givennewname

To continue to believe yr intrepretation, you have to intreprete Isaiah and Jeremiah allegorically, ignore the fact that Babylon in Iraq is not destryed through battle by a Mede, but by a peaceful depopulation through the Greek Sellucid empire Saddam Hussien has rebuilt parts of Babylon so as to render parts of Isaiah 13 and Jeremiah obsolete, if indeed the prophecies have been fulfiled in the attack by Cyrus. Babylon is alive and well in Rev 17 and Rev 18. Yes Babylon is destroyed... only in Rev 18.. go read it..in Rev 18.

There is no basis for this statement other than wild speculation. Where is the connection, given that Revelation was written roughly 800 years after Isaiah? You assume a linkage between the two where none exists. Again, you read into Isaiah 13:19 something that you want to see,i.e.,eisogesis. The verse does not say that Babylon would be destroyed in the same manner as Sodom and Gomorrah; it says that Babylon will be like Sodom and Gomorrah after its destruction: 19.And Babylon, the glory of kingdoms, the splendor and pride of the Chaldeans, will be like Sodom and Gomorrah when God overthrew them. The fact remains: Babylon is destroyed, just as God said it would be. Babylon, the glory of kingdoms, the splendor and pride of the Chaldeans, will be like Sodom and Gomorrah when God overthrew them It says what the Bible says- I don't find any trace of Sodom and Gomorrah.. If you go to Iraq Rufus, Babylon is in ruins and rebuilt.. Palaces, Ishtar gates.. ect.. I don't find rebuilt Sodom and Gomorrah. I don't even find ruins of Sodom and Gommorah. How much plainer do you want God to make the Bible? ""Will be like"" means it bears some resemblence. Babylon in Iraq is not in any way resembling Sodom unless i have a vision problem. I never mention Babylon will be destroyed in the same manner, that is yr own opinion. If i remember correctly, Sodom in the book of Genesis was destroyed by hail fire and fire from heaven. I just speculated and it is my own speculation that the total destruction of Babylon in Rev 18 will be nuclear as the destruction could be seen miles away, aka a mushroom cloud. What is certain is that as prophesised in Isaiah, this Babylon will be destryed a in battle senario and not through a gradual depopulation process as that which happened to th Babylon in Iraq.

