Brother Chad

Obedience is of the utmost importance to be a follower of Christ. Otherwise, why would He have said these things.

Speaking in tongues in for everyone!

Call it what you will but infant baptism is not a part of the Bible. As Christians we should strive to align our doctrines with that of the only manual necessary to bring about obedience to the Word of God. When you show a verse like that of Cornelius and his entire household, would you also include any animals that were present? Babies are not able to have saving faith like that of someone who is older. We must have this faith in order to submit to the Lord's Ways. There is no need to baptize a baby because they are not held accountable like the rest of us who have sinned. We must remember that water baptism is necessary for the "remission of sins" and babies once again have not sinned. So we all know that babies are unable to have a clear understanding of faith and obedience to God and will eventually come to these realizations, it is then that they are to "Repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins." (Acts 2:38). The Catholic doctrine has many issues of man's hand running through it and this is yet another instance of that taking place. God bless our babies that they are not held accountable until their reasoning skills have been realized.

Chad

I have never heard or read anywhere that those who are not immersed at baptism go to hell. We don't seek to judge, but rather leave it up to the only One who will, Jesus Christ. However, it is our goal to follow the Bible and do it to the best of our ability. The Bible clearly shows that immersion is the proper way to baptize: -The word baptism comes from the Greek word bapto which means "to dip." There were other Greek words to indicate sprinkling, but God chose a word to indicate immersion. -Immersion is the only mode of baptism the Bible records. John the Baptist used the Jordan River (Mark 1:5, 9). John immersed Jesus: "And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water" (Matthew 3:16). Philip immersed the Ethiopian eunuch: "They went down both into the water.... and he baptized him. And when they were come up out of the water" (Acts 8:38-39). -Paul used baptism to relate a burial with Christ, "Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life" (Romans 6:4). No one is buried by sprinkling or pouring a little dirt on the body, by only by complete submergence. -Since Bible days, other forms of baptism have arisen, but the Bible never describes these forms. Sprinkling and pouring came about as a matter of convenience. Infant baptism, triple baptism by some trinitarians, and postponement of baptism until the deathbed (an attempt to live one's life in sin and still be saved) are all nonbiblical baptismal practices and made immersion even more inconvenient. Here are some reasons why the mode of baptism is important: -Baptism is a biblical command. Since the Bible puts so much emphasis on baptism, we should perform as close to the way the Bible describes it. -Jesus was immersed as an example for us to follow. It is worth doing the way Jesus and His apostles did it. -Other modes of baptism were invented from nonbiblical tradition. Jesus condemned tradition fervently when it caused a deviation from God's Word (Mark 7:8; Matthew 15:6). -The only advantage sprinkling has is convenience and is a poor excuse for not following the Bible. -Immersion demonstrates obedience to God and respect for His Word. -Only by immersion do we retain the significance of baptism as a burial with Christ. I hope this answers your question! I agree, Bro. Chad, after we receive Jesus as our Saviour, then baptism follows, like you said it is dying to the old self, and coming up a new creature in Christ Jesus. Is this true?? Also I have some JW friends, that they say they do not agree with, The Trinity. The Father, Son, and H.S. - They do not understand how 3 people can be in one. can you explain that.??YSIC Littlelite As a UPC saint I do not believe in the trinity myself. I have studied both doctrines and have come to the conclusion that the Bible is clear on the fact that God is one in nature, essence, and Being. For some further light on the subject please feel free to look at the Soapbox debate between myself and Ovedya. If you have any other questions just let me know!

