Serving Posted February 26, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 22 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 934 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 905 Days Won: 2 Joined: 09/05/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/14/1969 Share Posted February 26, 2023 Hello all, I've not made a post for some time, but I feel inspired to speak about something that has eluded me for so long now, it's been in the backburner of my mind and it is only because a brethren brought this subject up again recently that I decided to revisit it .. And after 10 years gathering dust in the background of my mind, "I" finally worked this out earlier today, or better said, The Lord finally let me understand, and to be honest .. it's so simple I'm kind of embarrassed by it, but at the same time it is marvelous because through the understanding given me now, I realize just WHO these are being spoken of below .. at long last .. so here are those elusive scriptures that have frustrated me and others for so long: Luke 17:30-37 30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed. 31 In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. 32 Remember Lot's wife. 33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it. 34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. 35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 37 And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together. Remember, all glory to the Lord .. Want to know who the above group is? Walk with me a minute and lets do this together .. behold: Look at v30 .. that is the coming, the revealing of the Lord. Evidence: 2 Thessalonians 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, Simple .. lock it in .. NEXT > WHAT is v31 saying? Look at it again please .. 31 In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. What is that actually saying? It is saying >> FLEE >> To "Not return back" means to FLEE .. keep that in mind .. NEXT > WHO is being told to flee? .. I'm splitting up v31 from above okay .. 2 parts .. (a) & (b) v31(a) .. "he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away" Those are "Householders" .. and they are told, don't even get your "stuff" >> meaning , FLEE !! And the other group mentioned in that same verse : v31(b) .. "and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back." Those are Workers !! If you are out in the "field" .. you are at work !! Pretty simple, if you're at home .. FLEE .. if you are at work .. FLEE .. pretty simple, so lock that in too please .. NEXT > Look at v34 .. WHERE are those located? 34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. A: These are located at home, in BED !! Again, Who did v31 mention? .. householders .. householders told to >> FLEE !! Householders in BED !! And furthermore, where are those in v35 & v36 located? 35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. At work !! Exactly where this lot are in v31(b) : "and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back." .. And what were the workers told to do again? >> to FLEE !! See? Perfect match !! Thus, this group are in fact, and can only be, the remnants in Israel, those still alive and being told to FLEE at the actual revealing/appearing of The Lord .. that is, on the Day of the Lord itself, the 2nd coming .. You know, the ones who flee through the valley the Lord opens up at His return .. them. See how the Lord disguised the true meaning? I know I was concentrating on those being "Taken" .. that word "Taken" had me concentrating on a "Harvest" and thus thought those lot were a group being harvested .. being "taken up." But they were not .. They were in fact fleeing under their own steam per instruction given in v31 .. These are so so obviously the remnants that remain alive IN Israel at His appearing .. when the real fireworks start going off .. It's so clear now it's been pointed out right? Oh, last thing, I can now confidently dissect this seeing it correlates perfectly with my explanation given above. take a look : 37 And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together. Thus, in light of the new understanding, the body is obviously Jerusalem and the eagles are obviously the enemy armies gathered there abouts. So simple now when explained isn't it? You can now see the passages explain themselves so clearly with this new perspective .. Thus with clarity I can confidently say that the above group can only be those remnants IN Israel mentioned in the OT prophecies at the time of His 2nd coming .. they were not killed at the mark of the beast, they were not taken up to meet Christ in the air .. instead .. they were told to FLEE at the time of His appearing (because of the raging war against Christ when He appears in the clouds) .. think NUKES .. which neatly explains why the Lord has this group FLEE through a mountain valley He opens up for them at His appearing .. what do they say is the best place to be in a NUKE attack .. in the covering of solid rock .. in the mountains. Without a single doubt .. these are them .. this is not a "rapture" or a "taking up" .. this is "flee for your lives" situation .. that is how they are "Taken" .. God is telling them FLEE .. thus metaphorically speaking, the Lord does indeed "take" them .. just not in the way I/we all thought. I hope this excites at least somebody as it has me excited .. Praise the Lord. Thoughts? 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael37 Posted February 27, 2023 Group: Servant Followers: 21 Topic Count: 246 Topics Per Day: 0.11 Content Count: 7,078 Content Per Day: 3.28 Reputation: 5,003 Days Won: 2 Joined: 07/05/2018 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/23/1954 Share Posted February 27, 2023 1 hour ago, Serving said: Luke 17:30-37 30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed. 31 In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. 