This is called argumentum ad populum, "appeal to the people." Trouble is, you're not supposed to be popular, you're supposed to be right. Babylon is destroyed and God said it will not be inhabited again. Do you believe that or not? Yes, there have been attempts to rebuild/repopulate it; but they have not been and will not be successfull. Assume for a minute that God really means what He says. Given that John is writing in a mix of prophetic, apocolyptic and epistlatory styles, that means that John is using Babylon in Revelation as a metaphor for something else. It is a word picture. Babylon is destroyed many times and yet it has not been destroyed to the degree prophesied by Isaiah and Jeremiah and each time it has been rebuilt. Babylon was first build by Nimrod.. it was destroyed. Then the Tower of Babel was built it was destroyed and the city rebuilt. Let us look at the prophesies by Isaiah and Jeremiah and see if the destruction of Babylon by Sennacherib or Cyrus fits what is prophesied by Isaiah or Jeremiah. 1) Babylon consists of 2 parts, the religious system of false worship introduced by Nimrod and his wife has spread worldwide (Represented by the Woman who drank the Martyr blood) called Mystery Babylon : Rev 17:5 and upon her forehead a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF THE HARLOTS AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH. . There is then the political and economic Babylon ( the merchants who lament the destruction of Babylon). Rev 18:2 And he cried with a mighty voice, saying, Fallen, fallen is Babylon the great, and is become a habitation of demons, and a hold of every unclean spirit, and a hold of every unclean and hateful bird. 2) Babylon the city in Iraq exist right up to the time of the Roman empire. Sennacherib may may destroyed the city, it was rebuilt. Just because it was rebuilt does it means the prophesy was void? BTW the prophecies of Isaiah was not even written so how could it be void? 3) Cyrus the Persian captured the city of Babylon by means of deception. He entered the city without any fighting and captured the city not by superior warfare but by diverting the Euphrates River. Yet the Prophecies of Isaiah and Jeremiah prophesied great cruel war and bloodshed. Isa 13:13 Therefore I will make the heavens to tremble, and the earth shall be shaken out of its place, in the wrath of Jehovah of hosts, and in the day of his fierce anger. Isa 13:14 And it shall come to pass, that as the chased roe, and as sheep that no man gathereth, they shall turn every man to his own people, and shall flee every man to his own land. Isa 13:15 Every one that is found shall be thrust through; and every one that is taken shall fall by the sword. It says everyone in Babylon shall be killed in the invasion... None of this is true in Cyrus's invasion of Babylon which was relatively blood free. 4) Babylon survives intact after the Cyrus attack and survives right up to Roman times... in fact the Emperor Vespasian conquered it. Julian the Apostate even destroyed the Walls. See the website of kings that ruled even by to the Byzantine empire. http://www.angelfire.com/tx/tintirbabylon/persian.html. Babylon was destroyed through depopulation when the capital city of the Seleucid empire shifts from Babylon to a new city, thereafter the city loses prominence..through depopulation and not through war. It did not die through violent means... not till after Rev 18. Why are you so surprised that there is reconstruction of Babylon by Saddam Hussein. Who is Saddam Hussein to defy God? The answer is that the Destruction of Babylon as prophesied by Isaiah and Jeremiah is the same destruction of Babylon recorded in Rev 18 and it has not happened yet. Yet Babylon is destroyed, even though you may not want it to be. I never said nor denied that Babylon is destroyed. Just say that it is not destroyed to the degree or in the manner described and prophesied by Isaiah and Jeremiah. When God says it is destroyed like Sodom and Gomorrah and it will not be rebuilt it means to the level seen in Rev 18, where the fire is seen by sailors and destruction is total. In Sodom and Gomorrah, not a trace of the city habitation can even be found. Ruins of Babylon have been excavated.. Buildings by Saddam surely do not fit with the prophesy. Neither does the manner of destruction of Babylon does not fit... the fall of Babylon is gradual, not instantaneous nor it is by war as prophesied. I would not be surprised if the fall of Babylon as prophesied to be like Sodom and Gomorrah will be a nuclear strike.. I dunno, we wait and see.

We can be sure of eternal life if we trust in Jesus to get us there. If we rely on Good works, then i cannot be sure.

This is called argumentum ad populum, "appeal to the people." Trouble is, you're not supposed to be popular, you're supposed to be right. Babylon is destroyed and God said it will not be inhabited again. Do you believe that or not? Yes, there have been attempts to rebuild/repopulate it; but they have not been and will not be successfull. Assume for a minute that God really means what He says. Given that John is writing in a mix of prophetic, apocolyptic and epistlatory styles, that means that John is using Babylon in Revelation as a metaphor for something else. It is a word picture. Babylon is destroyed many times and yet it has not been destroyed to the degree prophesied by Isaiah and Jeremiah and each time it has been rebuilt. Babylon was first build by Nimrod.. it was destroyed. Then the Tower of Babel was built it was destroyed and the city rebuilt. Let us look at the prophesies by Isaiah and Jeremiah and see if the destruction of Babylon by Sennacherib or Cyrus fits what is prophesied by Isaiah or Jeremiah. 1) Babylon consists of 2 parts, the religious system of false worship introduced by Nimrod and his wife has spread worldwide (Represented by the Woman who drank the Martyr blood) called Mystery Babylon : Rev 17:5 and upon her forehead a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF THE HARLOTS AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH. . There is then the political and economic Babylon ( the merchants who lament the destruction of Babylon). Rev 18:2 And he cried with a mighty voice, saying, Fallen, fallen is Babylon the great, and is become a habitation of demons, and a hold of every unclean spirit, and a hold of every unclean and hateful bird. 2) Babylon the city in Iraq exist right up to the time of the Roman empire. Sennacherib may may destroyed the city, it was rebuilt. Just because it was rebuilt does it means the prophesy was void? BTW the prophecies of Isaiah was not even written so how could it be void? 3) Cyrus the Persian captured the city of Babylon by means of deception. He entered the city without any fighting and captured the city not by superior warfare but by diverting the Euphrates River. Yet the Prophecies of Isaiah and Jeremiah prophesied great cruel war and bloodshed. Isa 13:13 Therefore I will make the heavens to tremble, and the earth shall be shaken out of its place, in the wrath of Jehovah of hosts, and in the day of his fierce anger. Isa 13:14 And it shall come to pass, that as the chased roe, and as sheep that no man gathereth, they shall turn every man to his own people, and shall flee every man to his own land. Isa 13:15 Every one that is found shall be thrust through; and every one that is taken shall fall by the sword. It says everyone in Babylon shall be killed in the invasion... None of this is true in Cyrus's invasion of Babylon which was relatively blood free. 4) Babylon survives intact after the Cyrus attack and survives right up to Roman times... in fact the Emperor Vespasian conquered it. Julian the Apostate even destroyed the Walls. See the website of kings that ruled even by to the Byzantine empire. http://www.angelfire.com/tx/tintirbabylon/persian.html. Babylon was destroyed through depopulation when the capital city of the Seleucid empire shifts from Babylon to a new city, thereafter the city loses prominence..through depopulation and not through war. It did not die through violent means... not till after Rev 18. Why are you so surprised that there is reconstruction of Babylon by Saddam Hussein. Who is Saddam Hussein to defy God? The answer is that the Destruction of Babylon as prophesied by Isaiah and Jeremiah is the same destruction of Babylon recorded in Rev 18 and it has not happened yet.

