SammySmile

To anyone still lurking through this thread, let me say that there are certain grounds expressed in the Bible regarding divorce, but the Bible, in my assessment, does not really get into the finite details of divorce grounds per se. For good reason, as the issue really pertains to the heart of two individuals. Divorce only occurs when one or both harden their heart in a marriage. This hardening can manifest in many ways, ie, adultery, unforgiveness, abandonment, etc.

Hello A few comments here. Here is one presumed axiom quoted from a website referenced in the thread: "FACT: We all know its dealing with sexual sin by a person we have entered into a marital covenant with." (referencing the exception clause) I don't think we can accept this statement as a fact. The term "fornication" as used in Jesus' day had a very broad meaning, referencing sexual sins within and without marriage, but its use in the Bible seems to be mainly confined to unlawful sexual unions outside marriage. (I Cor 5:1, I Cor. 7:2) The term "adultery" or "marital unfaithfulness" was not used by Jesus as an exception. Therefore, the term "fornication" may actually be referencing the unlawfulness of the marriage/relationship rather than sexual sin of one within a legal marriage. Also, to describe the "any matter" divorce procedure as "frivilous" divorce, and that Jesus was condemning this divorce procedure seems to be connecting dots that don't really deserve to be connected here. The "any matter" divorce procedure was not really meant to be an instrument for frivilous divorce, but was just a procedure that allowed divorce without the blood and guts display that the Shammaites required. Joseph was going to divorce Mary under the "any matter" divorce procedure and the Bible says that Joseph was a righteous man. In fact, in that day, it was a well accepted fact that the any matter divorce was considered the more righteous. The Shammaites' divorce procedure was looked upon as harsh and impractical and was eventually banned from civil practice altogether. So the concept that Jesus was establishing that divorce for "any matter" was adultery makes zero sense, IMHO. Thanks for reading Frank

Thanks, again, Sherman!

I would like to just publicly thank Sherman for starting this thread. Sherman is a personal friend, and I have read his book and highly recommend it for anyone who is trying to find the truth of this very important subject. I can say that it's obvious that God hates all sin, and that includes sinful divorce. I will also say, however, that I believe that God is not "anti-marriage," nor is he "anti-remarriage," but just the opposite. I do not believe there are set biblical grounds for divorce the way many pastors like to establish. Just some brotherly advice, please, that we not launch attacks against one another, as this topic, as other controversial topics, can get really heated. Just wanted to encourage everyone to post their feelings without fear of being attacked. That's the most godly way to proceed for sure. That's all for now. God bless Frank Austin

Rosie, honey, I AM sorry if it seemed I was making light of your situation. I understand the heartache you must be going through at this time. The Lord bless you and keep you; The Lord make his face shine upon you and be gracious to you; The Lord turn his face toward you and give you PEACE Numbers 6:24-26 Biblicist Thanks for that link for Mr. Francisco! That's great! Count me in with agreeing with him 100 percent as well!

I appreciate modern translations, but they obviously have their limitations. The NIV says, "Are you unmarried?" The original Greek, however, says, "luo," which means to loosen what is fast or bound, meaning to unbind, destroy or dissolve. "Loosed" is set in contrast to "bound," clearly reinforcing the concept that "loosed" equates divorce. Paul in essence is saying, "If you are married, do not seek a divorce. If you are divorced, do not seek to get married again." The Holy Bible from Ancient Eastern Manuscripts actually translates this passage as, "If you are divorced from a wife, do not seek a wife. But if you marry, you do not sin." In order to find the truth of these passages, it's important to look beyond our modern translations which are, I'm afraid, a little tainted with interpretations of our modern day tradition of condeming and ensnaring divorced folks. And yes, I agree divorce should have limitations.

Rosie, First, legally he is responsible for his children. Any Court in the country will compel him to pay you child support. That's a fact. Second, if he's sending you away, you should file for divorce and start that process. Forget about him making up his mind. He will probably never make up his mind. (That's just my opinion; you have to do what you think best, of course.) Neglecting to care for your family is what Paul called "being worse than an infidel." I would sugget you consult a family/divorce attorney. I appreciate the Lord can work in your husband's heart. But you have to take care of your kids. You have to get on with your life. Don't let the children and yourself suffer needlessly waiting forever.

