.  It's going to keep rising in price.

 

1 hour ago, ayin jade said:

I don't know where you've been reading but water seems to be the biggest part of it.

I read the mainstream news among many other news sources and they all mention the sacred land issue as the primary reason for the protest. Quotes from various protesters also cite that as the primary reason for the protest. 

And yes, I agree. Once again the love of money being the root of all evil.  It's greed that is preventing renewable energy from being explored and expanded upon.    They won't make money or as much of it if it's renewable.  And the greedy oil companies will make far less of it.  

Greed is behind the renewable energy push. Companies make a bundle from it. As an example, I live in arizona where solar power should be cheap. Its not. In fact, those who have solar panels complain about the scam that they are, promising lower bills when in reality they cost far more, promising you can make money selling your energy back to the utility when you are limited in doing that.  

What are the drawbacks of renewable energy?   I can see drawbacks to the rich oil companies and to Saudi Arabia but I haven't considered drawbacks to it.

Solar power drawbacks include one solar farm in arizona that keeps setting itself on fire, commercial pilots complaining about being blinded by large solar power farms, and local increases in temperature that are associated with solar panels. Wind turbine drawbacks include massive bird deaths, fires from setting themselves on fire, changes in wind patterns (which can affect climate). Tidal power (making power through changes in tides) has been shown to affect the environment. All so called renewable energy is associated with an increased cost to consumers. There are elderly in my area who can barely afford air conditioning in the summer as it is. My summer bill is 180 a month. Some pay higher, depending on how well insulated the home is. Without air conditioning in arizona, people die. So how is an older person on fixed income supposed to afford the drastic rate increases associated with renewable energy?

There comes a point where I get the feeling you just want to argue with every point I try to make.  Now you want to argue with me about renewable energy?   Ok.... 

Anyway,  I would like to see a quote from a native saying that the main reason for the protest is because of the land (which should rightfully be theirs in the first place as it was given to them. )   I have been following this closely and never heard any quote like that. 

Like I said, there should be more effort and more monies being put into making renewable energy more affordable, accessible, efficient.   I guess you missed that.  Since oil is NOT  a renewable resource, it will continue to rise in price as we continue to be dependent on it.

4 minutes ago, other one said:

In Oklahoma, according to a meeting we had with OG&E a year or so ago, a coal fired plant from it's initial cost to use, maintance and decomissioning costs 4.3 cents a KWH to use.......    the cost of Natural Gas is 11 cents a KWH and solar and wind is 22 cents a KWH.

So if we get rid of Coal here in Oklahoma the production cost of electricity at my house will almost tripple and if we go all renewable will go up 510% which is simply not acceptable....   I don't need $700 a month electric bills.

I do not mean, in any way, shape or form, that we should be switching to electricity.  I mean that at this point, we should be looking at various ways to develop renewable energy to make it affordable.   Like solar and wind etc.   Take the billions of dollars in grants given out every year to try to prove evolution and put it into making renewable energy more efficient and more attainable, which would eventually become more affordable.

1 hour ago, missmuffet said:

 But If I am considering a problem between two people I always need to see two sides of the story to make a correct opinion.

I like this and can relate.

I think it helps if we enter a discussion with the knowledge that  a) we don't know it all, and b) not a single one of us has everything right.  Some people become Christians, decide what they believe on certain issues, and never change their minds on any of them their entire lives.  I am subject to change my opinions on many issues in light of new information.    And, I often say, "I'm not sure..  I haven't thought about it yet".   Some people HAVE to have an opinion on everything.   And, like others have said, there are a few that I will not change on, basically the apostles creed.  

Here is one of the videos.  To see the other, please scroll back a page. 

Did you watch the videos Ayin Jade?

I don't know where you've been reading but water seems to be the biggest part of it.

And yes, I agree. Once again the love of money being the root of all evil.  It's greed that is preventing renewable energy from being explored and expanded upon.    They won't make money or as much of it if it's renewable.  And the greedy oil companies will make far less of it.  

What are the drawbacks of renewable energy?   I can see drawbacks to the rich oil companies and to Saudi Arabia but I haven't considered drawbacks to it.

Amen Brother Joe!  Thank you!  

In my daily readings lately I keep coming up with verses in seeking justice for the poor and the forsaken in Proverbs.  So timely. 

True.

Good question.  I can disagree with anyone and still remain friendly and respectful and have no hard feelings, Christian or otherwise.   I think, sadly, that many cannot.   Love is reserved for those in agreement with each other.   They forget that love is a COMMANDMENT, not an option.  

Sadly, this sums it up.  http://fightthenewdrug.org/sex-before-kissing-15-year-old-girls-dealing-with-boys/

9 hours ago, ayin jade said:

So really, the entire protest is meaningless. The natives are not being deprived with the pipeline. They are just being AIM.

They already dug up their burial grounds.

They ARE the victims. This WAS their land, it was given to them but the government took it back 9 years after they gave it to them. They are trying to protect water.  Water is necessary for life.  Oil is not.  Oils spills happen.  I will post another video for you to take a look at.  And why are we still dependent on such a non renewable energy source anyway, when we should be seeing developments in renewable energy?   The root of it is...as you know... money. 

Not good.   23 have been jailed and being denied lawyers.   They are asking the public to spread the word so that they can get justice.  "Sacred Stone" camp from Ecuador came to stand with Standing Rock.   Media still not reporting.       

Thank you for your prayers and your concern. 

