viajero

On another thread, I said how that I had lived in Egypt for 3 years (left last year), and I had many conversations with Muslims about God and Christ. For much of the time I believed they worshipped the same God as Christians do. many times I would say, Yes, that is what we believe, that is what our Bible says. This was of course, from the truth revealed in the O.T., but it was still the truth. After some time, with observation, I could see, they live by the Law, they do not have the Spirit. They have a spirit, but it is not the Holy Spirit. It is a very outward religion: praying 5 times a day, but outside and in between those times, their religion does not exist. Now, you should see when Ramadan is on. One month of hypocrisy. There are many things I could say of what I have seen and lived amongst. For one I will say, there are those I used to call "head bangers"or "brown heads". When they pray, they not only are upon their knees bowing, but they bang their heads on the floor. After some time, their is a brown scar on their forehead. The darker and more pronounced this mark, the more religious they appear to their countrymen. But the thing is, their are many who actually rub something on their foreheads to make them appear more religious. They are hypocrites. And this I was told by a Muslim with whom I spent many hour talking about God and Jesus and salvation. The agreement we had together about God was amazing, but when it came to Christ being God well, he is still a Muslim. I realized, it is only God/Christ, though the Holy Spirit that can reveal the divinity of Christ. Sure, they believe in Jesus, but not as we believe. To them, He was a prophet and whatever else, but not Saviour, because they don't understand the meaning of Salvation.

Waste of money, waste of time. The more movies I see, and that is not too many, the more I never want to go.

Do you know what you are talking about? I lived in Egypt for 3 years and I can show you places right in the middle of Cairo where there is much affection shown between Muslim men and women. It is not that different from the West. That picture was a one off, you could take a picture of the same scene anywhere. Knowing is experiencing. Don't believe everything you hear or see on the media, or a picture for that matter.

What is love? <---- only a few will catch this reference. I meant: Is that a picture of love? They look like backpackers to me, who knows?

Is that love??

Hupo, the few times I have been to Israel, I have been told that many of the Russians immigrants have come in on forged documents, saying they were of Israeli descent. What is your opnion?

No it isn't an exaggeration. This is one of the main concerns of anyone in government office. Naturally those who "don't quite like us to be around", are doing what they can to change the demographic balance. Hupo, the few times I have been to Israel, I have been told that many of the Russians immigrants have come in on forged documents, saying they were of Israeli descent. What is your opnion?

The Old is in the New revealed, the New is in the Old concealed! God is revealed to us through his Word, by the Spirit. "But the natural man receives not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned". 1Cor.2:14. In the Old, we see the greatness and power of God, that we might fear Him and walk in wisdom.

What Happened? What happened was what Jesus and many other parts of the Bible said would happen. Read Jn.15:18-21. And the "world" mentioned here is very much the "spirit of the world", which is very much in the "church", as is often referred to in the Bible. But that is no longer a problem to me, it is a fact of life for the Christian who follow Jesus.

Oh You Meeny You! Dear Jeffrey I can only guess you are feeling judged because you did an act of charity (maybe) and now you think you are "The Talk of The Town" within your Church and you don't like it and you are coming into Worthy to kick a brother or two and to complain about it and to snitch to the world about my plastic exterior? WELCOME TO WORTHY Sometimes when we truly obey God we are falsely accused. When we truly obey God, we are always falsely accused.

