Utah Gunman was Bosnian Muslim Refugee

[Oh Hamburgers!]

Hamburgers:

Anyway, the UN declares a major conflict as that which involves 1,000 deaths a year or more or holds the potential to expload into such a war at any time.........so let's look at the major conflicts around the world:

Congo War - No Muslims involved

Kashmir - Pakistan, a muslim nation, attempting to control land which is claimed by a Hindu nation (No major Muslim condemnation)

Iraq - Muslim led revolt that is killing US soldiers as well as Iraqi citizens (No major Muslim condemnation)

Lebanon - Muslim terrorist group launched rockets into Israel (No major Muslim condemnation)

Indonesia - Many violent uprisings and threats of civil war caused by Muslim clerics (No major Muslim condemnation)

Egypt - Thread of uprising from Muslim leaders (No major Muslim condemnation)

Ivory Coast - Muslims in the north fighting for control of the entire nation (No major Muslim condemnation)

Nepal - No Muslims involved

Chechnya - Muslims attempting to "free" themselves from Russian rule (No major Muslim condemnation)

Afganistan - Muslims in the southern region attempting to impose a strict religious government (No major Muslim condemnation)

Somolia - Muslims battle amongst other Muslim warlords (No major Muslim condemnation)

Columbia - No Muslims involved

Sudan - Muslims attempting to take control of the government, putting many Christians and non-Muslims to the machete (No major Muslim condemnation)

Uganda - Christian extremists attempting to overthrow government (Strong Christian condemnation to these attacks)

Thailand - Muslim rebels attempting to overthrow government

Of all the major conflicts occuring right now (40), 28 are either in Muslim nations or being cause by Muslims. If Islam is a religion of peace, why do they account for almost 70% of the conflicts occuring in the world? Do you realize that if it were not for Islam, the biggest conflicts facing us would be North Korea and Columbia....we would eradicate 70% of the world's conflicts if it were not for Islam.

So, my question, once again, is if Islam is a religion of peace, why do they account for 70% of the wars going on presently?

From http://www.worthyboards.com/index.php?show...iolent&st=0

The following come from a survey in 2002 and represent countries - only muslims were asked. The question was "is suicide bombing in 'defense' (as in, way of life, western ideas, etc) of Islam justified?"

Lebanon - 73% think that it is

Ivory Coast - 56%

Nigeria - 47% (45% said no)

Bangladesh - 44%

Jordan - 43%

http://people-press.org/reports/disp...3?ReportID=165

It goes on, and the number stays in the 30-40% range. Maybe it is an overstatement to say a majority of Muslims worldwide believe in terrorism, but to say it is a fringe is a gross mistatement (saying a majority support is closer to the truth). As seen, there are over 1 billion Muslims in the world. I believe it is this article that shows 25% of English Muslims believe terrorism is justified as well. Even in "Palestine" we see that 73% of Muslims support terrorist attacks against the United States. The fact is, even in Western nations, the range of support for suicide bombers is a quarter or above of the Muslim population. Even if we cannot say with authority that a majority of Muslims worlwide believe in killing Westerners, we can say that a good portion (1/3 to even a half) do believe it is justified.

A.K., thank you, that is great information. I will admit, I am not nearly as up to date on current events as I would wish; there are a lot of conflicts you brought up that I didn't even know existed today. I would like to start by addressing the major conflicts.

One of the hardest things to do is to define what makes something a religious conflict, between different religions, and what makes something a political conflict, between different nation states. There are some conflicts that are purely religion based, and there are some conflicts that are originally politically based, but have some religious undertones involved with them. Now, there are many countries in this world that have a single dominant religion associated with them, the middle east, india and southeast asia being examples of dominantly Islamic regions, and the americas and much of west/northwest europe being dominantly Christian regions. The difficulty comes in determining what types of conflicts arise from these countries. For example, the US is estimated to have a 79-84% Christian population, yet I would consider our Afghanistan/Iraq/Iran?? conflicts to be politically oriented; I don't think of these wars being 'religious conflicts', even if the vast majority of the US is Christian. We attacked these countries in order to protect our political assets, we did not attack because we felt the 'muslim threat needed to be cleansed' or anything like that. This same idea would need to be applied in determining if these Islamic states are acting through religious, or political means.