32 Remember Lot's wife. 33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it. 34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. 35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Interesting statement by our Lord, given that day and night are both represented as possible times for one to be taken and the other to be left, that no matter where someone is or what they are doing God has access to everyone. Some commentators explain that those taken are taken in the Wrath of God's Judgment, and those left are spared the Wrath of His Judgment to reign with Him in the Millenium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serving Posted February 27, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 22 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 934 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 905 Days Won: 2 Joined: 09/05/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/14/1969 Author Share Posted February 27, 2023 19 minutes ago, Michael37 said: Interesting statement by our Lord, given that day and night are both represented as possible times for one to be taken and the other to be left, that no matter where someone is or what they are doing God has access to everyone. Some commentators explain that those taken are taken in the Wrath of God's Judgment, and those left are spared the Wrath of His Judgment to reign with Him in the Millenium. Haha .. excellent observation there brother. I was hoping nobody noticed actually in case nobody answered I was going to use it to lead into another related subject about night and day .. Since you so excellently spotted that, I will share it now .. Isaiah 28:14-19 14 Wherefore hear the word of the LORD, ye scornful men, that rule this people which is in Jerusalem. 15 Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves: 16 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tried stone, a precious corner stone, a sure foundation: he that believeth shall not make haste. 17 Judgment also will I lay to the line, and righteousness to the plummet: and the hail shall sweep away the refuge of lies, and the waters shall overflow the hiding place. 18 And your covenant with death shall be disannulled, and your agreement with hell shall not stand; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, then ye shall be trodden down by it. 19 From the time that it goeth forth it shall take you: for morning by morning shall it pass over, by day and by night: and it shall be a vexation only to understand the report. That's the attack and occupation of Israel that is to come. Thanks for commenting brother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serving Posted February 27, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 22 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 934 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 905 Days Won: 2 Joined: 09/05/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/14/1969 Author Share Posted February 27, 2023 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Michael37 said: Interesting statement by our Lord, given that day and night are both represented as possible times for one to be taken and the other to be left, that no matter where someone is or what they are doing God has access to everyone. Some commentators explain that those taken are taken in the Wrath of God's Judgment, and those left are spared the Wrath of His Judgment to reign with Him in the Millenium. Oh, and the covenant Michael .. Check this out brother : 15 Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves: Revelation 6:8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth. Same timeframe/players .. Edited February 27, 2023 by Serving Oops .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael37 Posted February 27, 2023 Group: Servant Followers: 21 Topic Count: 246 Topics Per Day: 0.11 Content Count: 7,078 Content Per Day: 3.28 Reputation: 5,003 Days Won: 2 Joined: 07/05/2018 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/23/1954 Share Posted February 27, 2023 24 minutes ago, Serving said: Oh, and the covenant Michael .. Check this out brother : 15 Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves: Revelation 6:8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth. Same event. Gill in his commentary cross-references these two passages which are similar because they both contain the personification of death and hell. Isaiah prophesied God's Judgment on those who relied on false gods and alliances with pagan nations, and those who mocked and scorned the "word of the Lord" which he brought acted as if they had a covenant that prevented their punishment, but as you have quoted, Isaiah proclaims that such a covenant is to be annulled and punishment will be meted out. Isa 28:18 Your covenant with death will be annulled, And your agreement with Sheol will not stand; When the overflowing scourge passes through, Then you will be trampled down by it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serving Posted February 27, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 22 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 934 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 905 Days Won: 2 Joined: 09/05/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/14/1969 Author Share Posted February 27, 2023 46 minutes ago, Michael37 said: Gill in his commentary cross-references these two passages which are similar because they both contain the personification of death and hell. Isaiah prophesied God's Judgment on those who relied on false gods and alliances with pagan nations, and those who mocked and scorned the "word of the Lord" which he brought acted as if they had a covenant that prevented their punishment, but as you have quoted, Isaiah proclaims that such a covenant is to be annulled and punishment will be meted out. Isa 28:18 Your covenant with death will be annulled, And your agreement