Does God Follow the Ten Commandments?

[SoulGrind]

Grace to you,

The Commandments aren't for God, they are for you.

They are a measure of Gods Righteousness and only He can live up to them.

How about you?

Can you measure up to the Righteousness of God?

Peace,

Dave

First of all, I don't know that he does live up to those standards. He has to kill his own creations. He is perfect but has to do that?

I am certainly aware of my own limitations as a human being. One of those many limitations is understanding the God that is written in the Bible. He is an imcomprehensible character.

My question to you: Do you read the Bible objectively or from the slant that you had "better believe it" or you will burn in hell?

We are actually told to read it objectivly because faith with out reason or purpose is blind. This is another form of "testing the spirits".

Anybody can write a book and say "Look, I am God! Do what I say!"

But only God can write a book that says "Look, I am God! Test the spirits and know that I am God".

(These are not Biblical quotes - just examples from my feable human mind)

[sylvan3]

In order to understand that passage correctly, you would need to correlate it wih all of Jesus' other statements regarding answered prayer (for example see Matthew 6:10) and other places where it says we must pray according to His name (or character). Single passages do not a correct understanding make

This response, saying that the passage is taken out of context, is very common when apologetics come face to face with passages that contravene reality.

This passage, or even just the one sentence, stands on its own. It says, "Therefore I tell you, all that you ask for in prayer, believe that you will receive it and it shall be yours". I don't see where it needs any other statement to facilitate its interpretation.

In my opinion, what Jesus is saying doesn't happen. If you say that it does happen and that prayers are answered, I would suggest that whatever good things happen have occurred because of the normal laws of probability--someone might just as easily say that a good luck charm caused the good thing to happen. However, I would be extremely confident in saying that "all" prayers are not answered--and it isn't just because people don't believe that it will happen.

You can decide for yourself whether or not what I say has merit.

[Matthitjah]

Grace to you,

Sylvan,

Do you personally measure up to the Righteousness of God?

Peace,

Dave

[EricH]

In order to understand that passage correctly, you would need to correlate it wih all of Jesus' other statements regarding answered prayer (for example see Matthew 6:10) and other places where it says we must pray according to His name (or character). Single passages do not a correct understanding make

This response, saying that the passage is taken out of context, is very common when apologetics come face to face with passages that contravene reality.

This passage, or even just the one sentence, stands on its own. It says, "Therefore I tell you, all that you ask for in prayer, believe that you will receive it and it shall be yours". I don't see where it needs any other statement to facilitate its interpretation.

In my opinion, what Jesus is saying doesn't happen. If you say that it does happen and that prayers are answered, I would suggest that whatever good things happen have occurred because of the normal laws of probability--someone might just as easily say that a good luck charm caused the good thing to happen. However, I would be extremely confident in saying that "all" prayers are not answered--and it isn't just because people don't believe that it will happen.

You can decide for yourself whether or not what I say has merit.

It seems to me that you are attempting to treat the Bible differently than we would any other piece of instructive literature. For us to understand what any one believes about a certain topic, you must look at everthing they say about that topic to get a full comprehension.

People say things in all kinds of contexts and situations. Good interpretation requires that we take all of this into account when arriving at conclusions regarding meaning. I have several books on interpretation of secular literature that say exactly that. It is not an apologetics issue, it is a text-linguitics issue.

[whiteeagele0]

He dous not have to follow the ten commandments becuase he is god he is sinless he has to follow the ten commandments or he is not god god is sin less

[Arialia]

...

Could you please type like a human? It's proper courtesy on forums to type in sentences with punctuation.

[SoulGrind]

Could you please type like a human? It's proper courtesy on forums to type in sentences with punctuation.

AT LEAST SHE DIDN'T USE ALL CAPS!

Sorry - just had too...

[sylvan3]

The answer to this is not really as difficult as it may seem. First of all, I agree that God gave the commandments for his creation to follow, not for himself. If you went back to the garden when he created man, he gave one commandment. He said Adam was not to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. Obviously, God could not break this commandment, and it was only given to see if man would obey him. Even though the commandments wouldn't logically relate to him, it is my opinion that God never broke any of them. Let's break them down and I will show you why.

1 THOU SHALT HAVE NO OTHER GODS BEFORE ME. EXODUS 20:3 Obviously God never put any gods above him.

2 THOU SHALT NOT MAKE UNTO THEE ANY GRAVEN IMAGE. EXODUS 20:4 Again, God never broke this commandment.

3 THOU SHALT NOT TAKE THE NAME OF THE LORD THY GOD IN VAIN. EXODUS 20:7 Yet again, God did not break this commandment.

4 REMEMBER THE SABBATH DAY, TO KEEP IT HOLY. EXODUS 20:8 God is the one that rested on the seventh day of creation in the first place, so he didn't break this commandment.