I'm going to make a fool out of myself in this part, so feel free to correct me if my assumptions are incorrect.

-Iraq is most certaintly being contested by muslims primarily, but the responce is not so much religiously influenced as it is politically influenced; the Iraqi rebels don't want the US to occupy their land, not just because we are Christian, but because they don't care for what we stand for as a country. We occupied their country through military force, military resistance is to be expected, and coming from a country in which 97% of the population is muslim, we can naturally expect the majority of the rebels are muslim.

-Lebanon is a pretty good example of a religious feud; I agree with you here that religion is one of the main reasons Israel is being attacked. Same with Afghanistan, it was a religious rule that was fairly violent and radical. Not much to argue there.

-Sudan is a pretty split country, and religion definitly plays a roll there, but the dispute is primarily a political one, one about state divisions and breaking off. I was reading a bit from an article here ( http://www.ockenden.org.uk/index.asp?id=793 ) about the origins of the conflict. Incidentally, the conflict is usually thought to be between muslims and christians. This one might be split 50/50

-In Thailand, there are religious undertones to the muslim rebellions, but the essential reasoning behind it is once again political; the muslims of the south have been treated poorly, and are looking for change and freedom from oppression. In fact, it seems that the muslims of this region are the ones being put on the defensive and being persocuted for the most part. I was reading a bit from an article here ( http://www.wsws.org/articles/2004/nov2004/thai-n26.shtml )

-Chechnya is also mostly about political issues, there isn't a 'Jihad' against Russia, it is for poltical means.

-Somolia may be a battle between muslim warlords, but that almost certaintly means it is a political dispute, as the majority of the populations are primarily muslim.

There are more that you brought up, but my knowledge of the conflicts is very limited, and I'm sure you are getting the general idea.

My point is, if you associate all of these conflicts with the muslim religion primarily, then you would have to do the same thing in other conflicts in history. I mean, if we are going to use this set of criteria, the US civil war was a christian country spilit in two fighting each other, the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan was an invasion of a christian country with the objective of overthrowing muslim rule, and colonization of southamerica, the phillipenes, and parts of africa were christian based actions with the intent of conversion by sword. Througout history political states have done terrible things to other states with political intent, with religion being a secondary objective by missionaries. Through these political encounters came the conquering state's culture, religion included. Yet to claim these were religious agendas at the forefront would be untrue. Spain, Portugal, and many other countries from the 14th to 19th centuries were trying to claim as much land as possible, and these countries were primarilly christian, but we do not consider these colonizing efforts to be christianity violently sweeping across the globe.

There is a double-standard we impose onto many states today, and in order to see clearly, we need to recognize that not every conflict that involves religious players is a religious conflict.

In response to your suicide bombing poll question, I find it quite an interesting statistic, but personally would like to learn more about the specifics of the question. I mean, if you would pose the exact same question with Christianity in America, I'm sure you would get extremely low results, but what if you made it to appeal much more to our country? Suppose there was a poll question that asked Christians if they would be willing to use force and/or join the military in defense of our way of life / against non-christian ideals ? I would be willing to bet there would be a good chunk of Americans that would say that they would be willing to use force to defend their ideals. It all depends on how you look it.

To Glory:

Oh Hamburgers, you have a good point about most perpetrators not being defined, in the media, by their religion. The only hole in that blanket is the fact that Islam is NOT a religion; it is a murderous, barbaric, hate producing cult. All muslims have a duty to spread the pox of Islam by the sword and to kill infidels; i.e., Christians, Jews, Hindus, etc. They are followers of Satan. Please read even a condensed version of the Qu'ran and you will understand what we are up against.

Well, Islam is defined as a world religion, even if you think of it as a cult It is practiced by ~1.4/1.5 billion people in our world today, second only to Christianity. Even though you may view it as a cult, it is widely considered to be a religion!

Let me know if you have any issues with my post; I'm gonna get some sleep!

[Leonard]

OK boys and girls! You've asked for it, and I guess it's time to post it again: The world famous TERRORISM QUIZ.

See if you can spot something the government and the Left seems not to have noticed:

TERRORISM QUIZ

PLEASE SELECT THE ONE ANSWER YOU FEEL IS BEST FOR EACH QUESTION

1). In August, 1982 a bomb exploded at JFK airport, killing 1 person and injuring several. Was the perpetrator: A: A black American mother of 4, B: Retired Senator Sam Rayburn, C: Bugs Bunny, D: A male, radical Moslem between 15 and 45 years of age.