I read this following article about 10 years ago, and it change my whole direction. I truly thought I was going in a certain direction which seemed right, at least that's what many teachings were saying. But I distinctly remember reading this one day (after several readings), when it just hit me. My prayers were very much, "Lord, what do You have for me, what do You want me to do, where do I fit, where is Your place for me, I want to serve You. Over the years, I thought I really was following Him and living unto Him. But then I saw; everything was for me, for what God could do for me and through me. It is not God for me, it is me for God. I was going my own way in God. God has a great purpose and a plan. I need to fit into His Plan and His Purpose and move with Him in the way He is going, then then I am walking in His will, and my life will be unto His Glory. And however he sees to carry that out in my life is up to Him, I am the clay, He is the Potter. As Madam Guyon once said "Abandonment is a matter of the greatest importance in our progress; Abandonment is the casting off all selfish care, that we may be altogether at the divine disposal." Method of Prayer It was a complete 180 deg. turn. I was attached to things, I was attached to works, and in some way, trying to earn my salvation. I had to cut off everything, and begin to find out what was Christ's, and what was man's. I remember one day sitting reading the Bible praying, I turned around to look at my book case (one of a couple), it was full of only (good??) Christian material, when I had the thought, "Man's teaching". Some of those books cost a lot, and I had them for a long time. But God was still doing His "removing of those things that are shaken . . . that those things that cannot be shaken may remain. Heb.12:27. The thing with being on "Higher Ground", is that there aren't as many people there, but that is the way of following Christ, "forsaking all". When Jesus says "he who does not forsake . . ." Those things mentioned, are indicative of things we hold very close to our hearts; "Mother, father, houses, land (even your own country) children, bretheren". It is the heart He wants, not things. If and when, according to His will, He wants to take those things from your life, can He? But this is in order to gain more of Him, and live on "higher ground" Christ Our Life by T. Austin-Sparks One of the main objects of the Holy Spirit is to get believers really identified with Christ as the risen and exalted Lord, and to make His risen life real in their experience. As the age moves toward its consummation - the manifestation of Christ - two features will become increasingly evident. On the one hand things, men, movements, institutions, organizations, etc., will predominate and draw multitudes after them, and will attach the crowds to themselves. On the other hand, with a growing disappointment and disillusionment over these, a minority will turn to the Lord Himself to find Him alone as their life. Three elements will inhere in all this. One is the unmistakable development of the principle of Anti-christ; that which will definitely supplant Christ, or intend to do so. The second is the alternative to the whole Christ in man-made Christianity, an imitation life born and carried on by its own momentum. The third, a deep and genuine quest for reality, truth, and inward knowledge of the Lord Himself. In the first case it will be naked worship of man in human power: a tremendous overflow of humanism, the wonder and glory of man. The third will be Christ altogether as the life. If the Christian is attached to some thing, such as a teaching, a tradition, an institution, a movement, or person, the end will certainly be a limitation of life and eventually confusion and disappointment, perhaps worse. The New Testament makes it unmistakably clear and emphatic that the destiny of all is to be "Christ all and in all." We must learn that a true work of the Spirit of God is to attach everything to Christ Himself. He, Christ, must be the life of our spirit, the "inner man," so that we are strong in the Lord: not in ourselves, nor in others, nor in things. We shall have to survive adversity by His strength within alone. Christ will have to be the life of our mind. Perplexity will find us without the power to explain and understand, but the Spirit will teach and lead. Christ will need to be life for our bodies. There is such a thing as Divine life for the physical body. Not always does the Lord choose to heal the body, but He does always want to be its life, even in suffering, to fulfill His purpose. It is the Lord Himself, and for this to be so, it often has to be against a background of natural inability. The power of His resurrection is the law of union with Christ from beginning to end. Days of terrific pressure are upon the Lord

Amen!

Shalom viajero, Looks like we have some things in common. Apart from your Israeli connections, you are about my age too. So welcome to Worthy Boards and welcome to Israel if/when you get here again. I've met someone in person from this board, who came for a short visit. It's a cool experience Blessings Shalom hupo, I will be back maybe next year, I live in South Sinai and am presently in South America

Shalom. I have been to Israel a number of times and have many good friends there.

Thank you Isiaha43:4. One action causes a reaction. As you say, "it depends on our walk with Christ". Let's first pluck the beam out of our own eye. I am a member of the Body of Christ, and where ever I am in this life, I am always hopeful that the Death and Life of Christ is being worked in me in preparation to become his Bride. I think I can understand something of Job when he says, 'Which doeth great things past finding out; Yea, and wonders without number. "Lo, He goeth by me and I see Him not: He passeth on also, but I perceive Him not. Behold, He taketh away, who can hinder Him? Who will say unto Him, 'What doest Thou?' . . . " Faith is believing without seeing, without understanding. Sometimes we need to say, "I don't know where I am going, but I know the One I am following". Give me some time to get back to you on the "going to church" question.

Just WHERE did I even IMPLY that?? In fact, as I recall, what I said was "church is an excellent place [to join with the community of Believers]" If you weren't implying a building, what were you implying? That's funny, because Axey seems to be in agreement with me. Well, if you are in agreement, then it must be true! I don't deny that, never have. That one I made up as an ILLUSTRATION (I never presented it as though it were an example straight out of the Bibles), through use of common sense. We are still allowed to use common sense. Sayings don't have much to do with common sense, but they do help support our argument even if it is incorrect, don't they? That is one of the many ways the Enemy attacks us, actually. I never said people in churches were perfect and that we would never be hurt by people...but IN GENERAL, fellow Believers can help us. I'm sorry you feel that way, but I also feel you put on an attacking tone as well with your initial post. I am sorry that's the way you feel too. Not if we have an idea of Good and Evil that is properly instructed by what the Bible has to say. The Bible is the Word of God, and is therefore entirely capable of showing us GOD's perspective of good and evil. We have the capacity to learn from that and to put it into action. Having a good "idea" sounds like it comes from the the Tree of Knowledge. Yes, the bible is the Word of God. Didn't Paul say, "the letter kills, but the spirit", and Jesus said, "you search the scriptures because you think that in them you have life, but you wont come to me". All these things may serve to bring to Him when we are babes, but there comes a time, read Heb.6:1-3; when we are to move on, and this w will do if God permit vs.3. If God is not permitting, then stay where you are until He takes you on.