5 HONOUR THY FATHER AND THY MOTHER. EXODUS 20:12 God has no Father or Mother so he never broke this commandment.

6 THOU SHALT NOT KILL. EXODUS 20:13 This seems to be the commandment you are accusing God of breaking, however I would argue he never broke this one either. In order to interpret scripture, or any law for that matter, one must figure out the intent of the author of a law. Even our court system does that when interpreting the intent of the legislature. It is obvious that when God told us not to kill, the meaning was that we as individuals were not to be vigilantees and go about murdering innocent people. Why is this obvious? Because in the same law, God gave a death penalty for many crimes and sent the children of Israel into battle. What this tells me is that the prohibition on murder has nothing to do with putting criminals to death or killing in the time of war. God's Word also says the wages (penalty) for sin is death. When we sin, according to God's own law, we deserve to die and it is only by his mercy we are not all struck dead immediately after we violate his standard of holiness. God has never killed an innocent person, since nobody has lived their entire life without violating his law with one exception which I will get to shortly.

7 THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTERY. EXODUS 20:14 He never broke this law.

8 THOU SHALT NOT STEAL. EXODUS 20:15 He owns everything so he cannot steal.

9 THOU SHALT NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS AGAINST THY NEIGHBOUR. EXODUS 20:16 He never broken this commandment.

10 THOU SHALT NOT COVET THY NEIGHBOR'S POSSESSIONS. EXODUS 20:17 He never broke this commandment.

When you get down to it, there is only one commandment you have accused God of violating and when taken in it's proper context, it is obvious he never broke any of them. He is not guilty. Now God could not break these commandments as God because in reality they never applied to him but to man. Since that was the case, God became man in the form of Jesus Christ and while he lived on this earth, he never broke any of the commandments. There have been some who have accused him of breaking the law and even rebuking the religious teachers for being strict adherents to it, but they are incorrect. If one reads the sermon on the mount closely, they will see that what Jesus did was clarify the meaning of the laws. He was the author so he knew what they really meant. It would be like having the writers of our Constitution coming back and rebuking the Supreme Court justices for perverting their original intent (would that they could).

1 Peter 2:21,22

21 For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps:

22 Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth.

As God, he couldn't break his commandments. As man, he didn't break his commandments. Case dismissed.

By the way, thank you for doing one thing. I appreciate the fact you acknowledge God had people killed. By your own admission, in order for that to be true, God must be real. I am glad you have finally come to see the truth on that. Perhaps now, we can move on to other things.

I guess you are proud of this God?

(Ezekiel 9:5-7 NLT)

"Then I heard the LORD say to the other men, "Follow him through the city and kill everyone whose forehead is not marked. Show no mercy; have no pity! Kill them all

[SoulGrind]

OK, that would mean that he can also lie--that would fall under the category of "doing whatever he wishes with his creation". If killing children without mercy doesn't seem to bother you, I would suggest that it is far easier to lie than it is to kill. I am quite sure that the God you conceptualize would do an EXCELLENT job of it. Don't forget, the best liars are the ones who say they don't lie.

Ah but you see, in order to lie, one cannot be righteous and holy. That would be a contradiction.

And as you have been told, time and time again, God abhors sin, because sin is the exact opposite of all that is righteous and holy.

Therefore, God cannot lie - for this would negate His righteousness and holiness.

Furthermore, as we have seen, since God is righteous and holy, and therefore just, God exercised His right to invoke justice on a sinful nation by killing them off. This meant EVERYONE of that nation.

In order to remove the "cancer" known as sin, it all had to be removed. It is unfortunate that it involved women and children, but it was necessary - for any piece of the "cancer" that might have been left would have the opportunity to spread and infect once again.

Also remember, these events were pre-Christ. These people were under a different covenant than the people of the New Testament (you and me). For the people of the Old Testament, the proper atonement for sin was through a blood offering at the altar.

Since these nations did not repent of sin through the appropriate offerings as demanded by God, and continued in their sinful ways, God's patience grew thin of their sinful nature and made a final judgment call.

It's not like these people did not have a clue or no warning. Levitical law was paramount of the day, just as police officers and court rooms are today. They had their chance to redeem themselves in the eyes of God.

However, all these things changed when Christ came on the scene and He became the final, perfect atonement for all mankind.

The sacrificial offerings at the altar are no longer needed and no further "genocide" of sinful nations on behalf of God is required until the final judgment day.