2). In April 1983 a car bomb exploded at the US embassy in Beirut, killing 63 persons. Was the perpetrator: A: Wily E. Coyote, B: Pop star Madonna,

C: Goldilocks and the Three Bears, D: A male, radical moslem between 15 and 45 years of age.

3). In October '83 a bomb was exploded at the US Marine barracks in Beirut, killing 241 US Marine Peacekeepers. Were the perpetrators: A: A troop of Camp Fire Girls, B: Mick Jagger & The Rolling Stones, C: The aging cast of the musical "Oklahoma!", D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

4). In December '83 a bomb was detonated at the US embassy in Kuwait, killing 6 and injuring dozens. Were the perpetrators: A: The ageless Dick Clark, and several dance-crazed teenagers, B: The Beverly Hillbillies, C: Four elderly 'school marms,' D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

5). In Sept. 1984 the US embassy in Beirut was bombed killing 16 persons. Were the perpetrators: A: Seven Boy Scouts and a toothless Pit Bull, B: The Big, Bad Wolf, C: The Captain and Tenielle, D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

6). In Oct. 1985 the cruise ship Achille Lauro was hijacked, and wheelchair-bound American Jewish retiree Leon Klinghoffer was murdered and thrown overboard. Were the perpetrators: A: David Frost and some 'frat boys' from Kansas State University, B: Five musk-oxes and the ghost of Edgar Allen Poe, C: Screen actors Stephen Segal and Marty Feldman, D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

7). In November, 1985 Egypt Air flight 648 was hijacked to Malta and 60 people killed. Were the perpetrators: A: Li'l Orphan Annie and Rebecca of Sunnybrook Farm, B: The Congressional Black Caucus, C: World famous attorney F. Lee Bailey and his 'long time companion' Gus, D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

8). In April 1986 the Rome to Athens TWA flight was bombed, killing 3 and injuring 150. Were the perpetrators: A: A group of disgruntled 'National Enquirer' reporters, B: The Harlem Globetrotters, C: A group of trained circus penguins,

D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

9). In December 1988 a bomb destroyed PanAm flight 103 over Lockerbie, Scotland killing all 270 souls aboard. Were the perpetrators: A: Captain Kangaroo and Mr. Greenjeans, B: John Belushi and Dan Aykroyd, C: Snow White and the 7 Dwarfs, D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age

10): In Feb. '93 the World Trade Center in New York City was bombed, killing 6 and injuring more than 1,000. Were the perpetrators: A: Perry Mason and his secretary Stella, B: Archie Bunker and 'The Meathead', C: The American Catholic Bishops, D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 & 45 years of age.

11): In Nov. 1995 US Army HQ in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia was bombed killing seven. Were the perpetrators: A: Red Skelton and Dean Martin, B: A high school marching band, C: "Jerry's Kids", D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

12): In Aug. 1998 the US embassies in Nairobi and Dar es Salaam were simultaneously bombed killing 263, and injuring more than 5,000 people. Were the perpetrators: A: Irving Berlin & Art Garfunkel, B: Toty Fields, Tom Selleck, Jonathan Winters, and Yogi Berra, C: Midget Wrestlers, D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age

13): In October 2000 the USS Cole was bombed killing 17 people. Were the perpetrators: A: French foreign exchange students, B: Three Philadelphia businesswomen, C: The Muppets, D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age

14): On September 11, 2001 the World Trade Center in New York City was destroyed killing nearly 3000 Americans and hundreds of foreign nationals. Were the perpetrators: A: Two little boys playing with a chemistry set, B: A group of elderly Rabbis, C: Rosanne Barr and Hillary Clinton, D: Male radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

15): Given the above facts, who would it make more sense to single out for greater security interest when attempting to pass the security gates at airports, or upon entry into the United States: A: Midget Wrestlers and the Muppets, B: Short, fat, balding, middle-aged Irish Americans, C: Penguins, ghosts, and musk-oxes, D: Males between 15 and 45 years of age, who appear to be of Middle Eastern extraction, with Arabic sounding names too long to fit on their ID cards.

