WillingToDie

No, because he ascribes to the philosophy of "He who yells loudest wins". When he gets shown up by a guest, O'Reilly just starts yelling as loud as he can, even going as far as to tell his guest to "just shut up" and insult his guest. He'll ask a "tough question" and not give his guest an adequate chance to answer, as in the Dawkins interview.

Assaulted? Why wasn't he (Bill) arrested? There is no Dem out there who would hesitate to discredit O'Reilly. I saw the video. He never assaulted the guy who was moving around in front of the camera to block the camera's view. All I remember is Bill yelling at the guy to stop blocking the shot. Democrates, judges who are soft on sexual preditors, and leftist entertainers (?) avoid the Factor like the plague because they get asked real questions and are called out when they hem and haw. No, they avoid the Factor because O'Reilly is a blowhard and a bully.

This whole debate seems to be getting a little personal. Butero, those who say that there is nothing wrong with tattoos are not ignoring parts of scripture. They are, in fact, acknowledging Leviticus 19, but their interpretation is different from yours. There is no need to rehash this interpretation, as it has been given several times in this thread. As far as i've seen, those who are against tattoos have not refuted this interpretation, but rather seem to say "nuh uh" and continue on their way. Also, I find it interesting that you place the prohibition to marking the skin under moral law, when given the context it seems clear that it should more properly fall under the priest's law. However, I doubt any of this will change your mind, Butero, since i get the feeling that nothing we can say will get you to change your mind on teh subject, as your mind is already made up. The point is that nobody is saying anything of any substance. The whole matter comes down to how we view one verse. I believe that based on that verse, we are not to get tattoos. If we were simply discussing reasons why we view this verse different from one another, that would be one thing, but all I see is Artsylady calling names. It is funny that you choose that one post to say this thread is getting personal, and overlook the many posts by Artsylady that were far more personal in nature. The verse about tattoos has nothing to do with the office of the priests. There is nothing about it that gives instructions about how to conduct their office. The comments about things getting personal was a general observation, not directed towards you. Moving on, there has been substance posted, it was towards the beginning of the thread, where several arguments were made as t why that verse does not say what you think it says. Regarding the category of the verse, perhaps I misspoke. It is clear to me that the verse is not dealing with morality in the sense that we think of, but rather a prohibition against religious practices.

This whole debate seems to be getting a little personal. Butero, those who say that there is nothing wrong with tattoos are not ignoring parts of scripture. They are, in fact, acknowledging Leviticus 19, but their interpretation is different from yours. There is no need to rehash this interpretation, as it has been given several times in this thread. As far as i've seen, those who are against tattoos have not refuted this interpretation, but rather seem to say "nuh uh" and continue on their way. Also, I find it interesting that you place the prohibition to marking the skin under moral law, when given the context it seems clear that it should more properly fall under the priest's law. However, I doubt any of this will change your mind, Butero, since i get the feeling that nothing we can say will get you to change your mind on teh subject, as your mind is already made up.

Just a side thought: Wouldn't it be terribly ironic to get a tattoo that says "Leviticus 19:28"?

If someone has becomes so obsessed with D&D they lose touch with reality, it has everything to do with mental issues that person has. When is the last time you heard someone lose touch with reality because of Monopoly, James Bond Movies, or Jim Carrey movies? I'll bet you haven't. Now when is the last time you heard about someone losing touch with reality because they were Schizophrenic, suffering from Paranoid Delusions, Manic Depressive, Bipolar, or some combination of the above? One of these groups of things causes problems, the other doesn't. Guess which one it is. it is naive to think that our environment has no bearing on our mental state. many people have been driven to insanity...not because they were born that way...but because of external influences that beguiled them. Actually, as I recall, insanity is like a switch. Some people are born with a little switch in their head, so to speak, and a certain event, generally stress or substance abuse, flips that switch. This is how Schizophrenia is thought to work.

I was wondering when you would get in on this. So I take it our dealings with the verses you posted are not satisfactory?

That's Arab culture, not Islam. Africans, too. Islam doesn't tell them to mutilate women's genitals or force them to wear sacks, that's their own culture. Sucide bombing and murdering Jews and Christians is as much a part of Islam as the Crusades and the Inquisition were a part of Christianity. NOt true friend. Go flip through a Koran at your local book store. The Koran gives muslims specific orders to kill Christians and Jews whenever and wherever they can. to "Lie in wait for them" to "strike off their heads where ever they are found", and so on. The Koran allows muslims to lie about their own faith in order to promote their faith. In other words, they lie to you about their intentions in spreadin Islam. To a Muslim, "Peace" is defined as the total and utter destruction of all Christians and Jews, as well as all other "infidels". Muslims deny the deity of Jesus. According to the Bible, this means they do not serve the same God as Christians, and regardless of whatever Biblical quotes or principles they may otherwise follow (which aren't many, to be sure.) John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. 1 John 4:2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: 3And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. 2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. The muslims do not believe Jesus is the Christ in the first place, and moreover do not believe he was God incarnate. "In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God....and the Word was made flesh and dwelt among us" Muslims do not believe that, therefore, they ARE worshipping the devil, and according to John, they are following the spirit of Anti-christ. John 8:17It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true. 18I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me beareth witness of me. 19Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also. 20These words spake Jesus in the treasury, as he taught in the temple: and no man laid hands on him; for his hour was not yet come. 21Then said Jesus again unto them, I go my way, and ye shall seek me, and shall die in your sins: whither I go, ye cannot come. 22Then said the Jews, Will he kill himself? because he saith, Whither I go, ye cannot come. 23And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world. 24I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins. ----- Friend, its plain and simple, anyone who does not believe that Jesus is the Son of God, and accept and confess him as their Lord and Savior does NOT serve the same God as Christians. The fact is, the Bible clearly states that all other religions are, to be blunt, devil worship. 2 Corinthians 6:15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel? Beware of people of other religions. The devil uses them to confuse you. You are supposed to minister to them and convince them that Jesus is THE way and THE truth and THE life. "The kingdom of heaven suffereth violence and the violent take it by force" The devil doesn't play games and neither should you. As a christian you are supposed to fight the lies of false religion and false doctrine with the "Sword of the Spirit", that is the Word of God. For everything they try to tell you about the Koran and Islam, you ought to turn around and say, "But this is what the Word of God says about that". That's the thing about the Koran, it contradicts itself, as there are verses calling for Muslims to act peaceable towards "people of the book" And, by your logic, the Jews do not worship the same God as us because they don't recognize the deity of Jesus.

