Trinity Posted July 21, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 92 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,244 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 63 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted July 21, 2005 After the Tribulation Saints are resurrected then the FIRST RESURRECTION is finished. This can't be the rapture because then who are the men sitting on thrones in Revelation 20:4: "I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. ..." These are raptured believers who already gone through the Judgment Seat of Christ. A POST-TRIB rapture allows no time for the Judgment Seat of Christ. Besides God The only people mentioned able to judge also is the Church! Revelation 20:4: "...And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus and because of the word of God" This is the second group, These are not The Church for these people do not have the power to Judge according to revelation. Yet we know the church will have the power to judge! 1 Corinthians 6:2 "Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if you are to judge the world, are you not competent to judge trivial cases?" Ill Put the same info another way so you get it fully: Revelation 20:4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge (. period) And-(repursenting that there is a second group) I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus and because of the word of God. The bible never says that this second group can Judge, but it says the First group can, we know the church will have the power to judge! 1 Corinthians 6:2 "Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if you are to judge the world, are you not competent to judge trivial cases?" and Besides God The only people mentioned able to judge also is the Church! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Answer this please i'v been waiting since Monday and still no answers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirsilius Posted July 22, 2005 Group: Junior Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 117 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/07/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted July 22, 2005 (edited) Answer this please i'v been waiting since Monday and still no answers <{POST_SNAPBACK}> It appears that the KEY to your argument, in this case, is held together by your assumption that this 2nd group, those having been beheaded for refusing to worship the beast or his image, AREN Edited July 22, 2005 by Sirsilius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinity Posted July 22, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 92 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,244 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 63 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted July 22, 2005 It appears that the KEY to your argument, in this case, is held together by your assumption that this 2nd group, those having been beheaded for refusing to worship the beast or his image, AREN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinity Posted July 22, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 92 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,244 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 63 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted July 22, 2005 Yes they will be standing at the throne of God but no where in scripture does it say that they will have thrones Yet the Church does Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinity Posted July 22, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 92 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,244 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 63 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted July 22, 2005 Revelation 20:4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge (. period) And-(repursenting that there is a second group) I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus and because of the word of God. There are infact 2 separated groups, if i where to say; There are the humans whom God gave the world too. And i saw all the dogs whome i have created. You wouldn't say that the dogs and the humans are the same group would you? No! Same thing for if it was 1 group it would had been written like this: Revelation 20:4: "I saw thrones on which were seated are those souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus and because of the word of God, to these has been given authority to judge" But it doesn't say that, it says: Revelation 20:4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge (. period) And-(repursenting that there is a second group) I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus and because of the word of God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halifaxchristian Posted July 22, 2005 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 722 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 10 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/01/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted July 22, 2005 Sue, I have another question for you when you get better. The Bible says that all tribes, nations, and kindreds who do NOT take the mark of the beast will be slain by the antichrist, except for the Israelites, of whom will be supernaturally protected. My question is this. If the rapture is post-trib, then there would certainly be few, if any, Christians left to rapture, for they did not take the mark and died. The rapture would thus be pointless, would it not? Whom would be raptured??? The pre-trib rapture theory accounts for this. I'm sorry, but the Scriptures seem to be very clear that Christ's Second Coming will have two distinct parts. Just like the Jews did not understand that their Messiah would have two separate comings, I believe that many Christians are just as ignorant to a similar set of circumstances for His second. Please help me out here. The more I look into the rapture, the more I am convinced that it is definitely pre-trib. God bless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christ's Free Servant Posted July 22, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 197 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 2,461 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 4 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/18/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/31/1949 Author Share Posted July 22, 2005 Sue, I have another question for you when you get better. The Bible says that all tribes, nations, and kindreds who do NOT take the mark of the beast will be slain by the antichrist, except for the Israelites, of whom will be supernaturally protected. My question is this. If the rapture is post-trib, then there would certainly be few, if any, Christians left to rapture, for they did not take the mark and died. The rapture would thus be pointless, would it not? Whom would be raptured??? The pre-trib rapture theory accounts for this. I'm sorry, but the Scriptures seem to be very clear that Christ's Second Coming will have two distinct parts. Just like the Jews did not understand that their Messiah would have two separate comings, I believe that many Christians are just as ignorant to a similar set of circumstances for His second. Please help me out here. The more I look into the rapture, the more I am convinced that it is definitely pre-trib. God bless. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well, my brain is slowly coming back, but it is not quite ready to take this on yet. This one I'll have to look up, but here a few verses that have probably already been discussed but talk about the saints during the tribulation: "He was given power to make war against the saints and to conquer them. And he was given authority over every tribe, people, language and nation. All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halifaxchristian Posted July 22, 2005 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 722 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 10 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/01/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted July 22, 2005 Sue, there will be tribulation saints even after the church is raptured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinity Posted July 22, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 92 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,244 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 63 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted July 22, 2005 Pick, When will the Post-trib rapture happen... Before or after Armageddon, because you guys seem to want it both ways... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christ's Free Servant Posted July 22, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 197 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 2,461 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 4 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/18/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/31/1949 Author Share Posted July 22, 2005 Sue, I have another question for you when you get better. The Bible says that all tribes, nations, and kindreds who do NOT take the mark of the beast will be slain by the antichrist, except for the Israelites, of whom will be supernaturally protected. My question is this. If the rapture is post-trib, then there would certainly be few, if any, Christians left to rapture, for they did not take the mark and died. The rapture would thus be pointless, would it not? Whom would be raptured??? The pre-trib rapture theory accounts for this. I'm sorry, but the Scriptures seem to be very clear that Christ's Second Coming will have two distinct parts. Just like the Jews did not understand that their Messiah would have two separate comings, I believe that many Christians are just as ignorant to a similar set of circumstances for His second. Please help me out here. The more I look into the rapture, the more I am convinced that it is definitely pre-trib. God bless. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Would you please be so kind as to give me scripture references for your statements above and when my brain is working better I can look them up? Thanks! I admit I am not an expert debater on the whole pre-trib/post-trib thing. I never saw the value in debating it. Most people who enter debates on these subjects already come into the discussion with their minds made up and the discussions usually end up with people getting angry and feelings getting hurt, and for what purpose? Are you really open to finding out if what the guy said in his article is true or not? If you are really searching for truth, there are many good arguments on here already and most of all, you can pray and ask the Holy Spirit to guide you into truth. The Lord spoke to me through his word in a powerful way this past year in opening my eyes to a lot of things I never really took a stand on before and what this guy said in this article pretty much sums up what the Lord has been saying to me. I don't doubt God's voice. He has confirmed it over and over again to me. So, I'm taking a post-trib stance like I have never done before and I'm really not looking for a debate. I'm just trying to share what the Lord gives me to share and hope that HE will use it to open people's eyes to what is coming. I don't care about proving who is right or who is wrong. That is not what this is about. It is about getting people ready. That's what I care about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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