16): Given the clear need for such action, and the immediate danger to all Americans, why hasn't Congress authorized this simple safety procedure for the security of our nation: A: They are ninnies, B: They are malfeasant, C: Two words; Political Correctness, D: They are chicken-hearted, lily-livered, yellow-bellied, spalpeens who daily prove themselves more absolutely useless and detrimental to the American people, E: All of the above.

Thank you for your time. Please forward a copy to your Senators and your Representative.

[apothanein kerdos]

One of the hardest things to do is to define what makes something a religious conflict, between different religions, and what makes something a political conflict, between different nation states.

If Islam is involved, it is a religious conflict. It is not that hard. Have you even studied their religion?

For example, the US is estimated to have a 79-84% Christian population, yet I would consider our Afghanistan/Iraq/Iran?? conflicts to be politically oriented; I don't think of these wars being 'religious conflicts', even if the vast majority of the US is Christian.

Whether we like it or not, they are religious conflicts because Muslims are involved. The sole reason we were attacked by Muslims is due to their religious beliefs.

Iraq is most certaintly being contested by muslims primarily, but the responce is not so much religiously influenced as it is politically influenced; the Iraqi rebels don't want the US to occupy their land, not just because we are Christian, but because they don't care for what we stand for as a country. We occupied their country through military force, military resistance is to be expected, and coming from a country in which 97% of the population is muslim, we can naturally expect the majority of the rebels are muslim.

The conflict right now is between Sunni and Shia Muslims - for religious control of the land. America is merely caught in the middle.

-Sudan is a pretty split country, and religion definitly plays a roll there, but the dispute is primarily a political one, one about state divisions and breaking off. I was reading a bit from an article here ( http://www.ockenden.org.uk/index.asp?id=793 ) about the origins of the conflict. Incidentally, the conflict is usually thought to be between muslims and christians. This one might be split 50/50

State borders...over what? Over the fact the Muslims want control over the entire nation of Sudan, which has caused the government to fight against them. It is the Muslims committing genocide in the Dafur region.

-In Thailand, there are religious undertones to the muslim rebellions, but the essential reasoning behind it is once again political; the muslims of the south have been treated poorly, and are looking for change and freedom from oppression. In fact, it seems that the muslims of this region are the ones being put on the defensive and being persocuted for the most part. I was reading a bit from an article here

The Muslims want to enact Muslim Law on the land, not gain equal rights. They are using the "oppression" (which occurs in Muslims countries, but you never see a revolt...hmmmm, like in Afganistan and Iran.....there goes your argument) as an excuse to enact Muslim Law on the land.

Essentially Hamburgers, I'm not even going to bother to debate the rest of this with you because you are ignorant to the Muslim religion and naive about what starts conflicts, and the difference between a political and religious conflict. You are unlearned in this area...what benefit do I have in even trying to debate this with you when you know nothing about it?

[Oh Hamburgers!]

I'll admit that gave me quite a chuckle, and I had NO IDEA the muppets are such a national security threat!!

On a more serious not, I appreciate the time you spent on that quiz Leonard, but it doesn't really deal with the situation at hand. All that tells me is that you are an advocate of racial profiling by the police force in order to be more accurate in finding suspects to crimes. Again, the majority of those attacks were politically oriented and directed against the US in general and US military forces, not specifically our christianity. While some were specifically involved in radical Islam, most of those examples you brought up were political actions, the fact the perpetrators were muslim is just a side note.

The way I see it, I feel confidant in the world's "general" feel about Islam the religion. If there was conclusive evidence that the religion of Islam specifically was a national security threat to our country and the rest of the world, I would expect action would be taken. If it is truly a violent satanic cult as some have said, it would be treated like a cult, and dealt with accordingly. But it isn't treated like a cult, it is a world religion. In fact, as I have said before the Qu'ran shares many subtle similarites with Christinity. Much of the historical text of the Qu'ran can be found in the Old and New Testaments of the Bible, and muslims believe that Jesus was one of their prophets, although they don't believe he was God.

[apothanein kerdos]

Much of the historical text of the Qu'ran can be found in the Old and New Testaments of the Bible

This simply proves further you haven't studied the religion at all.

Have you still failed to compare the first two centuries of Christianity to the first two centuries of Islam? With an added benefit, compare Jesus and Muhammad. After studying their origins, I dare you to tell me they are peaceful as a religion.