Hasn't the passage from Leviticus been dealt with already?

You'll need a little more than that to convince people. The problem with that is, many youth leaders are not qualified or equipped to teach young people. In many congregations youth leaders are merely college-age or adults in their early 30s that, at best, went through a very short training on how to lead young people. Even still that typically only happens in the larger congregations. In the small local churches youth leaders are little more than babysitters or camp leaders. I agree, up until about 8 months ago I was the youth leader at a small church while going through college. My resources were limited, but I never taught my youth anything without backing it up scripturally, theologically, philosophically, or any combination of the 3. I also encouraged them to argue with me or challenge me if they disagreed.

Same as tattoos: no big deal. You'll need a little more than that to convince people.

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/125559 Perhaps not teh first temple itself, but certainly ruins from that time period.

Seeing it as graffiti is one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is further beautification of the temple. I would argue here that, judging from the structure of this verse, it is implied that you are not to print marks on you for the dead. As for it being a vanity issue it's more than that, although in some cases it is. However, there are some people who really love tattoos for what they are, but its hard to explain it to people. I guess you really don't understand it unless you're "one of those people".

I would have to say no, they are not sinful.

I might add that imperialism didn't begin in Europe. It existed everywhere. Study the history of China sometime, for instance. The African nations, too, had their own imperialism - just not the means to be as wide-spread as the Europeans got. Certainly, China even came close once, but for some reason the emperor had the entire fleet burned last minute. Saw it on the History Channel Imperialism occurs whenever a nation is willing to put their own interests before the interests of another people or nation.

Don't you hate it when that happens? Sure do. Oh well, it's part of Forum Life.

I think I see what you are saying here, but I think that a firm relationship with God is not needed to keep from being sucked in (although I'm sure it certainly helps). I think that, more important (in this case, at least), is a firm relationship with reality.

Do you think I'm trying to make you feel bad for your ancestor's actions? I'm not. I don't feel responsible for my ancestor's actions. Those are theirs, not my own. Furthermore, the primary colonial powers were Spain, Portugal, France, England, and The Netherlands. My ancestry, as far as I know, is none of the above. So I'm not "blaming my own race" for anything. These ad hominem attacks are uncalled for. I'm simply pointing out the facts, I'm not trying to make you feel guilty in the least. And I'm not sure where you're getting this business about slavery, I never mentioned slavery. And, just so you know, I'm flustered because I'm the only one on "my side" in a topic where my arguments are repeatedly distorted and misconstrued. -edit-Thank you, Yod. that is more or less what I was saying.

Very cool. I saw pics from their first protest in L.A. I was digging the Guy Fawkes/V for Vendetta Masks

So you personally know people who have tried to commit suicide over D&D?

Many of her claims have been discredited, however those of the anti-D&D persuasion still continue to parrot her "findings" to substantiate their claims.

No, it's biased because it already sets out with an agenda, and twists truth and tells helf-truths to fit their agenda. As for your second comment, about people committing suicide, etc. this is a claim I hear thrown about quite often, but I've never seen any documentation confirming it, which leads me to believe it's an urban legend. And just because someone is Ivy League doesn't mean they're less likely to go off the tracks. In fact, I'd argue that, due to the high stress of the environment, they're even more likely to go off the tracks.

Nope, didn't say that; you sound a little defensive. When people make statements that whites are the "problem," when "people" are the problem, I say something. Come back to reality. It's not "our" fault that blacks hate each other just because of their ancestry, religion or dialect. It is not "our" fault that "people" hack each other to death with machetes. It is not "our" fault that "people" are beheading, bombing and mutilating others because "we" are of their religion. I personally take offense when "you" blame "me" for all the problems in the world. The real culprit is Satan and sin. Defensive? No. Flustered? Most certainly. I still contend that what tribal/clan tensions there were before colonization happened were exasperated by Europe's action's during the colonial period. I never blamed you for the problems in the world, if I were to put the blame on anybody (which I won't, because I know the blame belongs to many) I would have to say that colonial Europe is to blame. Are you colonial Europe? Of course not.

I'm really not sure what I think of this....

Yes, because those are clearly unbiased sources. Why not present the Chick tract as well?