4 hours ago, Omegaman 3.0 said:

Also, if you are concerned with causes like the mistreatment of others, consider making that a prayer request in the prayer area of this forum.

Done!  I just wanted Christians to know what was going on because the media isn't really covering it.   People can decide to be concerned and pray or to turn a blind eye and ignore it. Love to all and God's blessing to all. 

4 hours ago, Omegaman 3.0 said:

Well, the reason I mentioned this, is that I have tracked down the Paine quote in the past, and it seemed not to have verifiable or credible sources. Sort of like the bogus "Darwin recanted" story and "Madeline Murray O'Hare wants to shut down Christian TV" rumor. As Christians, we should be all about truth, spreading false information, intentionally or mistakenly, does the cause of Christ more harm than good I think.

In any case, even if it were true that Paine and others said such things, what does that accomplish? Do we suppose that if some famous infidel has a change of heart, that unbelievers will suddenly believe the Gospel? I doubt that will be the case, and would rather that they get the gospel, than see us propagating falsehoods, deceptions, unsubstantiated stories etc.

It is hard to prove quotes, especially from that far back. I do think that on the brink of death, people DO come to Christ. I've certainly heard of this from friends and family that I know personally.   But, maybe you are right.  I'll just delete.  If I can figure out how.  Been a long time. 

1 hour ago, other one said:

Problem with this is that it's the democrats that is making this happen......      They are the ones responsible for Trump being on the news all the time.....    Hillary doesn't have anything that she has done that is really good so they (the Democrats) just want to put trump down for that's really all the stragety that they have.....   making Trump look now qualified to be president.....

As for Bernie, the hacked emails made it clear that it was the Democratic party that set the tone for Bernie.....  even when Bernie got the votes, he didn't get the electors to the convention.   That wasn't the fault of the News Media, and no matter how much coverage Bernie got he still could not have won the primary for they had the election stacked against him from the start.

I do agree that the News Media has a lot to do with who gets the coverage, but look now and even though Trump gets all the coverage he's still very close to winning in the polls.......   and that's because Hillary has no positive thing to say in the news......   she avoids meeting with reporters for a multitude of reasons....  Trump is on the News so much for the Democrats give the media things to talk about concerning him, and while defending himself he gets in his positive points and turns it against them.

If/when Donald gets elected, it will be the Democratic parties actions that will have made the difference for all the news media I have watched except Fox News has been negative against Trump, but they have let him express his rebuttal to the Democratic put downs...  I think hoping to hav him say something that makes him look bad in some way.'

And Trump is smart enough to use their way of reporting to his advantage.......   occasionally saying something that keeps him in the news that he can later explain what he was saying in a different way to make more clear his stand on the subject.

And it's working.

But the thing with Bernie was set within the Democratic parties rules where no one but Hillary could win.   That had nothing to do with the News Media.  She would have won no matter how much time Bernie had received.   But should something happen to Hillary now, Bernie might get his chance anyway.     And the last time I checked the Merlin Project was still showing Bernie winning the election and they have been really accurate in the past.

Whatever the case, this has been one of the most interesting elections this 70 year old guy has seen.

Wish I had more time.  I will have to try to read later.

1 hour ago, nebula said:

I thought this thread was to be about the Native pipeline protests and them being attacked by security dogs? 

It was but I wasn't allowed to post videos and then I think (or thought) Omegaman was maybe changing the topic to the media coverage.  I don't know. 

Kind of a coincidence ('God's way of being anonymous'?) but I just saw this posted on a Christian friend's facebook.  I hope it's allowed.  Pretty interesting.  When I was here in the spring, while Trump was being considered as a republican candidate, I was saying that it was obviously the media wanted him chosen as one.

Edit: Video removed, off topic, please keep your threads on topic, that fact that the media concentrates on Trump (because Hillary is avoiding the media) is interesting, but has nothing to do with Standing Rock.

Thank you Nebula!

Some of the videos got deleted.  Here is one that didn't, but it's good.  Here is the link.  Very interesting.

I agree Saved by Grace.  

7 hours ago, Omegaman 3.0 said:

This could be interesting thread, not as if there is any bias in the reporting in the video or anything, lol. By the way artsylady, you might want to look into the "Famous last words" in your signature, to see if there is any good historical documentation from reliable sources as to their veracity.

Actually when I talked with atheists here years ago, my list of quotes was larger.  I pared it down way back then due to being unable to prove some of the quotes. 

Yes, this could be an interesting thread!   Even a few weeks back I was hard pressed to find anything about this in the mainstream media at all.  Most of how I am learning is because i joined a few facebook pages to stand up with Standing Rock.  Its quite obvious that, sadly, native rights don't even matter enough to get into the news, even though this is the largest group of natives gathered together in more than 100 years as an act of solidarity.  

Anyway, I guess people, if they care, can look up the protestors (they call themselves protectors, actually which is more accurate)

I find the whole thing heartbreaking that no one cares if the aboriginals rights are being stripped away again, as we speak!  ....even though they've already suffered so much.   They're asking for our help and support and they are not getting it.  I find myself in tears about the whole thing at times watching some of the videos I can't post here but it also almost seems a lot of Christians don't care....   judging by responses here.   If that's true, that's even a sadder fact.     And they'll know we are Christians by our love.     Where is it? 

The atheists challenged me way back when on the ones on my profile.  I don't know about the ones posted by Hazard but I think the Voltaire one sounds right, from what I recall.

http://linknotallowed.com   

Edited by Omegaman 3.0 

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