Salvation is in your hands, Jesus did his part.

[FreeGrace]

1 hour ago, Bro.Tan said:

Listen very carefully to what the Master is saying here. 

Mark 8: 34

Look at verse 35 in Mark,

The ONLY WAY that "salvation is in your hands", the title of this thread, is WHEN a person places their full trust in the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross on their behalf.  At that point, Jesus gives them ETERNAL LIFE and they SHALL NEVER PERISH, per John 10:28, and further, the believer is in God's HANDS, in which no one, meaning NO PERSON, which includes even the believer themself, can snatch away.

John 10:28 - I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.

Salvation is by faith, and is permanent.  Any thing and every thing ELSE anyone says is simply FALSE DOCTRINE.

Listen very carfully to what the Master said about eternal security.

Are you trying to make Him look like a liar?

[Bro.Tan]

You now should clearly understand these verses that the Master is saying here. 

Matthew 10:37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. 38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me. 39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it. 

Will you deny the LORD for your mother or your father or any other family member? Will you turn away from His law for someone in your family? Look and see who the LORD considers family members. 

Matthew 12:46 While he yet talked to the people, behold, his mother and his brethren stood without, desiring to speak with him. 47 Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee. 48 But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren? 49 And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren! 50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother. 

So I see, if you do the will of the Father in heaven you are a family member.

[FreeGrace]

14 hours ago, Bro.Tan said:

So I see, if you do the will of the Father in heaven you are a family member.

This is not what the Bible says.  In fact, we know what the will of the Father is, because Jesus told us in very plain words.

John 6:40 - For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”

As to how to become a "family member", we also have very plain words that tell us exactly HOW:

John 1:12 - Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God—

Clear enough, but would you like another one?  OK

Gal 3:26 - So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith,

So, you see, salvation and becoming the family of God is by faith.  No works listed at all.

Why do you continue to insist that works are necessary for salvation when you have no verses that say so?

[Bro.Tan]

On 9/22/2023 at 7:08 AM, FreeGrace said:

This is not what the Bible says.  In fact, we know what the will of the Father is, because Jesus told us in very plain words.

John 6:40 - For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”

As to how to become a "family member", we also have very plain words that tell us exactly HOW:

John 1:12 - Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God—

Clear enough, but would you like another one?  OK

Gal 3:26 - So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith,

So, you see, salvation and becoming the family of God is by faith.  No works listed at all.

Why do you continue to insist that works are necessary for salvation when you have no verses that say so?

Remember what JESUS did for all of us, don't receive HIS grace in vain. 

John 12:23 And Jesus answered them, saying, The hour is come, that the Son of man should be glorified. 24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. 25 He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal. 26 If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour. 27 Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour. 

What was HIS cause? To die for all men. Did HE think of HIMSELF? Look at verse 27, Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour. He did the will of the Father. 

 

[FreeGrace]

14 minutes ago, Bro.Tan said:

Remember what JESUS did for all of us, don't receive HIS grace in vain. 

Of course I am fully aware what Jesus did for everyone.  And I haven't received His grace in vain.  

14 minutes ago, Bro.Tan said:

John 12:23 And Jesus answered them, saying, The hour is come, that the Son of man should be glorified. 24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. 25 He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal. 26 If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour. 27 Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour. 

What was HIS cause? To die for all men. Did HE think of HIMSELF? Look at verse 27, Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour. He did the will of the Father. 

Great verses, for sure.  But what is your point here?

[Big Boy Stan Murf]

On 9/18/2023 at 7:57 PM, Robtay7123 said:

If you can show me where it says Easter and Christmas are sinful

You should study both of these out... neither are biblical.

I don't do easter bunnys but I do celebrate the resurrection of Jesus daily as well as on the day that claim to be easter which is a pagan holiday

I don't do satan claws either but I d celebrate Jesus being born into the flesh daily... but not so much on the day the world celebrates Christ Mass because... well, I'm not catholic.

[Bro.Tan]

19 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

Of course I am fully aware what Jesus did for everyone.  And I haven't received His grace in vain.  

Great verses, for sure.  But what is your point here?