I am not sure if Hell would be a sufficient deterrent for suicide as often the person involved is not int the frame of mind to think straight. Anyway the person who is considering suicide is not the person being consoled here, rather it is the person who is the family who is grieving at the moment so whether hell is a deterrence is not the issue at the moment. Now in the case of OSAS issue, this is what I do think at the moment. Justification by faith alone involves the process of a person's legal standing before God. It involves a process where a person is adopted as a son of God. Sanctification is a process performed by the Holy Spirit is a process where the person gets to be more and more like Jesus and does not complete until we are dead. A person who is justified do not lose his legal standing every time he sins. I remember a friend of mine who has been water baptised 7 times because he thinks he has lost his salvation every time he backslides. A person may lose the close fellowship when ever he sins but he does not lose his adoption as a son of God every time he sins. I take an earthly example in that a father may be angry whenever his son does something wrong, may even kick in out of the house but his birth certificate still testify that the person is still his son and that his mother still gave birth to him does not change. While it is true that in a case of suicide, the person cannot confess his sin, but that is not a prerequisite for forgiveness of sins. The blood of Jesus is. I do not confess each and every sin or i may not even be conscious of every sin i have performed but i know that the blood of Jesus covers each and every unconfessed sin. Suicide is not a mortal sin as the Roman Catholic church believes. Every sin can be fogiven, and only one particular sin can remain unforgiven accroding to Jesus, suicide is not the sin mentioned.

