Adam And Eve - Just An Allegory?

[Guest HisG]

BFA

One cannot argue with what Jesus stated as fact.

.....and I for one am not going to start.

[ByFaithAlone]

BFA

One cannot argue with what Jesus stated as fact.

.....and I for one am not going to start.

I think D-9 pretty much summed up my position on the issue but speaking of a person, event, etc. does not imply that it is a literal person, event, etc. This is especially true when taking the writing style of Genesis and the historical understanding of the Jewish and early Christians who thought of the early chapters as allegorical in nature. I would once again forward the example of Homer's Odyssey. If I told you that someone had Achilles' strength or Odysseus' cunning, one would not jump to the conclusion that Achilles and Odysseus were real people because the context and writing style of the Odyssey is well known. Similarly, knowing that the ancient church and Jewish people viewed Genesis as allegory, the textual criticism which demonstrates the epic poem nature of Genesis, I think it would be much more reasonable to think that Christ, understanding the culture in which he lived, spoke to the Jews about the allegory of Genesis.

[Guest HisG]

You are in error in your thinking BFA.

When Jesus spoke of Noah, Jonah and the big fish etc... He spoke of actualities - nothing more, nothing less.

You can try to justify your analysis as much as you want to but Jesus' words stand over your interpretation of it.

[Guest HisG]

You need to think BFA that if Jesus spoke of certain people as actual citizens of this planet, then what about the event/time in history that Jesus associates them with?

Think clearly.

[Guest HisG]

As far as comparisons went, Jesus used parallels between people and events of the OT to the current attitudes and situations of audience He was speaking to.

[ByFaithAlone]

You are in error in your thinking BFA.

When Jesus spoke of Noah, Jonah and the big fish etc... He spoke of actualities - nothing more, nothing less.

You can try to justify your analysis as much as you want to but Jesus' words stand over your interpretation of it.

So I am bringing up reasons for my particular interpretation of scripture, citing historical precedents set by the early church and Jewish writers, scientific ideas of an old earth and textual criticism which shows Genesis to be written in the manner of an epic and you simply repeat your point without backing it up. Perhaps you would like to offer some historical precedents, scientific theories or textual criticism of your own?

You need to think BFA that if Jesus spoke of certain people as actual citizens of this planet, then what about the event/time in history that Jesus associates them with?

Think clearly.

I agree that we do need to consider the context in which Jesus spoke. We need to realize that Christ was talking to the Jewish people who knew Genesis well and understood the style in which it was written. We need to understand that these people would have understood what Jesus was talking about when he referred to Adam and Genesis. The best way I can think of doing this is by examining early Christian and Jewish thoughts on the interpretation of Genesis, in which case the majority would support my position.

As far as comparisons went, Jesus used parallels between people and events of the OT to the current attitudes and situations of audience He was speaking to.

Again, I completely agree that Jesus talked about people and events. However, did he intend that all of these people were literal figures or allegorical ones? Wouldn't the early Christians and Jews of that era have a better understanding of what Jesus thought and what the Jews of that era thought then you do now in the 21st century? I would rather rely on their older orthodox (and by orthodox I mean traditional norms or views of religion, not Orthodox as in the denomination) interpretations then a relatively recent literal view that came about as a result of the Great Awakening.

[enoob57]

You are in error in your thinking BFA.

When Jesus spoke of Noah, Jonah and the big fish etc... He spoke of actualities - nothing more, nothing less.

You can try to justify your analysis as much as you want to but Jesus' words stand over your interpretation of it.

What I always find interesting is that literalists seem to think that their view is not an "interpretation", but it is! It is a literal interpretation of the text. Jesus said X, and you have your own specific interpretation of what those words mean while BFA and myself have another, they are both interpretations of the text. A literal interpretation is not a special category of interpretation, even when it's correct.

No offense, but understanding this your assertions carry no weight without backing them up, and I think there is plenty to suggest that the allegorical interpretation is correct.

Yes that is the purpose of the hermeneutic... what does the Word of God say beyond our personal bias. Love, Steven

[gdemoss]

OK, for those of you who believe that a least some people in the bible are allegorical and not literal people, how do you discern which is which?

[Guest HisG]

BFA

You miss the point altogether.

You purposefully skip over the evidence that is historical text. Jesus' words provide the accuracy in history.

If I can't rely on the accuracy of Christ's words, then my faith is shallow and has no core.

Fortunately, I have placed my trust/faith in His Word and His Word is a lamp to my feet.

I believe what Jesus says - simple.

[Tinky]

D-9: " I think there is plenty to suggest that the allegorical interpretation is correct."

There is no evidence whatsoever to suggest that what Jesus said about Adam and Eve, Job, Noah and the Flood, etc., was allegorical. None.

All you have is a belief that Jesus did not really mean what He said. But, as you are spiritually blind to begin with, it's understandable.

"And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing. In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God." (2 Corinthians 4:3-4)

"The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned." (1 Corinthians 2:14)