Sammy, I think we should let Rosie speak for herself please. I would really like to know why you think that Rosie needs to be forgiven by God for the divorce. How is it her fault that her husband can not forgive her? Are her marital sins somehow worse than his? Ya know what, don't answer that, I don't think it would do Rosie any good for you to critique her marriage. Are you under the impression that a woman needs a man to rebuild her life? I only know of one (1) remarriage that has truly been blessed by the Lord and that, I believe, is because the divorce happened before salvation and the second marriage happened after salvation. It was truly ordained by God how things worked in that womans life. I feel that to many woman, and men, jump into second relationships too soon. Their judgement is off because of being hurt and they end up going from one bad relationship to another. If Rosie does find herself single again, God forbid, I think she should take plenty of time to assess the damage and learn to love herself again before she even considers moving on. Time, and the Lord, heals all wounds, not another relationship. God is our ultimate comforter, healer and friend. In His Grip, Mr. Biblicist, I know little to nothing about Rosie. I believe she mentioned a moral failure on her part and the fact her husband couldn't forgive her. All I said was that she can -- if she hasn't already -- be made anew by the power of Christ. Many times when folks find themselves in the grip of divorce, the church likes to come in and cast all kinds of condemnation and bondage. I was only pointing out that that should not be the case. You seem to be harping on something that's not there. You say, "Are you under the impression that a woman needs a man to rebuild her life?" -- No. I never said that. Don't know where you got that from. You say, "I only know of one (1) remarriage that has truly been blessed by the Lord and that, I believe, is because the divorce happened before salvation and the second marriage happened after salvation." That's nice. I know of many remarriages that have been blessed, and I know many folks who have not divorced and remarried, stayed bound to a marriage or stayed single because the church told them to, and they lived their lives in torment and misery, and also the children were forced to grow up without a father or mother. I never insinuated that someone should leave a marriage and hastily run to another. It is, however, very erroneous to believe that one cannot be remarried after a divorce. I don't care if the divorce was pre-salvation or post-salvation. The church needs to get it right. The Bible does not condemn remarriage after a divorce. That's the way God laid it out in the Old Testament. And with proper interpretation, we see that's the way He's laid it out in the New Testament.

Sammy You took this verse out of context. This was speaking to virgins. The context: 1Co 7:27 Art thou bound unto a wife? seek not to be loosed. Art thou loosed from a wife? seek not a wife. 1Co 7:28 But and if thou marry, thou hast not sinned; and if a virgin marry, she hath not sinned. The second half of verse 28 is obviously talking about virgins, but Sammy was quoting the first half of the verse. Who is that addressed to? The person in verse 27, who is loosed from a wife? Because that's what the passage looks like to me. Yes, I took nothing out of context. Just the opposite. The word "loosed" literally means "destroyed." In other words, if one finds themselves with a destroyed or terminated marriage, remarriage is not sin. Verse 27 says Art thou bound unto a wife? Asking if they are married and continues to say: seek not to be loosed. Which is saying do not seek to seperate! Then it goes on to say: Art thou loosed from a wife? That means no longer with your wife, then it says: seek NOT a wife. Now 28 goes in the same direction as verse 27 did. But if thou marry, This part is like answering the question at the beginning of verse 27. It goes on to say that when you marry there will be trouble It does not say anything at all that it is OK to remarry! "LOJ" With all due respect, you're just not understanding the plain text. You say, "This part is like answering the question at the beginning of verse 27." My question to you is, How is saying "But if thou marry, thou hast not sinned," answering "Art thou bound to a wife? seek not to be loosed"? I think you need to read the passage carefully, my friend. You say, "It does not say anything at all that it is OK to remarry!" You are not correct. That is exactly what it says. Again, "Art thou loosed from a wife? seek not a wife. But and if thou marry, thou hast NOT sinned." The plain meaning of the passage is clear.

Well, it's obvious Rosie isn't doing well at all. Her husband wants to divorce her. The good news is she can be forgiven by God and rebuild her life, regardless of her husband's decision.

Sammy You took this verse out of context. This was speaking to virgins. The context: 1Co 7:27 Art thou bound unto a wife? seek not to be loosed. Art thou loosed from a wife? seek not a wife. 1Co 7:28 But and if thou marry, thou hast not sinned; and if a virgin marry, she hath not sinned. The second half of verse 28 is obviously talking about virgins, but Sammy was quoting the first half of the verse. Who is that addressed to? The person in verse 27, who is loosed from a wife? Because that's what the passage looks like to me. Yes, I took nothing out of context. Just the opposite. The word "loosed" literally means "destroyed." In other words, if one finds themselves with a destroyed or terminated marriage, remarriage is not sin.

I Cor. 7:28: "But if thou marry, thou hast not sinned." Remarriage is allowed after divorce.

First of all, it's extremely rare that this happens. Yes, it can, but it's one in a million. It's not practical (nor Biblical in my opinion) to sentence a wife to play a waiting game for a miracle to occur. Plus, in situations where there's abuse, it's dangerous. That was the reason why the Old Testament gave clear allowance for remarriage. It prevented women from being sentenced to lives of torture. Peace.

It doesn't really matter. If one is a professing believer, but telling their spouse they just want out, I'd have to say they're obviously not walking with God. Thus they should be considered an unbeliever. I mean, Paul said if a man didn't provide material things for his family he has denied the faith and is worse than an infidel. So as far as I'm concerned, if someone wants to act that way, all appearances are they are NOT a believer, regardless of some profession of faith.

In the Old Testament, for a wife to return to a former husband after she was divorced from a second was forbidden. The Lord called it an "abomination." Now, I realize the Lord forgives all manner of sin. Thus, it causes a pause. The scenario, however, kind of sounds like this guy doesn't know what he's doing and should really just stay single for a while and get godly discipling. Frank