Correction: the fulfillment of the prophesies of Isaiah and Jeremiah do not conform to your idea of how things ought to have played out. Nevertheless, the cities called Babylon were destroyed along with the political entities that resided in them. God gave the prophecy;the details of how He chooses to fulfill it is up to Him. The question to ask of each text, especially each prophetic oracle, is "What is the point of this passage?" Be aware, too, that the prophets spoke and wrote poetically. Not to read them that way is dangerously naive and foolish. The prophets wrote mostly in three different types of oracle - the woe, the lawsuit and the promise. Isaiah 13 is an example of the "Woe" style. *edited for redundancy Wehn Jesus says that the word of God will last forever and that not an iota nor a jot will be changed, and all of it will be fullfilled-literally. Changing the word "Mede" to Persian or Assyrian and allowing just a few of Saddam's constructed palaces to defy the written words of prophesy to fit your interpretation of fulfilled prophesy in the name of poetic licence is still changing scipture to fit yr prophetic interpretation. Anyways Babylon is still spoken of in Revelation, which means whatever version of Babylon that you care to call it still exist until end times. It means that Babylon will be rebuilt and destroyed again as said in the Book of Revelation. No matter how long we have to wait for the Word of God to come to pass, God says to wait for the appointed time of prophesy as said in the book of Habbakuk. The point is that the Godless city of Babylon who relects the Godless political system of the word, the false system of worship of idols and the pride of human acheivement and the political word of empire expansion through violence will surely not escape the judgement of God and will be destroyed by God himself. Whether it is prophesied by Isaiah, Jeremiah or John who wrote Revelations. So far i still see the political system of false worship of false Gods and worldly gods still with us. So how could Babylon be already destroyed? If it is, another so called babylon will still be rebuilt. Rant and rave all you want to, the fact remains that Babylon is destroyed and being wilfully blind to the facts doesn't change that. God fulfills prophecy in a time and manner of His own choosing, not yours. You are making the same mistake the Jews did when they started looking for the Messiah. He didn't come in the manner they expected Him to, so they rejected Him. In effect, you're calling God a liar. Rufus, nobody believes what you have written and have convinced no one with the evidence so far presented. IN fact many facts and evidence given would not uphold a case in a secular court. Dates are wrong, persons and circumstances and degree of destruction are all wrong.. Babylon is yet mentioned in Revelations alive and well. Not ranting and raving and neither am i asking God to fulfill prophecy according to my expectation. Just taking God at his word literally and not changing scriptures. Jesus may not have come the way they have expected but he came and fulfilled scriptures in Isaiah literally. So why should the scriptures be interpreted in a different fashion as regards to prophecy regarding Babylon? In what way am i calling God a Liar?? I am taking Go'd's spoken word at face value and expecting God to do what he has said. Jesus says not a dot nor an iota will be changed... I take Jesus at face value and expect that scriptures will be fulfilled that way. I do not twist history nor the events of Babylon to fit scriptures

Most people assume that once jsutified, the Christians should be moral and do good works once they are saved. Isn't it that Paul says that Abraham is justified by his faith in God and not by his Good works? Habbakuk says: Hab 2:4 Behold, his soul is puffed up, it is not upright in him; but the righteous shall live by his faith. Good works comes by faith.. not the other way around. Salvation comes by faith and not works... not by good work and neither can one lose his salvation by bad works.

Either Christianiaty preaches a works free salvation or i am reading the wrong Bible.

i think in non of the scriptures that are quoted here demonstrates that a person can lose his salvation... In hebrews, the writer says that if a man turns his back to the the faith after a genuine conversion and then comes back, it would be like trying to crucify Jesus twice, which in theory is an impossible task.. therefore losing yr salvation is..... impossible. That verse does not deal with the lost of salvation. it deals with church discipline. Paul says what the person did is so hidoeus that he is to be excluded from fleoowship and he is to be turned over to Satan to cause the destruction of his flesh... to cause him even to die as a judgement for his sin...That has nothing to do with the status of his salvation-he did not lose his salvation. Many verses here deals with the back slidden christians who did many deplorable things, and must be punished here or in the hereafter, but backslidden does not mean he is not saved, or that his salvation is in question.

