Guest jckduboise Posted July 12, 2006 Share Posted July 12, 2006 Well it depends on what and how we judge and why. So it is not simple. I agree we are not to judge the state of someone's eternal soul, we also are not to judge those on the outside of the faith according to Paul. But we are indeed to judge those on the inside according to Paul. I think Lady Raven was simply saying that Osborne is not a Christian and I agree with her, which is an important thing to say if he or anybody else is claiming he is a Christian. Not for the sake of judgement of ozzy, but for the sake of those who are not yet believers. We live in a crude, hedonistic culture, if we take away the veneer of some outward shows of Christian belief, our culture is essentially pagan in its actions. Ozzy is a part of that, and I have no problem criticizing ANYTHING on t.v. particularly MTV or the type of reality show which is the Osbornes. Are these people we should point out are the models? Should our kids be watching this guy and say what a success!!! Although from what I have seen of the show Ozzy is a walking anti-drug ad, the guys sounds half brain dead, his brain is half gone. So I think it is okay to criticize that, but where does it cross the line into judgementalism? It is a hard line. I guess I would error on the side of not judging. What I mean is given two choices, to judge when judgement may be called for, or to judge when it is not called for, which is the most dangerous mistake to make for our souls? I think it is safer for our souls to remain silent when judgement may be called for, than it is to judge others when we should not be. It is one reason I am glad I am not a pastor or a deacon who are charged with instituting church discipline. Talk about coming full circle in one post. in agreement with you.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jckduboise Posted July 12, 2006 Share Posted July 12, 2006 Actually Ozzy is a believer in Christ. He rededicated his life right after 9/11 He's going through changes? LOL yeah I guess you would call it that. Think about it some are saved and just don't let it show. I was that way for a looooooooooooooong time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Durnan Posted July 12, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 121 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,782 Content Per Day: 0.36 Reputation: 49 Days Won: 1 Joined: 06/14/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted July 12, 2006 Ozzy Osburne, eh, what? Let the Apostle Paul speak: "If any man be in Christ Jesus, he is a new creation; old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new." (2 Cor. 5:17). http://arthurdurnan.freeyellow.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smalcald Posted July 12, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 5,258 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 42 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/16/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/22/1960 Share Posted July 12, 2006 Right, so if Ozzy is claiming he is a Christian, than we should be even more severe in pointing out that he is not showing that faith in any way, and in fact because he is a public figure and intentionally so, it is even more important that we point out that how he acts is not in anyway following Christ if indeed his actions are not showing any evidence of salvation. I don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Swordsman_02 Posted July 12, 2006 Share Posted July 12, 2006 (edited) In a recent thread I came across this statement by a believer which I found absurd. Ozzy seems like a very nice guy---I 'd love to meet him !.................I'd be willing to wager...that his funeral showings, will be larger than the pope himself......I've actually felt the goosebumps from his music......and yano.....all that mention of the devil.....you should acctually "read" the lyrics to "war pigs"...they're actually quite God glorifying. "oh lord yea!" I think he...and not unlike many before /after him.....enjoy "shocking" the christians.Having a desire to shed a better "Light" on the matter I wanted to supply some other lyric snippets to Mr. Osbourne's "glorifying" music for your review... From"Denial" You are my only daughter, I guess I made you twice You look inside my other, he'll give you bad advice I will tell you I'm OK, but deep inside I'm afraid I don't drink holy water, I'm not a son of Christ I ain't no black messiah, and I don't load my dice You can tell me you're all right, but why you so afraid? You're in denial, you never will believe it's you Denial, you always hide behind the truth You'll never believe it, you never believe it's you I don't think I'm amazing. In fact I'm quite insane To live inside my bucket, with all my plastic chains People tell me every time, I look at the wron all right From N.I.B. Now I have you with me under my power Our love grows stronger now with every hour Look into my eyes you'll see who I am My name is Lucifer please take my hand Follow me now and you will not regret Leaving the life you led before we met You are the first to have this love of mine Forever with me 'till the end of time Your love for me has just got to be real Before you know the way I'm going to feel I'm going to feel I'm going to feel Now I have you with me under my power Our love grows stronger now with every hour Look into my eyes you'll see who I am My name is Lucifer please take my hand Oh yeah, and the ever "glorifying" War Pigs, which I've included Ozzy's original lyrics. Walpurgis (Walpurgis is the original name of this song - and it had totally different lyrics back then, but the same music. The only place where this version of the song is (legally) available is on the Ozzy "Ozzman Cometh" Greatest Hits CD.) Witches gather at black masses Bodies burning in red ashes On the hill the church in ruin Is the scene of evil doings It's a place for all bad sinners Watch them eating dead rats' innards I guess it's the same whereever you may go Oh Lord yeah Carry banners which denounce the lord See me rocking in my grave See them anoint my head with dead rat's blood See them stick the stake through me Oh Don't hold me back cause I've just gotta go They've got a hold of my soul now Lords got my brain instinct with blood obscene Look in my eyes I'm