I like how you think here and I understand where you are coming from. The point I am trying to get across is Jesus left us with a help guide for many different situations. The most important of those for us is our salvation. It is our chance to turn from the world and follow God. That is our purpose in life! So we should all strive to follow His teachings on the subject as closely as possible. I am not going to say that because you were sprinkled with water that you are not saved. However, I will say once again that the Bible never uses this approach. When I was 10 years old I was baptized by full immersion in the titles of the Father, the Son, and Holy Ghost. Once I really became "born again" in 2004, I realized that the baptism I received was not what Jesus or His disciples taught us, so I was re-baptized in Jesus name and have never been the same since. Still, I am not trying to downplay your salvation here at all, but rather giving my testimony because of the wonderful works that God has done in my life after I started following the Bible as my guide through life. And I still have along way to go. As far as you being rebaptized, think of this: Paul met some disciples who had been baptized by John's baptism (for repentance) and they had not yet received the Holy Ghost. Did Paul think that all God's work had been achieved here. The answer would have to be no because he re-baptized them all in Jesus name and it was then that they all receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. It would definitely do you no harm in getting rebaptized in Jesus name. All accounts in the New Testament use some form of it and if we are to believe that the Bible is the infallible Word of God then shouldn't we follow it and not man's traditions? One thing I can say for sure is I would never tell a soul that they were not saved. I am training as we speak to become a minister of the Word and it is my heartfelt desire to seek God's truth, ways, and to walk in obedience to Him. I feel that if we give our heart and soul to God relinquishing all control over our lives to Jesus Christ that He will do all the work and lead us to salvation through the process that He and His disciples have laid out for us. If these parts of the process were not important then why show them in the Bible. Some say that we rely on works for our salvation and if you interpret what I have said to mean that, then you are missing the point. We can only reject or accept what God has offered us. The works are of God. When we give ourselves to Him, we will want to repent, be baptized, and receive the Holy Ghost and on our own none of this would be of any use. It is God and God alone who works out our salvation but we must accept the works of God for it to have any meaning in our lives. Faith is a growing process that is for sure and I think everyone here can attest to that. To receive the full gifts of God we must be obedient to Him and once we complete the simple process of salvation, it is my belief that God then gives us the tools to stand victorious in any storm and in any disaster. The devil and hell have no way to attack and win when we accept the full power of salvation in Jesus Christ and obey His Word. Hallelujah.

Brother Chad, The statement quoted from your original post above appears to be in contrast with your most recent postings. Was the original intent of this thread to ask about salvational requirements, or to challenge others' doctinal understandings with your own? Sorry if I seem a bit suspicious, but there appears to be an agenda in your postings here. I am just trying to get to the bottom of this whole issue. I am a newly born Christian (less than two years). I have seen many things that disturb me on the nature of God as well as our salvation. I have made it a point to go by the Bible and nothing but. I wish to learn only what the Bible says and that is why I asked for everyone's doctrines because I don't understand how they can be so different from mine when I am just applying what the Bible says on the subject. Truly there is no intention of an agenda, just the truth!! Sorry for those posts that seem sarcastic or misleading. I do this out of love and only love.

So we can have faith in Jesus and not do any of the things which He commanded us to do and still be saved. We can have faith in Jesus and not follow His Word and still be saved. You are speaking of faith without saving faith. Saving faith will lead us to die to our old selves by repenting of sins (Jesus' death), water baptism by immersion in Jesus' name for remission of sins (be buried with Christ), and to receive the gift of the Holy Ghost (resurrection of Jesus). These are all clearly related in the Bible. We must not just accept the gospel of Jesus Christ, we must also apply that gospel to our lives by obedience to its requirements. It takes both. It was this same form of thinking that caused the Pharisees to add to the basic Laws GOD gave, and put a stranglehold on the people of Israel. They put comma's where GOD had put period's (Matthew 23:1-36) I am not adding anything to the Bible. It speaks for itself on the issue. I will not live by this easy-believism that has come into play in our times.