Look what Abraham did here. Who does he love more Isaac or the LORD. 

Genesis 22:1 And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham, and said unto him, Abraham: and he said, Behold, here I am. 2 And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of. 3 And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and saddled his ass, and took two of his young men with him, and Isaac his son, and clave the wood for the burnt offering, and rose up, and went unto the place of which God had told him. 9 And they came to the place which God had told him of; and Abraham built an altar there, and laid the wood in order, and bound Isaac his son, and laid him on the altar upon the wood. 

10 And Abraham stretched forth his hand, and took the knife to slay his son. 11 And the angel of the LORD called unto him out of heaven, and said, Abraham, Abraham: and he said, Here am I. 12 And he said, Lay not thine hand upon the lad, neither do thou any thing unto him: for now I know that thou fearest God, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son from me. 

Abraham had faith in GOD. Why? He did exactly what the LORD told him to do. The LORD told Abraham earlier that Isaac would carry his seed. Abraham new the LORD would not lie, he knew the LORD could raise his son from the dead if he had sacrificed him. This act got Abraham 

into the kingdom. How do I know that, read the next set of verses in Hebrews and you will see. A few other brothers also in Hebrews 11 are waiting on the promise. 

Hebrews 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. 2 For by it the elders obtained a good report. 

3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.  8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went. 9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise: 10for he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God. 11Through faith also Sara herself received strength to conceive seed, and was delivered of a child when she was past age, because she judged him faithful who had promised. 12 Therefore sprang there even of one, and him as good as dead, so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand which is by the sea shore innumerable. 13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. 

36 And others had trial of cruel mockings and scourgings, yea, moreover of bonds and imprisonment: 37 They were stoned, they were sawn asunder, were tempted, were slain with the sword: they wandered about in sheepskins and goatskins; being destitute, afflicted, tormented; 38 (Of whom the world was not worthy:) they wandered in deserts, and in mountains, and in dens and caves of the earth. 39 And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise: 40 God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect. 

As you can see these brothers went through some rough times. If you think your walk with the LORD will be easy you are gravely mistaken. If it is easy you had better check which lord you are following. Look at some of the things they had to go through. Some of them had trials of cruel mockings and scourgings, yea, moreover of bonds and imprisonment. They were stoned, they were sawn asunder, were tempted, were slain with the sword: they wandered about in sheepskins and goatskins; being destitute, afflicted, tormented; Can you handle this? If you are a true servant of GOD you will experience some type of persecution. We are in the last days. If you don't have enough faith in the LORD to flee into the wilderness when abomination of desolation comes on the scene you will suffer like some of the people here. 

[FreeGrace]

2 hours ago, Bro.Tan said:

FreeGrace said: 

Of course I am fully aware what Jesus did for everyone.  And I haven't received His grace in vain.  

Great verses, for sure.  But what is your point here?

Look what Abraham did here. Who does he love more Isaac or the LORD.

Obviously the Lord.  But what's the point?

2 hours ago, Bro.Tan said:

 Genesis 22:1 And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham, and said unto him, Abraham: and he said, Behold, here I am. 2 And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of. 3 And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and saddled his ass, and took two of his young men with him, and Isaac his son, and clave the wood for the burnt offering, and rose up, and went unto the place of which God had told him. 9 And they came to the place which God had told him of; and Abraham built an altar there, and laid the wood in order, and bound Isaac his son, and laid him on the altar upon the wood. 

10 And Abraham stretched forth his hand, and took the knife to slay his son. 11 And the angel of the LORD called unto him out of heaven, and said, Abraham, Abraham: and he said, Here am I. 12 And he said, Lay not thine hand upon the lad, neither do thou any thing unto him: for now I know that thou fearest God, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son from me.

Since God is omniscient, He has ALWAYS known how Abraham would respond.  So God wasn't testing him to find out anything.  God did it to show mankind how much faith in Him that Abraham had.

Heb 11:17-19 tells us about Abraham's great faith:

17 By faith Abraham, when God tested him, offered Isaac as a sacrifice. He who had embraced the promises was about to sacrifice his one and only son, 

18 even though God had said to him, “It is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned.”