Is the Christian community only in buildings? And I don't believe that was only what "axey" was saying. And there are many other good verses about having fellowship other than hat you quoted, and don't forget the part about "selling all you have". Where do you find all these sayings about armies etc? Yes, we do get attacked by the enemy, but also get attacked very much by those closest to us. And as I have stated my beliefs here, all I am receiving is attacks. "A good church" as opposed to a bad church, again, "the tree of the knowledge of good and evil", our idea of good and evil, differs from God's, of this I am sure. Goodbye

If you think that is what "church" is, you are missing the boat. You need to be concerned about the other's spiritual welfare. Seems like an ego thing to me to not fellowship. Iron sharpens iron, you know. If you aren't hanging your shield in the House, then what army are you in? Missing what boat?? What is it that I think "church" is? I think I stated more what it isn't! "If we walk in the light as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another", and truly, our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ. True fellowship comes from following Him, and is in Him. You are quoting out of context (iron sharpeneth iron). Do we need to be a member of some organization to be sharpened, and where is this about "hanging your shield in the house" coming from? We need a covering. We need shepherding. What do you think God is raising us up to be? Solitary sheep? No. Sheep belong in a fold. Even missionary sheep need a shepherd and fellow sheep to cover them. Solitaries get eaten alive by wolves. How did you get off on that line from what was said, "covering", "shepherding", "solitary". Everything you have said, where did you get it? Who said "solitaries" get eaten by lions? Who said I was solitary? Too much of the "teachings of man", and we no longer hear the voice of God, we interpret everything according to the teaching we receive. God wants us to grow up "till we all come in the unity of the faith, and the full knowledge of the Son of God . . . that we henceforth be no longer children tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight and cunning of man". If you continue o move off the track of this thread and look for an argument to validate your own doctrine, try someone else. The dew doesn't settle on a stormy night.

If you think that is what "church" is, you are missing the boat. You need to be concerned about the other's spiritual welfare. Seems like an ego thing to me to not fellowship. Iron sharpens iron, you know. If you aren't hanging your shield in the House, then what army are you in? Missing what boat?? What is it that I think "church" is? I think I stated more what it isn't! "If we walk in the light as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another", and truly, our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ. True fellowship comes from following Him, and is in Him. You are quoting out of context (iron sharpeneth iron). Do we need to be a member of some organization to be sharpened, and where is this about "hanging your shield in the house" coming from?

What is "church" isn't it the Body of Christ. I am member of the Body of Christ. I don't choose to be a member on Saturday, Sunday or some other day. I am in the Church wherever I am, I am in it by faith. And I thank God for the way in which He has led me through the "wilderness", so that I am not dependent on christain social clubs, nice singing, endless tea and biscuits, or the need to uplift certain people as being much more than myself before God. Like Seekeroftruth, I have lived in the Middle East, and have found that if you are standing on anything other than Christ Himself (i.e. organizations, good times, friends etc), then when the difficulties come, watch out! If God sees in your life for a "removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain", then trust Him, that He is bringing you to Himself, apart from all the superficiality that is in Christendom today. Do I "go to church?" No, I am in His church endeavouring to be where He would have me to be for His Glory. Not my own, or anyone else's.

Its not so much what you believe, as what is the Holy Spirit saying. "The letter kills, but the Spirit gives life 2Cor.3:6. Look to your spirit in this matter, do you have a sense of life or death. If you look to what you believe, you could be mistaken. This is where growth is needed, in Hebrews 5:13-14; we are told about "milk" and "strong meat". Strong meat is for those who have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil. Knowing what to do in these situations comes from discerning by the Spirit whether an action is right or wrong (good and evil) by the Lord, and not by our particular belief of a scripture. But certainly, we must have the Word as our guide, for it is a lamp to our feet and a light to our path. In prayer, turn to your spirit and and say, "I choose Your will in this", and trust God for the outcome. Let's not go to the "tree of the knowledge of good and evil". Remember, you have the knowledge of good and evil on the same tree, and they both lead to death. Go to the Tree of Life, Christ. I'm confused if I go to court and have to swear by the Book ....but I remember what Jesus said Matthew 5:33-37 (New International Version) Oaths 33"Again, you have heard that it was said to the people long ago, 'Do not break your oath, but keep the oaths you have made to the Lord.' 34But I tell you, Do not swear at all: either by heaven, for it is God's throne; 35or by the earth, for it is his footstool; or by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the Great King. 36And do not swear by your head, for you cannot make even one hair white or black. 37Simply let your 'Yes' be 'Yes,' and your 'No,' 'No'; anything beyond this comes from the evil one. So what to do? Paul also taked about listening to our authorities??????????????????????????? all that is left is to stand 4 what i believe in

God gave life on earth for us to enjoy, I think many of us forget that, and throw the baby out with the bathwater. There have been many things in this life I have not participated in (or listened to) being too religious and forgetting that God gave these things for our enjoyment of life.