So we can have faith in Jesus and not do any of the things which He commanded us to do and still be saved. We can have faith in Jesus and not follow His Word and still be saved. You are speaking of faith without saving faith. Saving faith will lead us to die to our old selves by repenting of sins (Jesus' death), water baptism by immersion in Jesus' name for remission of sins (be buried with Christ), and to receive the gift of the Holy Ghost (resurrection of Jesus). These are all clearly related in the Bible. We must not just accept the gospel of Jesus Christ, we must also apply that gospel to our lives by obedience to its requirements. It takes both. There is no distinction between faith and "saving faith" in the Bible. "Saving faith" is a religious term coined entirely outside the realm of Biblical truth. Then by your stance, even the devils are saved. "You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe

Ovedya asks, Yes, it is my belief that without water baptism salvation is

So we can have faith in Jesus and not do any of the things which He commanded us to do and still be saved. We can have faith in Jesus and not follow His Word and still be saved. You are speaking of faith without saving faith. Saving faith will lead us to die to our old selves by repenting of sins (Jesus' death), water baptism by immersion in Jesus' name for remission of sins (be buried with Christ), and to receive the gift of the Holy Ghost (resurrection of Jesus). These are all clearly related in the Bible. We must not just accept the gospel of Jesus Christ, we must also apply that gospel to our lives by obedience to its requirements. It takes both.

Jesus was the high priest for everyone on this earth and in heaven. He was the ultimate high priest so your argument here is somewhat unimportant. So what you must answer with this statement is why after Jesus death, burial, and resurrection did the new covenant include repentance, water baptism, and receiving the Holy Ghost? Are these all just mere ceremony? Why so much emphasis on these events if they were not important in the scheme of things?

I have never heard or read anywhere that those who are not immersed at baptism go to hell. We don't seek to judge, but rather leave it up to the only One who will, Jesus Christ. However, it is our goal to follow the Bible and do it to the best of our ability. The Bible clearly shows that immersion is the proper way to baptize: -The word baptism comes from the Greek word bapto which means "to dip." There were other Greek words to indicate sprinkling, but God chose a word to indicate immersion. -Immersion is the only mode of baptism the Bible records. John the Baptist used the Jordan River (Mark 1:5, 9). John immersed Jesus: "And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water" (Matthew 3:16). Philip immersed the Ethiopian eunuch: "They went down both into the water.... and he baptized him. And when they were come up out of the water" (Acts 8:38-39). -Paul used baptism to relate a burial with Christ, "Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life" (Romans 6:4). No one is buried by sprinkling or pouring a little dirt on the body, by only by complete submergence. -Since Bible days, other forms of baptism have arisen, but the Bible never describes these forms. Sprinkling and pouring came about as a matter of convenience. Infant baptism, triple baptism by some trinitarians, and postponement of baptism until the deathbed (an attempt to live one's life in sin and still be saved) are all nonbiblical baptismal practices and made immersion even more inconvenient. Here are some reasons why the mode of baptism is important: -Baptism is a biblical command. Since the Bible puts so much emphasis on baptism, we should perform as close to the way the Bible describes it. -Jesus was immersed as an example for us to follow. It is worth doing the way Jesus and His apostles did it. -Other modes of baptism were invented from nonbiblical tradition. Jesus condemned tradition fervently when it caused a deviation from God's Word (Mark 7:8; Matthew 15:6). -The only advantage sprinkling has is convenience and is a poor excuse for not following the Bible. -Immersion demonstrates obedience to God and respect for His Word. -Only by immersion do we retain the significance of baptism as a burial with Christ. I hope this answers your question!

Since it is me against the world, again! I will try to address each of your questions or comments. There is nothing complex about the Word of God. By your interpretation, and that of many, you believe that once we proclaim with our mouths that Jesus Christ is Lord and Savior, that is all that needs to be done. Well, I say that no one in the Book of Acts did this and were saved. They went through the same process time and again. Jesus taught about it and so did all His disciples. Remember that I am not saying these are works that we do for our salvation. They are works of God in our salvation process when we submit or yield to His grace. It takes both.