19 Abraham reasoned that God could even raise the dead, and so in a manner of speaking he did receive Isaac back from death

Abraham fully expected that by obeying God, he would see the miracle of resurrection from the dead.  And consider this:  Isaac was a strapping young man, and fully able to whip his dad.  No way he would have allowed Abraham to do what he was told to do if Abraham hadn't convinced Isaac that God would raise him from the dead!

2 hours ago, Bro.Tan said:

 Abraham had faith in GOD. Why?

Why not?

2 hours ago, Bro.Tan said:

He did exactly what the LORD told him to do. The LORD told Abraham earlier that Isaac would carry his seed. Abraham new the LORD would not lie, he knew the LORD could raise his son from the dead if he had sacrificed him. This act got Abraham into the kingdom. How do I know that, read the next set of verses in Hebrews and you will see. A few other brothers also in Hebrews 11 are waiting on the promise.

Exactly!

2 hours ago, Bro.Tan said:

 Hebrews 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. 2 For by it the elders obtained a good report. 3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.  8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went. 9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise: 10for he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God. 11Through faith also Sara herself received strength to conceive seed, and was delivered of a child when she was past age, because she judged him faithful who had promised. 12 Therefore sprang there even of one, and him as good as dead, so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand which is by the sea shore innumerable. 13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. 

36 And others had trial of cruel mockings and scourgings, yea, moreover of bonds and imprisonment: 37 They were stoned, they were sawn asunder, were tempted, were slain with the sword: they wandered about in sheepskins and goatskins; being destitute, afflicted, tormented; 38 (Of whom the world was not worthy:) they wandered in deserts, and in mountains, and in dens and caves of the earth. 39 And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise: 40 God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect. 

As you can see these brothers went through some rough times. If you think your walk with the LORD will be easy you are gravely mistaken. If it is easy you had better check which lord you are following. Look at some of the things they had to go through. Some of them had trials of cruel mockings and scourgings, yea, moreover of bonds and imprisonment. They were stoned, they were sawn asunder, were tempted, were slain with the sword: they wandered about in sheepskins and goatskins; being destitute, afflicted, tormented; Can you handle this? If you are a true servant of GOD you will experience some type of persecution. We are in the last days. If you don't have enough faith in the LORD to flee into the wilderness when abomination of desolation comes on the scene you will suffer like some of the people here. 

OK, you have quoted a string of verses, but without any comment or point.

So again, what IS your point?  Can you explain yourself?

[Vine Abider]

@Bro.Tan and @FreeGrace - I want to commend you both for carrying on a very civil discussion on this between yourselves!  It shows that children of God can debate a subject without going over the line and disparaging the other one!

  Thank you!

[Bro.Tan]

11 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

Obviously the Lord.  But what's the point?

Since God is omniscient, He has ALWAYS known how Abraham would respond.  So God wasn't testing him to find out anything.  God did it to show mankind how much faith in Him that Abraham had.

Heb 11:17-19 tells us about Abraham's great faith:

17 By faith Abraham, when God tested him, offered Isaac as a sacrifice. He who had embraced the promises was about to sacrifice his one and only son, 

18 even though God had said to him, “It is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned.”

19 Abraham reasoned that God could even raise the dead, and so in a manner of speaking he did receive Isaac back from death

Abraham fully expected that by obeying God, he would see the miracle of resurrection from the dead.  And consider this:  Isaac was a strapping young man, and fully able to whip his dad.  No way he would have allowed Abraham to do what he was told to do if Abraham hadn't convinced Isaac that God would raise him from the dead!

Why not?

Exactly!

OK, you have quoted a string of verses, but without any comment or point.

So again, what IS your point?  Can you explain yourself?

Paul says in Romans 8:18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us. 19 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.

We have no idea what awaits us if we make it to the right side of the gulf. We must keep his Commandments, Statues and Judgements in order to make it. Have faith that he will deliver us at the time appointed. If we use the examples of our forefathers in Hebrews 11, we will be alright. 

Jesus said with his own mouth; (Matt. 24:13) But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. That is until the end of your life, or until the Second Coming of the Lord.