A while ago I read that the majority of teen suicides were kids who claim CHRIST. If you are a kid who is being beat down by lust and sin and peers and all of the conflicts that come from trying to deserve JESUS, it can cause a geat depression. One of the many problems with teaching bondage instead of freedom. That is my whole point of asking the question. If a person who believes in Jesus, confesses him and then believe in Jesus, then does something stupid, does he loses his salvation? Well in a way i look at salvation as God's work and not one by men, otherwise Christianity is just another religion where Men tries very hard to get himself reconciled to God. Christianity is different where God comes and says men are evil, if you wanna get to God, Go through the acceptance of his son. No works involved. Now many theologians have tried to explain Christianity as justification based on the completed works of Christ on the cross but in practice they add in in some good works in small acceptable measures, just in case... This works theology is introduced subtly by saying once you get saved, show us the money or the evidence of this conversion by doing good works. This is jst introducing a works theology by the back door. I mean was the repentent thieve on the cross asked to demonstrate the evidence of his salvation by good works? Was he the only exception to the case where evidence needs to be produced of conversion? So the Kingdom of God is (Faith) + (a small measures of works)(evidence of acceptance of Jesus)-the sin of suicide??? The Bible doesn't say that... It says nothing can seperate us from the Love of God- it mentions specifically death... and it says that our good works are like filthy rags to God. It is very strange in that this is the man who actually taught me that the only way to God is through faith in the Lord Jesus Christ and yet now he excludes his son's surety of salvation in Jesus by the fact that his son did a silly thing. The question we ask is not if a man can lose his salvation, it is whether Jesus can lose a believer... the answer is obvious ad given by Jesus alone.. Joh 17:9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for those whom thou hast given me; for they are thine: Joh 17:10 and all things that are mine are thine, and thine are mine: and I am glorified in them. Joh 17:11 And I am no more in the world, and these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep them in thy name which thou hast given me, that they may be one, even as we are. Joh 17:12 While I was with them, I kept them in thy name which thou hast given me: and I guarded them, and not one of them perished, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled. Now i have a very simple believe in salvation. Let us look at a few verses on salvation starting with this famous verse Joh 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up; Joh 3:15 that whosoever believeth may in him have eternal life. Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have eternal life. Joh 3:17 For God sent not the Son into the world to judge the world; but that the world should be saved through him. Now it says that whosoever believe in Jesus has already eternal life. It begs now the question, When does this sternal life begin? The answer is that the moment a person believes, eternal life starts for him. Eternal life means eternal life, it does not say one can lose eternal life, if it can be lost, it should be called semi eternal or conditional eternal life. etenal life does not start when we aare dead, it starts when we become a christian and with that a security that Jesus will take care of a believer, even if he commits an atrocious act. It does not mean we get our life in order once we become a christian and in my walk of nearly 20 years i mess up. Since every sin is an abomination to God and non more or less serious than another, why should this brother lose his salvation? Seet.

Correction: the fulfillment of the prophesies of Isaiah and Jeremiah do not conform to your idea of how things ought to have played out. Nevertheless, the cities called Babylon were destroyed along with the political entities that resided in them. God gave the prophecy;the details of how He chooses to fulfill it is up to Him. The question to ask of each text, especially each prophetic oracle, is "What is the point of this passage?" Be aware, too, that the prophets spoke and wrote poetically. Not to read them that way is dangerously naive and foolish. The prophets wrote mostly in three different types of oracle - the woe, the lawsuit and the promise. Isaiah 13 is an example of the "Woe" style. *edited for redundancy Wehn Jesus says that the word of God will last forever and that not an iota nor a jot will be changed, and all of it will be fullfilled-literally. Changing the word "Mede" to Persian or Assyrian and allowing just a few of Saddam's constructed palaces to defy the written words of prophesy to fit your interpretation of fulfilled prophesy in the name of poetic licence is still changing scipture to fit yr prophetic interpretation. Anyways Babylon is still spoken of in Revelation, which means whatever version of Babylon that you care to call it still exist until end times. It means that Babylon will be rebuilt and destroyed again as said in the Book of Revelation. No matter how long we have to wait for the Word of God to come to pass, God says to wait for the appointed time of prophesy as said in the book of Habbakuk. The point is that the Godless city of Babylon who relects the Godless political system of the word, the false system of worship of idols and the pride of human acheivement and the political word of empire expansion through violence will surely not escape the judgement of God and will be destroyed by God himself. Whether it is prophesied by Isaiah, Jeremiah or John who wrote Revelations. So far i still see the political system of false worship of false Gods and worldly gods still with us. So how could Babylon be already destroyed? If it is, another so called babylon will still be rebuilt.

I am a believer of once Saved always Saved but there are others who do not hold this view. Would you stake another person's life on that belief? I am not on this thread for a debate - man, only God knows the pure motive of someones heart. For all intents and purposes, someone may look to me as if they are Saved, you know - say the right things, act the right way - but behind closed doors they are doing the most vile things...in their minds the worst actrocities..so only God knows for sure where a mans allegiance lies. What SHOULD be a good indicator of a Believer is CONSISTENT fruit - whether it is in public or in private. I am confident in MY Salvation and I trust the Lord that He lives in me and will never leave me. Sorry i wasn't debating or being rude.. Sorry if i came across like that. Just making the point that a christian is far from perfect after salvation and capable of many silly things like this young man