That is good stuff and I respect what you have written, WISDOM. The case of the thief on the cross is not the same as a born again believer though. He was saved by the old covenant, where Jesus was his high priest and sacrifice. The Bible is very clear with regards to our salvation and although it is a free gift of God, there is a process to it: GRACE: This is a must in our salvation and is an

Chad...let me ask you an honest, sincere question. If a person is lying on their deathbed, and had NEVER before professed a belief in CHRIST (Romans 10:9-10), however he/she made this "11th Hour" acceptance of the free gift of salvation through FAITH & CONFESSION BY MOUTH, and BELIEF in their heart, yet they didn't get water baptized, nor did they speak in tongues, and moments later they died. Would they go to be with their LORD/SAVIOUR or be separated from HIM for Eternity? Now, before you respond, please carefully and thoughtfully read again what I just wrote to you in its entirety. I have been given this question before and you must understand that my ways are not God's ways. I do not think that I have any power to judge or tell you what will happen to a person if this case were to happen to them. This case would be left up to God Himself and I don't think any human being could surely say whether or not that person would go to heaven or hell. Let me just share some thoughts with you and see what you think? -We all know that we are sinners and are in need of salvation. "Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?" (Proverbs 20:9). -We all know that salvation comes "only" through faith in Jesus Christ. No amount of good works or adherence to law can save a man. "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of ourselves: it is a gift of God: not of works, lest any man should boast." (Ephesians 2:8-9) -There are past, present, and future aspects of salvation. Past-at a past point in time we received forgiveness of sin, freedom from sin's control, and power to live for God. (Titus 3:5) Present-we presently enjoy forgiveness of sins, power to live for God, and freedom from the power of sin (Ephesians 2:5). Future-We have not received final and complete deliverance from all the curse of sin. We still live in this sinful and imperfect world. Our salvation will be complete when we receive our immortal, glorified bodies like that of the resurrected body of Jesus (Romans 8:23; I Corinthians 15:51-57; Acts 15:11). Now that we have alittle ground work in place, we must ask the question: How can we be saved from sin in this life? Jesus said in John 3:3, "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." The Jewish religious leader that He was talking to, Nicodemus, did not understand this because he asked Jesus how a man could be born a second time from his mother's womb. Jesus answered, "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God" (John 3:5). This was Jesus answer in pointing to a time when the new covenant with man would be revealed. So when Nicodemus sought after the answer to the question above, Jesus Himself said, "You must be born again of water and the Spirit." This is a call for more than just mere faith in Jesus. He is giving a prophecy of the coming kingdom and how we can get in. Later we have the Book of Acts, which is a historical account of the first church after Jesus' ascension. In Acts 1, last minute instructions were given by Jesus to His disciples. He told them to go into Jerusalem and wait for the promise of the Father, the baptism of the Holy Ghost. In Acts 2 on the Day of Pentecost, we see the promised Spirit baptism coming onto the 120 or so believers in the upper room. Attracted by the strange happenings, many onlookers gathered around this first outpouring of the Spirit. Peter took this opportunity to preach to the crowd. He proclaimed that Jesus of Nazareth, was both Lord and Christ. The crowd hearing this felt guilt in their hearts and asked Peter and the rest of the apostles, "Men and brethren, what must we do?" (Acts 2:37) They were obviously asking them, "What must we do to be saved?" Peter gave them a plain, simple, unambiguous answer to a direct inquiry, "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost" (Acts 2:38). This answer had the full endorsement of all the apostles otherwise we would have surely seen some dissension later on. This is the authoritative answer of the apostolic church to the question, "What must I do to be saved?" In short, when Jesus answered Nicodemus, He was describing God's plan of salvation for the future New Testament church that was about to come into existence. He was giving Nicodemus information to help motivate him to believe in His person and mission. Peter's answer was a direct answer to a direct question about salvation. The Spirit had been given and Peter wanted to give explicit instructions and to produce an immediate new birth.