[RGR]

OK boys and girls! You've asked for it, and I guess it's time to post it again: The world famous TERRORISM QUIZ.

See if you can spot something the government and the Left seems not to have noticed:

TERRORISM QUIZ

PLEASE SELECT THE ONE ANSWER YOU FEEL IS BEST FOR EACH QUESTION

1). In August, 1982 a bomb exploded at JFK airport, killing 1 person and injuring several. Was the perpetrator: A: A black American mother of 4, B: Retired Senator Sam Rayburn, C: Bugs Bunny, D: A male, radical Moslem between 15 and 45 years of age.

2). In April 1983 a car bomb exploded at the US embassy in Beirut, killing 63 persons. Was the perpetrator: A: Wily E. Coyote, B: Pop star Madonna,

C: Goldilocks and the Three Bears, D: A male, radical moslem between 15 and 45 years of age.

3). In October '83 a bomb was exploded at the US Marine barracks in Beirut, killing 241 US Marine Peacekeepers. Were the perpetrators: A: A troop of Camp Fire Girls, B: Mick Jagger & The Rolling Stones, C: The aging cast of the musical "Oklahoma!", D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

4). In December '83 a bomb was detonated at the US embassy in Kuwait, killing 6 and injuring dozens. Were the perpetrators: A: The ageless Dick Clark, and several dance-crazed teenagers, B: The Beverly Hillbillies, C: Four elderly 'school marms,' D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

5). In Sept. 1984 the US embassy in Beirut was bombed killing 16 persons. Were the perpetrators: A: Seven Boy Scouts and a toothless Pit Bull, B: The Big, Bad Wolf, C: The Captain and Tenielle, D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

6). In Oct. 1985 the cruise ship Achille Lauro was hijacked, and wheelchair-bound American Jewish retiree Leon Klinghoffer was murdered and thrown overboard. Were the perpetrators: A: David Frost and some 'frat boys' from Kansas State University, B: Five musk-oxes and the ghost of Edgar Allen Poe, C: Screen actors Stephen Segal and Marty Feldman, D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

7). In November, 1985 Egypt Air flight 648 was hijacked to Malta and 60 people killed. Were the perpetrators: A: Li'l Orphan Annie and Rebecca of Sunnybrook Farm, B: The Congressional Black Caucus, C: World famous attorney F. Lee Bailey and his 'long time companion' Gus, D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

8). In April 1986 the Rome to Athens TWA flight was bombed, killing 3 and injuring 150. Were the perpetrators: A: A group of disgruntled 'National Enquirer' reporters, B: The Harlem Globetrotters, C: A group of trained circus penguins,

D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

9). In December 1988 a bomb destroyed PanAm flight 103 over Lockerbie, Scotland killing all 270 souls aboard. Were the perpetrators: A: Captain Kangaroo and Mr. Greenjeans, B: John Belushi and Dan Aykroyd, C: Snow White and the 7 Dwarfs, D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age

10): In Feb. '93 the World Trade Center in New York City was bombed, killing 6 and injuring more than 1,000. Were the perpetrators: A: Perry Mason and his secretary Stella, B: Archie Bunker and 'The Meathead', C: The American Catholic Bishops, D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 & 45 years of age.

11): In Nov. 1995 US Army HQ in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia was bombed killing seven. Were the perpetrators: A: Red Skelton and Dean Martin, B: A high school marching band, C: "Jerry's Kids", D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

12): In Aug. 1998 the US embassies in Nairobi and Dar es Salaam were simultaneously bombed killing 263, and injuring more than 5,000 people. Were the perpetrators: A: Irving Berlin & Art Garfunkel, B: Toty Fields, Tom Selleck, Jonathan Winters, and Yogi Berra, C: Midget Wrestlers, D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age

13): In October 2000 the USS Cole was bombed killing 17 people. Were the perpetrators: A: French foreign exchange students, B: Three Philadelphia businesswomen, C: The Muppets, D: Male, radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age

14): On September 11, 2001 the World Trade Center in New York City was destroyed killing nearly 3000 Americans and hundreds of foreign nationals. Were the perpetrators: A: Two little boys playing with a chemistry set, B: A group of elderly Rabbis, C: Rosanne Barr and Hillary Clinton, D: Male radical Moslems between 15 and 45 years of age.