there enough Yeah On the scene a priest appears Sinners falling at his knees Satan sends out funeral pyre Casts the priest into the fire It's the place for all bad sinners Watch them eating dead rats' innards I guess it's the same whereever you may go Oh lord yeah So how is this disgusting lyric considered "God glorifying"??? That is NOT God glorifying. And did someone say this was AC/DC? I had no clue they were like this. Edited July 12, 2006 by Swordsman_02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WayneB Posted July 12, 2006 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 4 Topic Count: 232 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 7,261 Content Per Day: 0.96 Reputation: 79 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/30/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/19/1959 Share Posted July 12, 2006 ..just for the record and tenderly spoken..I am a sister..smiles For some reason, I thought your name was Jack. I never claimed to be the sharpest knife in the drawer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WayneB Posted July 12, 2006 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 4 Topic Count: 232 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 7,261 Content Per Day: 0.96 Reputation: 79 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/30/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/19/1959 Share Posted July 12, 2006 ..just for the record and tenderly spoken..I am a sister..smiles For some reason, I thought your name was Jack. I never claimed to be the sharpest knife in the drawer. Jack + ie Now I get it! Jack with an "ie". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyRaven Posted July 12, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,981 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/22/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/20/1964 Share Posted July 12, 2006 Actually Ozzy is a believer in Christ. He rededicated his life right after 9/11 He's going through changes? LOL yeah I guess you would call it that. Think about it some are saved and just don't let it show. I was that way for a looooooooooooooong time! Like I said, my friend, other than the language, did absolutely nothing spiritually visible for over 3 years. I guess he was "learning". I work that way as well, but not on so long of cycles. I learn with very little practical application for a while, then I spend some time where my focus is on "resting" and then suddenly changes start happening as God applies the knowledge to the my spirit and my spirit makes the changes. I haven't seen anything about Ozzy for a few years, I would have no idea if anythng changed since I last watched the show. I hope that he did rededicate/come to Christ. I think he'd make some really interesting praise music in eternity, don't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyRaven Posted July 12, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,981 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/22/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/20/1964 Share Posted July 12, 2006 Well it depends on what and how we judge and why. So it is not simple. I agree we are not to judge the state of someone's eternal soul, we also are not to judge those on the outside of the faith according to Paul. But we are indeed to judge those on the inside according to Paul. I think Lady Raven was simply saying that Osborne is not a Christian and I agree with her, which is an important thing to say if he or anybody else is claiming he is a Christian. Not for the sake of judgement of ozzy, but for the sake of those who are not yet believers. We live in a crude, hedonistic culture, if we take away the veneer of some outward shows of Christian belief, our culture is essentially pagan in its actions. Ozzy is a part of that, and I have no problem criticizing ANYTHING on t.v. particularly MTV or the type of reality show which is the Osbornes. Are these people we should point out are the models? Should our kids be watching this guy and say what a success!!! Although from what I have seen of the show Ozzy is a walking anti-drug ad, the guys sounds half brain dead, his brain is half gone. So I think it is okay to criticize that, but where does it cross the line into judgementalism? It is a hard line. I guess I would error on the side of not judging. What I mean is given two choices, to judge when judgement may be called for, or to judge when it is not called for, which is the most dangerous mistake to make for our souls? I think it is safer for our souls to remain silent when judgement may be called for, than it is to judge others when we should not be. It is one reason I am glad I am not a pastor or a deacon who are charged with instituting church discipline. Talk about coming full circle in one post. in agreement with you.. Actually, to be more accurate, I was saying that based on the evidence presented on the show, I saw nothing which led me to believe he was...at the time the show was taped. I allowed for the possibility that he was in some sort of latent stage, and I do allow for things which might have happened since the taping of that show. I still do periodically pray for him also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamie Posted July 12, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 104 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,026 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 11 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/13/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted July 12, 2006 micen2, I like the 'realness' in your personality. But do a study on the holiness of God. Ozzie's not there brother, not at all. Holiness is something we know so little about these days. You're right....mmmm....didn't think of that. You and i were selected by God because we were holy...................sorry bro...I forgot. My bad. . . . . salvation is available to all men.............................. all. It is not God's will that any should perish.....any. You completely missed the point. Holiness is what we, meaning (all) of us strive for or we are only kidding ourselves. "Holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord." - Hebrews 12:14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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