with Sheol will not stand; When the overflowing scourge passes through, Then you will be trampled down by it. Yes, it's a good subject. Just in case, and to clear something up beforehand .. the examples I gave regarding the attack on Israel, and the night and day cross reference .. I wasn't suggesting that was the same event as the original subject matter of this thread. Two different time frames within the same process taking place, the Isaiah attack is at the very beginning of Israel's occupation, and the original post of this thread concerned the very ending of Israel's occupation .. the day and night link speaks of a process whereby time is available to flee .. that was just a minor link between the two scriptures I was highlighting, nothing more since they are two separate events during the same occupational time allotment, that is, within those last 3 1/2 years .. Isaiah speaks to the beginning (the attack is what I focused on) and Luke referred to the end of the process (the fleeing I focused on) .. That link between night and day was just an excuse to expand the subject and link them all up for extra subject matter down the track .. Regards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farouk Posted February 27, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 9 Topic Count: 27 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 6,865 Content Per Day: 12.26 Reputation: 3,522 Days Won: 31 Joined: 11/18/2022 Status: Offline Share Posted February 27, 2023 It would seem that the Luke17 passage relates to tribulation saints... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serving Posted February 27, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 22 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 934 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 905 Days Won: 2 Joined: 09/05/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/14/1969 Author Share Posted February 27, 2023 15 hours ago, farouk said: It would seem that the Luke17 passage relates to tribulation saints... Hi brother, Maybe read Zechariah first. Seeing that Christ gathers His saints to meet Him in the clouds at His arrival, not one saint needs to flee for their lives .. not in Luke, not anywhere ever again .. yet they are fleeing for their lives in Luke .. fleeing while the Lord is watching them from the clouds. Seeing that they are not taken to Christ in the clouds, and are told to >> flee << ,then we must conclude that those in Luke are the same as these ones below in Zechariah who are likewise >> fleeing << after .. after .. after Christ's arrival in the clouds : Zechariah 14 1 Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee. 2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city. 3 Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. 4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south. 5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee. 6 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark: 7 But it shall be one day which shall be known to the LORD, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light. 8 And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be. 9 And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one. --------------------------- No saint needs to flee anything when the Lord appears in the clouds .. unless of course .. you were not a saint of Christ's. They will be however become Christ's during the millennial reign. Taught by saints, overseen and aided by the resurrected and of course, the King of Kings Himself. Just compare the scriptures of Luke and Zechariah above, both scriptures confess that Christ has arrived, He is in the clouds .. there is a war raging (against Christ) and there are human survivors in Jerusalem being told to flee under Christ's direction yet, yet He is not gathering them to Himself in the clouds, they are not changed into spirit and they flee for their lives against something terrible that is headed their way, so terrible that the Lord has to cause a great earthquake and open up a valley through the mountains for these humans to flee through so they can survive. These do not sound like saints to me, they will be, but not at that point. Leave it with you. Regards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serving Posted February 27, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 22 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 934 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 905 Days Won: 2 Joined: 09/05/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/14/1969 Author Share Posted February 27, 2023 Another insight : Luke 17:30-37 30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed. 31 In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. 32 Remember Lot's wife. 33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it. 34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. 35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 37 And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together. ------------------- What do you suppose happens to these below, who are not taken : 35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. V32 is a reminder, a warning .. 32 Remember Lot's wife. This is what happens to those who are "left" in Israel .. those who did not >>flee<< .. just as Lot had to flee .. Luke 17:29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. They will be destroyed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth7t7 Posted February 27, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,749 Content Per Day: 0.60 Reputation: 329 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/19/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted February 27, 2023 (edited) On 2/26/2023 at 2:51 PM, Serving said: Hello all, I've not made a post for some time, but I feel inspired to speak about something that has eluded me for so long now, it's been in the backburner of my mind and it is only because a brethren brought this subject up again recently that I decided to revisit it .. And after 10 years gathering dust in the background of my mind, "I" finally worked this out earlier today, or better said, The Lord finally let me understand, and to be honest .. it's so simple I'm kind of embarrassed by it, but at the same time it is marvelous because through the understanding given me now, I realize just WHO these are being spoken of below .. at long last .. so here are those elusive scriptures that have frustrated me and others for so long: Luke 17:30-37 30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed. 31 In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. 