I am a believer of once Saved always Saved but there are others who do not hold this view. For those who continue to be in willing rebellion AFTER Salvation - makes one wonder if they were truly saved in the first place. By their fruits you shall know them. God will give a person over to their rebellion if that person continues to reject Him over and over - 1 John 1v 6: If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. NKJ if we look at the men that God chooses, be it Abraham, David ect, they were doing bad things before God considered them righteous, they were doing bad things after God considered them righteous. Look at Abraham. God promises Abraham the Pomised land, and a son. Abraham believes.. God considered him righteous... then Abraham tries to help God by sleeping with Hagar (not even he is in unbelief but when he is justified)... We do not stop being silly after we get saved... we still continue to be silly way after we get saved... and that may include killing yourself.

True, Saddam Hussein claimed to be rebuilding Babylon and restoring it to its former glory and yes, there has been some construction done in that area. However, God said, through the prophets Isaiah and Jeremiah that it would never be re-inhabited. The question for you and I then becomes, who are you going to believe? Almighty God or an insane despot who is now dead? The reconstruction project is not a fulfillment of prophecy, it is an act of defiance. How far along the project gets and how it is going to play out remains for us to see; God already knows. Read the words, Babylon has never been destoyed. Not to the extent written by Isaiah nor Jeremiah. Sennacherib is an Assyrian not a Mede as written by Isaiah. The original city of Babylon was destroyed by Sennacherib in 689 BC after the revolt of Mushezib-Marduk. Nebuchednezzar built his city of Babylon in 605 BC.The second city fell to the Medo-Persian king Cyrus in 539 BC and flourished briefly but by 275 BC the city had been abandoned and was in ruins. It has never been rebuilt, QED. Those are statements of verifiable fact. God said through his prophets that Babylon would be destroyed and would remain uninhabited. Such has been the case. Part of the confusion may lie in the fact that the prophets often spoke in poetic verbiage yet those of a charismatic/pentecostal bent insist on reading everything literally. Think of it as trying to read song lyrics the same way as a legal document, without ever hearing the music. It doesn't work and the resulting misunderstanding may just be misleading. The question to ask of the text at this juncture is, "What is the point?" Dear Brother, Non of what is quoted above fits the prophesy of Isaiah nor Jeramiah. The original city of Babylon was destroyed by Sennacherib in 689 BC after the revolt of Mushezib-Marduk. Nebuchednezzar built his city of Babylon in 605 BC.The second city fell to the Medo-Persian king Cyrus in 539 BC..... Isa 13:16 Their infants also shall be dashed in pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be rifled, and their wives ravished. Isa 13:17 Behold, I will stir up the Medes against them, who shall not regard silver, and as for gold, they shall not delight in it. Isa 13:18 And their bows shall dash the young men in pieces; and they shall have no pity on the fruit of the womb; their eye shall not spare children. Isa 13:19 And Babylon, the glory of kingdoms, the beauty of the Chaldeans' pride, shall be as when God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah. Isa 13:20 It shall never be inhabited, neither shall it be dwelt in from generation to generation: neither shall the Arabian pitch tent there; neither shall shepherds make their flocks to lie down there. 1) Neither Sennacherib nor Cyrus did what Isaiah prophesied. Sennacherib is not a Mede neither is Cyrus (Persian). Any way if Nebuchadnessar rebuilt the city, then Sennacherib's destruction of the city does not fit the prophesy as the prophecy says that the city shall be desolate for generations. 2) We don't see Babylon left as Sodom and Gomorrah which is completely decimated after God Judges it. Can't even find any traces of Sodom and Gomorrah after the Judgement. God says Babylon will be like that. Babylon contined to thrive after the attack of Sennachrib and Cyrus, in fact Babylon thrived after the Persian attack. 3) God says that Babylon will not be rebuilt. Wne he says it, no man not even Saddam Hussein can nullify that prophesy. Who is Saddam Hussien to defy God? Don't try to fit prophesy to your preconcieved ideas. If yr interpretation of the above prophesy is met by Sennacherib or Cyrus's invasion, then God's Prophecy is no better in accuracy than false prediction by Nostradamus or other false prophecy. Abandon that interpretation because Babylon exist right up to end timesand yr interpretation is full of holes.