Yes, Ovedya we all lay our absolute devotion and dependence upon Christ. In Him we live and move and have our being. I agree and that is why we follow what He said in the Bible and what His disciples have taught in the Bible to know that it takes more than just easy-believism to be saved. Yes, it is a free gift of God but is a process and one that Jesus, Peter, Paul and many others attest to in the Bible. Remember, the devils in James 2:19 also believe that Jesus is the Son of God. Does this mean that they are saved and going to heaven?

Let me further relate my question so that I can be clear about what I am asking. In my faith, we believe that you must have a true and sincere faith that Jesus died, was buried, and was resurrected. This I know is a common theme in all major denominations of Christianity. It is our base or foundation for our faith. Many stop there and do not believe that we must obey all the other references in the Bible to our salvation. Repentance is the first step. We must have a genuine sorrow for our sins and ask God for forgiveness. When we do this, God will apply the blood of Jesus to our lives and help us to apply His Word and our obedience to His Word. Then we must be baptized in water (full immersion) in the name of Jesus for the "remission of our sins." It is clear in the Bible that we are to be baptized for remittance of sins. Our faith alone does not bring about the cleansing of our sins in the past, only water baptism can do this. Lastly, the Holy Spirit will enter us and we will speak with other tongues as the Spirit gives us utterance. I know that many don't hold to these basic salvation principles because of one reason or another, but it is biblical and I would love to discuss this with whoever. God bless, Bro. Chad

I was just wondering why there are so many conflicting views in regards to our salvation? The Bible has made some issues of doctrine rather vague and open to different interpretations, but with regards to salvation it is pretty much cut and dry. So why are there so many different views of what our salvation is and how we achieve it. Many will say that my particular faith is too tied up in works to achieve salvation, but I am here to say that our salvation is a free gift of God and requires certain things of us that are not works of man but are rather works of God that involve our acceptance of the His Word and an obedience to it as well. So my question is what do the different denominations believe is required for our salvation? Please give your denomination in your reply as this is for study purposes? Thank you for any help! Brother Chad

I just wanted to relay a message I heard in church last night. We as Christians, are under ATTACK! You all know what I am talking about. There are four main views of thought in this country right now: Christian-faith, communism or marxism, secular humanism, and the new age movement. There are over 192 million professing Christians in the United States and only 7 million humanists!! However, our schools have been infiltrated by these humanists and now only that material which is neutral is allowed in. No longer are our children taught the things we once were, but are fed doses and doses of humanist doctrine. We must speak out! We must get involved! Don't sit back and let those who wish to destroy Christianity and our faith in Jesus Christ get the upper hand. We are the majority and let's make sure that we don't become the silent majority. Too many of us are hiding around waiting for the second coming and that is good and all, but our society is paying the price. Abortions are rampant, homosexuality is becoming acceptable, television is the great abyss, and our children are in for the fight of their lives. Never before have the stakes been so high for our young people. There is so much information out there available to them that it will be a long and hard road to keep them on the straight and narrow. This scares the living daylights out of me as a father and I know it does the same to some of you. I have heard on many news programs that we are the religious "right", fanatics and Bible beaters. What a compliment! However, what we must uncover is that those who are spewing their venom against Christians on our media outlets are the real radicals. They are the ones who want no sign of our Christian faith anywhere publicly shown and if they have their way, then let the persecutions begin. I know that in this great country of ours (USA) that we are more free to practice our religion than in most other lands, but if we don't stand up and speak out when we see injustice and religious persecution towards our own brothers and sisters, then we are going to lose the fight! Truth is we all know how it all turns out. We know that Jesus Christ is going to win in the end. It is my opinion that we must always take up our sword of truth and let those who seek to rid the earth of us, that we are going nowhere and will always stand up and fight for Him who saved our lives. The only One who shed innocent blood so that we might all have a personal relationship with Him. Jesus Christ is my hero and I intend on fighting for Him until the end! God bless, Brother Chad

I believe I will start with your use of Genesis 1:26-27. You have stated that the