This affords all post-Christ mankind more opportunities to become righteous and follow God than ever before.

But this coin is two-sided - it also allows post-Christ mankind to denounce God as well without fear of retribution until the final judgement day.

You might say, since Christ became the final atonement for mankind, that God has "appreared" to become more lenient until judgment day. BUT DON'T BE FOOLED BY THIS. God is biding His time (for now).

Additionally, do not forget that God also said that these two factions would be separated in the end. The holy and the righteous, who have repented and accepted the final atonement of God will receive ever lasting life in Heaven.

And those who deny God and choose the way of sin, will receive the same fate as those sinful nations of the Old Testament - they shall pay for their sins through the shedding of their blood and spend eternity in Hell.

Once again, God will remove the "cancer" known as sin. However, this will be the last time, and it will be permanent.

So stop crying, "FOUL! NO FAIR!" because God has given everyone plenty of opportunities to choose Him - and that my friend is a very fair shake on God's part.

Cheers,

Edited July 13, 2006 by SoulGrind

[dakota190]

In order to understand that passage correctly, you would need to correlate it wih all of Jesus' other statements regarding answered prayer (for example see Matthew 6:10) and other places where it says we must pray according to His name (or character). Single passages do not a correct understanding make

This response, saying that the passage is taken out of context, is very common when apologetics come face to face with passages that contravene reality.

This passage, or even just the one sentence, stands on its own. It says, "Therefore I tell you, all that you ask for in prayer, believe that you will receive it and it shall be yours". I don't see where it needs any other statement to facilitate its interpretation.

In my opinion, what Jesus is saying doesn't happen. If you say that it does happen and that prayers are answered, I would suggest that whatever good things happen have occurred because of the normal laws of probability--someone might just as easily say that a good luck charm caused the good thing to happen. However, I would be extremely confident in saying that "all" prayers are not answered--and it isn't just because people don't believe that it will happen.

You can decide for yourself whether or not what I say has merit.

herein lies the problem, as you stated above, you don't see. instead of coming here and trying to argue apologetics, you need to try to see, first. if you want to come here and seriously ask questions so you can understand and begin to see, we'll be glad to accomodate you. for you to say, that a sentence in the bible, stands on its' own. shows a lack of knowledge. some christians try this, especially the tv evangelists, which i personally have a lot of disagreements with. (which by the way, don't judge God or christians by that lot, you see on tv.) taking just one verse and trying to pass it off as a proof text, so you can justify your opinion, doesn't work with those that truly study the bible. you can't take a verse out of context and assign a defination of your own. it won't get you where you are trying to go. you can't change scripture and you can't change God, and you won't change an educated, dedicated christian. as for whether prayers are answered or not, they are, and as a non-believer, you are not in a position to determine whether they are or not. i have had many prayers answered, sometimes, the answer is not what i wanted, but it was answered. sometimes, often actually, the answer does not come back as quickly as i would like. but prayers are always answered. now i would believe, if someone prays an improper prayer, either it is no, or it may go unanswered. you can't pray for silly things or selfish things. that is improper. prayer is another thing you pass judgement on without, seeing or understanding what it is you are denying.

as a non-believer, there are many things you will not see, or understand, your eyes are closed to the miracles and grace of God. i am going to quote you a verse, it is in context, and i am giving you the chapter and verse, so you can read it yourself. Romans, ch;3 v-3-4, For what if some did not believe? will their unbelief make the faithfulness of God without effect? certainly not! indeed , let God be true but every man a liar. as it is written; "that you may be justified in your words, and may overcome when you are judged."

one other thing, you claim a law of probability, yet you reject the law of God. you reject the grace of God. as we try to explaing the laws and grace of God to you, please, explain the LAW of probability. lastly, i would be careful of your faith in your "extreme confidence" because your stance, has not merit.

a reminder, don't gather your information on what the bible says from the tv, or believe what you hear. check it out, to be sure. i suggest you check it through the bible, or with a knowledgeable person of God. if you understood, what you are trying to shoot down, you'd know better. there are very few on tv that teach the true gospel, and if you don't know the gospel, you will be led down a false path.

one last thing. to understand what a verse means, even if that verse satisfies you that you understand what it means. if you don't have any knowledge of other verses and books of the bible, but rather your contention is based only on that one verse you stumbled on or were led to by a friend of like mind, don't feel so extremely confident in yourself. your knowledge would not be sufficient to argue your lone point. it may be enough for your opinion, but no more than that.

as to apologetics and your statements that contravene reality. if i were you, i wouldn't rest there either. you are kicking against the goads, until you understand the realities of the visible and invisible. what is real, and what is not.

God Bless!!