i think the question that i am asking is the assurance of salvation. I have always believe that God is the author and the surety of salvation and it does not depend on what the person does. Isn't Christ sacrifice good for the past, present and future

I have a friend whose son just comitted suicide. He is a devoted Christian and is so depressed and believes that because his son commited suicide that he is lost. I do not necessary believe that in that i think suicide is like any other sins committed by christians and that there is no sin that cannot be covered by the Blood of Jesus. Man i don't even know how to comfort this Christian father.

True, Saddam Hussein claimed to be rebuilding Babylon and restoring it to its former glory and yes, there has been some construction done in that area. However, God said, through the prophets Isaiah and Jeremiah that it would never be re-inhabited. The question for you and I then becomes, who are you going to believe? Almighty God or an insane despot who is now dead? The reconstruction project is not a fulfillment of prophecy, it is an act of defiance. How far along the project gets and how it is going to play out remains for us to see; God already knows. Read the words, Babylon has never been destoyed. Not to the extent written by Isaiah nor Jeremiah. Sennacherib is an Assyrian not a Mede as written by Isaiah.

More to the point, it means King N.'s Babylon doesn't play a role in biblical prophecy at all. See what happens when you make an assumption? An entire doctrine built on faulty data because someone forgot to check their facts. So, you are the only one in the world that caught this "forgetting to check their facts?" An "entire" doctrine, huh? Is this a new doctrine? Or has it been around for quite a while and only you have it correctly? Not at all; I wouldn't presume. So.....who else espouses what you are? Your "doctrine?" You seem to be isolated in your belief. Actually, I had to research it. The facts are out there for anyone who cares to look. I suggest you do so. Yet there are a multitude of Biblical scholars who have never found what you are presenting. How come you are the only one to whom the Holy Spirit has revealed this "doctrine." Or do you belong to a congregation who believe as you do? I agree man. If there are documented evidence please quote it... Start with the Taylor prism, an artifact which describes Sennacheribs' account of the conquest of Babylon as well as the dating of the conquest. You can find the image and translation online. Continue w/Wolfram von Soden's "The Ancient Orient: An Introduction to the Study of the Ancient Near East." Check also the account of Herodotus, volume 2, section 141, which gives the account of the battle with Judah. That battle took place at the end of the campaign which started with the destruction of Babylon. Sennacherib overran forty-six citie s of Judah. The account in 2 Kings 18-19 only details the final attack on Jerusalem. read the translation of the prism here: http://www.kchanson.com/ANCDOCS/meso/sennprism1.html

