redeemed098 Posted August 13, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 489 Content Per Day: 0.07 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/19/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/12/1964 Share Posted August 13, 2006 FC... Don't let bitterness from your discipline keep you from assembling with other believers. Seek them out, asking God to direct you. He will do that, as He is interested in your healing. Be faithful as is required. If you were disciplined because of unfaithful attendance in ministry, that is their prerogative to do so. In my church, if one is in ministry such as worship, attendance is very high on the list of importance. One could be set aside in their ministry for such a thing as spotty attendance...it reveals a heart issue. Being faithful is good! Learn and move on. Good Word... Regards, Ben. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redeemed098 Posted August 13, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 489 Content Per Day: 0.07 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/19/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/12/1964 Share Posted August 13, 2006 Paul DID say to not forsake the assembling of yourselves together, which runs the gamut of corporate prayer, worship, the giving AND receiving of instruction in the Word of God, and the giving and receiving of fellowship, encouragement and blessing. Everything we need! Of course it doesn't have to happen in a building or a house, but buildings are a good idea if it rains! Blessings! It doesn't HAVE to happen with any of those things. It CAN happen with them. My comments are not about whether or not fellowship happens in a building or outdoors, though outdoors is good. It's about whether it has to happen in an instutional body, whether it HAS to involve sitting and listening to a sermon, whether it HAS to involve singing hymns, etc. Every "church" everywhere follows the same essential model with just variations of flavor. They have governing bodies. They have sermons. They have people sitting in mass. They have business meetings behind the scenes. They collect offerings to support their organizational structure. They have employees. They have doctrinal statements and governing documents. Almost every single "church" in the world follows that corporate model like a bunch of lemmings. And Paul never commanded either fellowship or that particular model of fellowship. And yet people will judge your spirituality by whether or not your a member of one of those organizations. David, With all that you have said, I have to say that my conclusion leads me to believe that you do not attend a church...Am I correct in reaching this conclusion..? I have read all that you have said and I'm only left with one question....If you are NOT attending a church or even plan on attending a church in the future, then why do you feel the need to defend this...?? Did you attend a church at all in your life as a Christian...? What happened to make you feel the way you do now..? Maybe the answer lies in that...!! Regards, Ben. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redeemed098 Posted August 13, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 489 Content Per Day: 0.07 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/19/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/12/1964 Share Posted August 13, 2006 David Haggith, In trying to argue your points you have only succeeded in revealing yourself to BE the very essence of what you are protesting about. In trying to argue against religion, you have only shown yourself to be exactly THAT.. Religious... You have also shown yourself to be quite UNteachable... I'm not saying this to be rude...Im simply revealing to you that the very thing you profess to hate, is the very thing that you ARE yourself...Often we are the LAST to see our own issues..I hope you wont find these words offensive in any way. I seek only to speak the truth in Love to you. "Better open rebuke than hidden love." What good is Love if I hide it David...? It isnt nice to think, but sometimes we can be Pharisees ourselves and not even KNOW it...Jesus proved that quite well I think. Food for thought.. Regards, Ben. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redeemed098 Posted August 13, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 489 Content Per Day: 0.07 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/19/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/12/1964 Share Posted August 13, 2006 Obey your leaders and submit to their authority. They keep watch over you as men who must give an account. Obey them so that their work will be a joy, NOT a burden, for that would be of NO advantage to YOU. (Hebrews 13:17) Who are these men who must give an account and who are they accountable TO..? Leaders who are accountable to GOD for the people he has been given charge over. And if there is no church, then what are the churches of Corinth, and Galatia, and Thessalonica, and Colosse, and Ephesus, and Philippi. Philippi itself is written," To all the saints in Christ Jesus at Philippi together with all the overseers and deacons. This is clearly a gathering place. As were the other churches. Why else would there be overseers and deacons and elders....Timothy himself was prophesied over and had hands laid on him concerning the fulfillment of his ministry as a pastor. He had people UNDER him. He was told to warn them against heresy and false teaching and to rebuke them. Of course the church is a gathering place. It may be just a house or a building but it is still a gathering place where people meet. Where two or more are gathered, it is written, "there am I in the midst." A body of believers can be TWO or more...Simply because nothing is validated without the witness of TWO or more. You cannot then CLEARLY be a "body", on your OWN.... Regards, Ben. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firehill Posted August 13, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 11 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,980 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/17/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted August 13, 2006 Paul DID say to not forsake the assembling of yourselves together, which runs the gamut of corporate prayer, worship, the giving AND receiving of instruction in the Word of God, and the giving and receiving of fellowship, encouragement and blessing. Everything we need! Of course it doesn't have to happen in a building or a house, but buildings are a good idea if it rains! Blessings! It doesn't HAVE to happen with any of those things. It CAN happen with them. My comments are not about whether or not fellowship happens in a building or outdoors, though outdoors is good. It's about whether it has to happen in an instutional body, whether it HAS to involve sitting and listening to a sermon, whether it HAS to involve singing hymns, etc. Every "church" everywhere follows the same essential model with just variations of flavor. They have governing bodies. They have sermons. They have people sitting in mass. They have business meetings behind the scenes. They collect offerings to support their organizational structure. They have employees. They have doctrinal statements and governing documents. Almost every single "church" in the world follows that corporate model like a bunch of lemmings. And Paul never commanded either fellowship or that particular model of fellowship. And yet people will judge your spirituality by whether or not your a member of one of those organizations. David, With all that you have said, I have to say that my conclusion leads me to believe that you do not attend a church...Am I correct in reaching this conclusion..? I have read all that you have said and I'm only left with one question....If you are NOT attending a church or even plan on attending a church in the future, then why do you feel the need to defend this...?? Did you attend a church at all in your life as a Christian...? What happened to make you feel the way you do now..? Maybe the answer lies in that...!! Regards, Ben. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firehill Posted August 13, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 11 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,980 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/17/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted August 13, 2006 Of course the church is a gathering place. It may be just a house or a building but it is still a gathering place where people meet. Where two or more are gathered, it is written, "there am I in the midst." A body of believers can be TWO or more...Simply because nothing is validated without the witness of TWO or more. You cannot then CLEARLY be a "body", on your OWN.... Regards, Ben. He's married Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David H. Posted August 13, 2006 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 201 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/09/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted August 13, 2006 (edited) You have also shown yourself to be quite UNteachable.... I'm not saying this to be rude...Im simply revealing to you that the very thing you profess to hate, is the very thing that you ARE yourself. While I have said that I will not contribute any more to the debate because I rest my case and don't think there is any point in badgering the issue any further, I will respond to your statment and following question, Ben, as being outside the actual debate: In what way am I any more unteachabel than any of those, like yourself, who have voiced equally strident opinions here? Has any one of them changed his or her view to what I have been saying? Have you? Or am I unteachable only because I have not changed to your way of thinking? I seek only to speak the truth in Love to you. Excluding completely the way some have written to me, because I knew my direct approach would bring a strong reponse, I did not find your words to not-so"FailedChristian" to be at all loving, Ben. Be careful that you are not simply couching your words in love phrases, while saying things that are not really too kind. As for my current church state, you said you had read "every word I had written," which is why Firehill is rolling on the floor laughing. I already wrote you a clear and fairly extensive answer to your question. To give you the benefit of kindness, perhaps you had just not read that far through the forum, and thought you had read to the end. I was completely open and specific about my church experience without anyone asking. So, there is no mystery there. You can go back and check your own assumptions for accuracy regarding my church state by reading the two posts I made on that subject. (Without extending you that kindness, I'd have to think that maybe you had not changed to my point of view because you have given my writings so much careful attention as to skip over entire pages.) Let me make it easy for you. They are my last two posts on page 11: http://www.worthyboards.com/index.php?show...4437&st=100 Edited August 13, 2006 by David Haggith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redeemed098 Posted August 14, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 489 Content Per Day: 0.07 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/19/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/12/1964 Share Posted August 14, 2006 Sorry David, I must confess that when it comes to the reeeealy long posts my eyes tend to just gloss over them. I am pleased that firehill was able to have a laugh at my expense...Sometimes we do and say stupid things that are derserving of being mocked. My comments to not so "failed Christian" were probably judgemental and again I have already posted an apology for them. Im not perfect you know........No even close....I get a little aggressive sometimes....Sorry..! I cant promise it wont happen again, but Ill do my best.. Sometimes my words arent true to what Im feeling, you are right and I can disguise them pretty well. When all is said and done I guess Im just a man whos on the road to glory but still has a very long way to go.. Small word of advice though...Keep it short....Long posts can lose peoples attention. Regards, Ben. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David H. Posted August 14, 2006 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 201 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/09/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted August 14, 2006 Small word of advice though...Keep it short....Long posts can lose peoples attention. Well spoken, as is all of the above. God's blessing upon you, David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 15, 2006 Share Posted August 15, 2006 Dear Failed Christian You are the Church! You just need to fellowship with other Churches, I mean Christians! From the posts I see here, you seen to be doing A-OK in that department! I believe You can even drop an offering into Worthy's collection plate to complete the normal church thing. :-) You can not fail as a Christian. You are God's workmanship and He does not fail. You and I are unworthy But He Is Worthy! You and I maybe unfaithful But He is Faithful! As I understand it, there is But one law..... 'The law of faith" As I understand it, there is But one commandment.... "Abide in Me" Dear Lord Hold my brother tight in Your Hands Pour Your Holy Spirit into him and upon him Protect his family and his home Cause his heart to continuously sing a love song to You Light up his spirit with Your Holy Fire! Glorify Your Holy Name in his life. In Jesus Love, Your Joe PS: Please consider giving us a name to use instead of Failed Christian. It hurts my teeth every time I type it! You can use Joe if you want, it works OK for me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts