LuftWaffle Posted November 23, 2011 Group: Senior Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 820 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 261 Days Won: 7 Joined: 01/09/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted November 23, 2011 I answered my own question, did a search on Google for "submit to truth" and it is very much "faith speak". No, submit means "yield" or "obey" or "abiding by." Have you not heard of "submitting to the rules"? Submitting to rules yes, submitting to the truth, no. Submittingt to truth means, as Nebula pointed out, yielding to that truth. It means having the integrity to admit that something is. It is not "faith-speak." that assertion is nonsense. It means that when we are faced with something being true. We stop trying to assert other things that are not true. If some drug or treatment is found to cure cancer, would we continue to just treat the symptoms, or would we use the cure? When faced with the truth, you have two options: Either yield your pride to the truth, or continue down a path that you know will not lead to the truth. I have seen on this board that there are people who reject the truth and would in fact, rather be wrong and continue making absurd arguments because they cannot bring themselves to admit that their assertions have been wrong. They continue in futility trying to defend the indefensible, even though they and everyone else knows they lost the argument a long time ago. They cannot bring themselvs to submit to the truth. Spot on. Submit to truth simply means applying that knowledge to your life. Here's a statement that's generally true: You have to work if you want to eat You accept it by believing that it's true, and you submit to it by going to work. Another example: Molten lava is really hot. You accept it by believing that it's the case, and you submit to that knowledge by not swimming in it. Another example: Jesus is Lord You accept it by believing that it's true, and you submit to it by figuring out and doing what He wants Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuftWaffle Posted November 23, 2011 Group: Senior Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 820 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 261 Days Won: 7 Joined: 01/09/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted November 23, 2011 I'm curious, where do you learn all these rules that only you seem to know about? That would be "Whose line is it anyway?" Where everything's made up and the points don't matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UndecidedFrog Posted November 23, 2011 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 2 Topic Count: 16 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 2,063 Content Per Day: 0.29 Reputation: 15 Days Won: 1 Joined: 08/02/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted November 23, 2011 So it's your assertion that in a debate an assertion doesn't require a response? It may depend on what Stargaze considers this, a debate or a discussion. I have not asserted anything of the kind. I merely made the observation that Stargaze may have interpreted his question(s) as assertion(s) that did not require a response. I'm curious, where do you learn all these rules that only you seem to know about? To what rules are you referring? Regards, UndecidedFrog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 To what rules are you referring? Regards, UndecidedFrog The rules you always tend make up whenever you need to manipulate the English language after your points have been successfully refuted and you cannot muster up the courage, integrity or the manhood to admit your mistakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaiah 6:8 Posted November 23, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 426 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 3,633 Content Per Day: 0.58 Reputation: 222 Days Won: 13 Joined: 03/23/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/26/1978 Share Posted November 23, 2011 I answered my own question, did a search on Google for "submit to truth" and it is very much "faith speak". Are you going to answer my questions? Hi Isaiah, It may be that Stargaze is interpreting your question as a rhetorical one, or even an assertion, neither of which require an answer. Regards, UndecidedFrog actually that was not my question, I forgot to clear the quote tags. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaiah 6:8 Posted November 23, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 426 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 3,633 Content Per Day: 0.58 Reputation: 222 Days Won: 13 Joined: 03/23/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/26/1978 Share Posted November 23, 2011 This would be the question I am bringing you back to, that has remained unanswered. I don't try to disprove God, there's nothing to disprove. Then why are you here debating about the existence of god? If there was nothing to disprove, why go to a christian website and purposely try to debate the validity off a belief in God? It is my personal opinion that belief in the supernatural can have terrible consequences, the potential for problems is directly proportional to how deeply a society/culture embraces a supernatural worldview. You might want to consider what it's like to be a non-believer in a Country that heavily embraces a revealed religion [exclusivist in nature]. People will post billboards and signs everywhere proclaiming this that or the other about God, but the second an atheist pays to have a billboard or sign stating "You can be good without God" the world comes to an end. Our culture is geared towards automatically giving religious belief preference and special treatment. Speaking of the world coming to an end, what group of folks was it that gave all their money to an old man who proclaimed that the earth was coming to an end? Were these people healthy skeptics? No. Real tangible damage was done to these peoples lives. There are children that have perished because the parents believed that God would heal their child if they just prayed hard enough. I know these people may be in the minority, but it's the principle issue that worries me. And yet consider North Korea. Christians are killed and tortured for being Christians, done in the name of atheism. You see, your trying to divert the issue. The real issue is not religion, it is peoples own pride. You see evil people will use what ever they can to justify there own personal gain. Stating that just having religion, is a cause or even a potential cause for people to be evil does not make any sense. I have met many very nice atheists. Really good people. However I know many evil atheists, Joseph Stalin comes to mind. You see there are many criminal evil atheists. Does that mean that being an atheists makes you a criminal? Again. your argument is hollow, You are obviously arguing against the existence of god as you came to our forum, knowing full well it was a christian forum, and started debating with us about the existence of God. You have tried to state that being religious equals automatically a dangerous slope to