32 Remember Lot's wife. 33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it. 34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. 35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 37 And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together. Remember, all glory to the Lord .. Want to know who the above group is? Walk with me a minute and lets do this together .. behold: Look at v30 .. that is the coming, the revealing of the Lord. Evidence: 2 Thessalonians 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, Simple .. lock it in .. NEXT > WHAT is v31 saying? Look at it again please .. 31 In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. What is that actually saying? It is saying >> FLEE >> To "Not return back" means to FLEE .. keep that in mind .. NEXT > WHO is being told to flee? .. I'm splitting up v31 from above okay .. 2 parts .. (a) & (b) v31(a) .. "he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away" Those are "Householders" .. and they are told, don't even get your "stuff" >> meaning , FLEE !! And the other group mentioned in that same verse : v31(b) .. "and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back." Those are Workers !! If you are out in the "field" .. you are at work !! Pretty simple, if you're at home .. FLEE .. if you are at work .. FLEE .. pretty simple, so lock that in too please .. NEXT > Look at v34 .. WHERE are those located? 34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. A: These are located at home, in BED !! Again, Who did v31 mention? .. householders .. householders told to >> FLEE !! Householders in BED !! And furthermore, where are those in v35 & v36 located? 35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. At work !! Exactly where this lot are in v31(b) : "and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back." .. And what were the workers told to do again? >> to FLEE !! See? Perfect match !! Thus, this group are in fact, and can only be, the remnants in Israel, those still alive and being told to FLEE at the actual revealing/appearing of The Lord .. that is, on the Day of the Lord itself, the 2nd coming .. You know, the ones who flee through the valley the Lord opens up at His return .. them. See how the Lord disguised the true meaning? I know I was concentrating on those being "Taken" .. that word "Taken" had me concentrating on a "Harvest" and thus thought those lot were a group being harvested .. being "taken up." But they were not .. They were in fact fleeing under their own steam per instruction given in v31 .. These are so so obviously the remnants that remain alive IN Israel at His appearing .. when the real fireworks start going off .. It's so clear now it's been pointed out right? Oh, last thing, I can now confidently dissect this seeing it correlates perfectly with my explanation given above. take a look : 37 And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together. Thus, in light of the new understanding, the body is obviously Jerusalem and the eagles are obviously the enemy armies gathered there abouts. So simple now when explained isn't it? You can now see the passages explain themselves so clearly with this new perspective .. Thus with clarity I can confidently say that the above group can only be those remnants IN Israel mentioned in the OT prophecies at the time of His 2nd coming .. they were not killed at the mark of the beast, they were not taken up to meet Christ in the air .. instead .. they were told to FLEE at the time of His appearing (because of the raging war against Christ when He appears in the clouds) .. think NUKES .. which neatly explains why the Lord has this group FLEE through a mountain valley He opens up for them at His appearing .. what do they say is the best place to be in a NUKE attack .. in the covering of solid rock .. in the mountains. Without a single doubt .. these are them .. this is not a "rapture" or a "taking up" .. this is "flee for your lives" situation .. that is how they are "Taken" .. God is telling them FLEE .. thus metaphorically speaking, the Lord does indeed "take" them .. just not in the way I/we all thought. I hope this excites at least somebody as it has me excited .. Praise the Lord. Thoughts? The passage surrounds the Lord's second coming and fire destruction It simple teaches when the Lord returns "don't look back" towards earthly possessions or saving your life, just as Lot's wife did in Sodom Verse 33 answers the question, it's the end of the world at the return of Jesus Christ "Fire", don't seek to save your mortal life, look forward in "Passing Through" the Lord's last day judgement by fire to the New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem 1 Corinthians 3:13KJV 13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. Luke 17:29-33KJV 29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. 30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed. 31 In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. 32 Remember Lot's wife. 33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it. Edited February 27, 2023 by truth7t7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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