More to the point, it means King N.'s Babylon doesn't play a role in biblical prophecy at all. See what happens when you make an assumption? An entire doctrine built on faulty data because someone forgot to check their facts. So, you are the only one in the world that caught this "forgetting to check their facts?" An "entire" doctrine, huh? Is this a new doctrine? Or has it been around for quite a while and only you have it correctly? Not at all; I wouldn't presume. So.....who else espouses what you are? Your "doctrine?" You seem to be isolated in your belief. Actually, I had to research it. The facts are out there for anyone who cares to look. I suggest you do so. Yet there are a multitude of Biblical scholars who have never found what you are presenting. How come you are the only one to whom the Holy Spirit has revealed this "doctrine." Or do you belong to a congregation who believe as you do? I agree man. If there are documented evidence please quote it... Start with the Taylor prism, an artifact which describes Sennacheribs' account of the conquest of Babylon as well as the dating of the conquest. You can find the image and translation online. Continue w/Wolfram von Soden's "The Ancient Orient: An Introduction to the Study of the Ancient Near East." Check also the account of Herodotus, volume 2, section 141, which gives the account of the battle with Judah. That battle took place at the end of the campaign which started with the destruction of Babylon. Sennacherib overran forty-six citie s of Judah. The account in 2 Kings 18-19 only details the final attack on Jerusalem. Suggest you read again the translation of the Taylor Prism which BTW is a boastful account of Sennacherib on his military exploits. He records of a victory in a battle again Merodach Baladan the King of Babylon. No where did he boast that the city of babylon was leveled and desserted. We see in thse verses that the King who is supposed to have been defeated still alive and well. Isa 39:1 At that time Merodach-baladan the son of Baladan, king of Babylon, sent letters and a present to Hezekiah; for he heard that he had been sick, and was recovered. Isa 39:2 And Hezekiah was glad of them, and showed them the house of his precious things, the silver, and the gold, and the spices, and the precious oil, and all the house of his armor, and all that was found in his treasures: there was nothing in his house, nor in all his dominion, that Hezekiah showed them not. Isa 39:3 Then came Isaiah the prophet unto king Hezekiah, and said unto him, What said these men? and from whence came they unto thee? And Hezekiah said, They are come from a far country unto me, even from Babylon. Isa 39:4 Then said he, What have they seen in thy house? And Hezekiah answered, All that is in my house have they seen: there is nothing among my treasures that I have not showed them. Isa 39:5 Then said Isaiah to Hezekiah, Hear the word of Jehovah of hosts: Isa 39:6 Behold, the days are coming, when all that is in thy house, and that which thy fathers have laid up in store until this day, shall be carried to Babylon: nothing shall be left, saith Jehovah. Isa 39:7 And of thy sons that shall issue from thee, whom thou shalt beget, shall they take away; and they shall be eunuchs in the palace of the king of Babylon. Isa 39:8 Then said Hezekiah unto Isaiah, Good is the word of Jehovah which thou hast spoken. He said moreover, For there shall be peace and truth in my days. We do not disagree that babylon had sucessive dynasties that were involved in wars but these do not fit the destruction of Babylon as predicted in Isaiah and Jeremiah by any stretch of the imagination.

More to the point, it means King N.'s Babylon doesn't play a role in biblical prophecy at all. See what happens when you make an assumption? An entire doctrine built on faulty data because someone forgot to check their facts. So, you are the only one in the world that caught this "forgetting to check their facts?" An "entire" doctrine, huh? Is this a new doctrine? Or has it been around for quite a while and only you have it correctly? Not at all; I wouldn't presume. So.....who else espouses what you are? Your "doctrine?" You seem to be isolated in your belief. Actually, I had to research it. The facts are out there for anyone who cares to look. I suggest you do so. Yet there are a multitude of Biblical scholars who have never found what you are presenting. How come you are the only one to whom the Holy Spirit has revealed this "doctrine." Or do you belong to a congregation who believe as you do? I agree man. If there are documented evidence please quote it...

More to the point, it means King N.'s Babylon doesn't play a role in biblical prophecy at all. See what happens when you make an assumption? An entire doctrine built on faulty data because someone forgot to check their facts. Why would God Give a prophecy about a Babylon that had already been destroyed before Isaiah and Jeremiah. Isaiah and Jeremiah are prophets, not historians. Isaiah lived from 758-698 BC. Babylon was destroyed in 689 BC. Nebuchednezzar was born in 630 BC and came to power in 605 BC. Those are statements of fact. How do you figure Babylon had been destroyed before Isaiah and Jeremiah? i gotta admit, this makes things a LOT less complicated. Hallelujah Man, where was it rded that Babylon was destroyed in 689 by Sennacherib? It is recorded that Sennacherrib was defeated in Judah and went home and was assasinated by hs son. How can Babylon be destryed to the level described by Isaiah and Jeremiah when it is stated in the Bible that king Hezekiah was ill and the Babylonian envoys visited him and was recieved warmly by Hezekiah and they were shown all Judah's riches.... Isaiah rebuked Hezekiah for his action?

More to the point, it means King N.'s Babylon doesn't play a role in biblical prophecy at all. See what happens when you make an assumption? An entire doctrine built on faulty data because someone forgot to check their facts. Why would God Give a prophecy about a Babylon that had already been destroyed before Isaiah and Jeremiah. Isaiah and Jeremiah are prophets, not historians.

Not all of the decendants of Seth were good. To give an example, the desendants of Seth would include thefather of Abraham Terah who were idol worshipers...

Don't think there will be a ceasefire this time.