fanaticism. So again. why are you here trying to convince us that there is no god. Or the other side of this question, why are you here asking us to convince you there is a god? By the way, Christians in general, want people to become Christians, not because they do not like non Christians, but because they want to save there souls which we believe exists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 Also this question is one I have been wondering for awhile. Why is it, if your an atheist who as many have put it does not belive in a god like one does not belive in "the magical pink pony" then why do you try to prove that a god does not exist? Why do you speak about god not existing so much. If something does not exist there are not usually a lot of people trying to disprove it. I do not believe in Santa Claus (as he is portrayed not the historical saint Nichols ) and yet I don't go around trying to disprove him. If you simply do not believe in something, why do you feel that you must disprove it? This indeed is a very good question. I thought it was an assertion, kidding I can only speak of me. I do not like to discuss with people who agree with me. I think it is boring, and since the reason we are here, if any, is very important for the human race, I think it deserves to be debated. Why do you thnik our reason for being here is important to the human race? Is it important to you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 It is my personal opinion that belief in the supernatural can have terrible consequences, the potential for problems is directly proportional to how deeply a society/culture embraces a supernatural worldview. How do you explain communism, fascism, and totalitarianism/despotism such as exists in North Korea that has no basis in any belief in the supernatural?? You might want to consider what it's like to be a non-believer in a Country that heavily embraces a revealed religion [exclusivist in nature] You enjoy more freedoms in the United States than you would in North Korea or atheistic China. What about what its like for a Christian to live in nations where atheism is enforced and Christianity is forbidden? All Americans, Christian or not, enjoy far more freedoms in the United States which is mostly Christian than in other nation. By the way, Christianity is not exclusivist in nature. People will post billboards and signs everywhere proclaiming this that or the other about God, but the second an atheist pays to have a billboard or sign stating "You can be good without God" the world comes to an end. The world comes to an end??? Oh please... Christians are regularly hounded by groups like ACLU and atheists protest any public display of Christianity on a regular basis. Stop whining. Our culture is geared towards automatically giving religious belief preference and special treatment. Speaking of the world coming to an end, what group of folks was it that gave all their money to an old man who proclaimed that the earth was coming to an end? Were these people healthy skeptics? No. Neither were they healthy Christians. I am surprised that you are trying measure the rest of us on the basis of some small group that is not representative of the whole. That is what atheists have to do, I guess. You cannot make that accusation about real, well-adjusted Christians so you have to resort to dishonest tactics like throwing us all into the same barrell with a cult. Real tangible damage was done to these peoples lives. There are children that have perished because the parents believed that God would heal their child if they just prayed hard enough. I know these people may be in the minority, but it's the principle issue that worries me. It's a principle you cannot reasonably apply with any intellectual credibility to the whole of Christianity. Yeah, we all know they were nuts to believe that guy. The problem is that you cannot use that one group to justify your gripes against the Christian faith as a whole, as most of us don't fit into the same slot as that cult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldEnglishSheepdog Posted November 23, 2011 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 844 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 118 Days Won: 11 Joined: 12/23/2010 Status: Offline Share Posted November 23, 2011 It is my personal opinion that belief in the supernatural can have terrible consequences, the potential for problems is directly proportional to how deeply a society/culture embraces a supernatural worldview. How do you explain communism, fascism, and totalitarianism/despotism such as exists in North Korea that has no basis in any belief in the supernatural?? You might want to consider what it's like to be a non-believer in a Country that heavily embraces a revealed religion [exclusivist in nature] You enjoy more freedoms in the United States than you would in North Korea or atheistic China. What about what its like for a Christian to live in nations where atheism is enforced and Christianity is forbidden? All Americans, Christian or not, enjoy far more freedoms in the United States which is mostly Christian than in other nation. By the way, Christianity is not exclusivist in nature. No kidding. Why does anyone have the freedom to question religion and why does anyone have individual rights? The answer for both is the Bible expressed through Protestanism, which sought to practice what the Bible actually preaches. Atheism didn't bring freedom. Check out Dinesh D'Sousa's arguments on how atheism is responsible for vastly more bloodshed and tyranny than any religion could boast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 It is my personal opinion that belief in the supernatural can have terrible consequences, the potential for problems is directly proportional to how deeply a society/culture embraces a supernatural worldview. How do you explain communism, fascism, and totalitarianism/despotism such as exists in North Korea that has no basis in any belief in the supernatural?? You might want to consider what it's like to be a non-believer in a Country that heavily embraces a revealed religion [exclusivist in nature] You enjoy more freedoms in the United States than you would in North Korea or atheistic China. What about what its like for a Christian to live in nations where atheism is enforced and Christianity is forbidden? All Americans, Christian or not, enjoy far more freedoms in the United States which is mostly Christian than in other nation. By the way, Christianity is not exclusivist in nature. No kidding. Why does anyone have the freedom to question religion and why does anyone have individual rights? The answer for both is the Bible expressed through Protestanism, which sought to practice what the Bible actually preaches. Atheism didn't bring freedom. Check out Dinesh D'Sousa's arguments on how atheism is responsible for vastly more bloodshed and tyranny than any religion could boast. Indeed... It was Christians who demanded a Bill of Rights be added to the Constitution before it was ratified. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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