15): Given the above facts, who would it make more sense to single out for greater security interest when attempting to pass the security gates at airports, or upon entry into the United States: A: Midget Wrestlers and the Muppets, B: Short, fat, balding, middle-aged Irish Americans, C: Penguins, ghosts, and musk-oxes, D: Males between 15 and 45 years of age, who appear to be of Middle Eastern extraction, with Arabic sounding names too long to fit on their ID cards.

16): Given the clear need for such action, and the immediate danger to all Americans, why hasn't Congress authorized this simple safety procedure for the security of our nation: A: They are ninnies, B: They are malfeasant, C: Two words; Political Correctness, D: They are chicken-hearted, lily-livered, yellow-bellied, spalpeens who daily prove themselves more absolutely useless and detrimental to the American people, E: All of the above.

Thank you for your time. Please forward a copy to your Senators and your Representative.

Leonard, what ARE we going to do with you!

[Oh Hamburgers!]

If Islam is involved, it is a religious conflict. It is not that hard. Have you even studied their religion?...

...Essentially Hamburgers, I'm not even going to bother to debate the rest of this with you because you are ignorant to the Muslim religion and naive about what starts conflicts, and the difference between a political and religious conflict. You are unlearned in this area...what benefit do I have in even trying to debate this with you when you know nothing about it?

It seems to me you are the one having difficulty splitting politics and religion. I told you specifically that I am not completely knowledgable when it comes to many current events, but I would like to think I have a general understanding of how political action works. If the mere fact of religion being involved makes something a religious conflict, then all of the US occupations and conquests have been relgious conflicts, the majority of colonization efforts in africa, southeast asia and asia have been religious conflicts, christianity in South America was brought about through religious conflict, the crusades, the inquisition, even WWII could be seen as many christian countries getting into a world conflict. If you use the same broad brush to generalize something being a 'religious conflict' for Islam, then Christianity is JUST as guilty of violence in this world as Islam. I don't consider all of these things to be religious conflicts, because it takes more than religious people to make a war a religious conflict. Therefore I don't consider all the conflicts in the world today that involve muslim players to necessarily be conflicts brought on by religion.

Incidentally, I did my homework when it comes to comparing violence brought about by Christianity and Islam from their respective conceptions, and both have had extremely volatile histories. Christianity did not start off as violent as Islam due to several hundred years of persocution, I will admit that, but we have definitly done our share of violent action in this world as well. I am not finished compiling the two lists of violent actions, but from my current viewpoint they really are close to equal in terms of violent events through history. To save space on this thread, and considering it is a bit off topic, I will refrain from posting what I have so far, but if you are interested I would be willing to finish up my lists and show them to you, either on a thread or in a PM or something.

[apothanein kerdos]

It seems to me you are the one having difficulty splitting politics and religion. I told you specifically that I am not completely knowledgable when it comes to many current events, but I would like to think I have a general understanding of how political action works. If the mere fact of religion being involved makes something a religious conflict, then all of the US occupations and conquests have been relgious conflicts, the majority of colonization efforts in africa, southeast asia and asia have been religious conflicts, christianity in South America was brought about through religious conflict, the crusades, the inquisition, even WWII could be seen as many christian countries getting into a world conflict.

That's the problem - you're quite ignorant when it comes to things like this. In every instance I mentioned, if Islam were not in the area, these wars would not be occurring. That is how you must look at conflicts - if the religion was removed from the area, would the conflict occur. In all of these areas, without Islam, there would be no conflict.

Incidentally, I did my homework when it comes to comparing violence brought about by Christianity and Islam from their respective conceptions, and both have had extremely volatile histories.

The way this statement is worded means you read a wikipedia article and left your "homework" at that.

Christianity did not start off as violent as Islam due to several hundred years of persocution, I will admit that, but we have definitly done our share of violent action in this world as well.

And at this point you've lost all legitimacy. From the Constantine sacral system to the modern day, anything done by "Christian" Europe cannot be counted against Christianity as a religion. Oh darn for you.

Look, you don't understand this issue, and you're speaking about something you know nothing about. A better strategy for you might be to sit back, ask questions, and avoid arguments because you're ignorant to the religion and current political climate.

. To save space on this thread, and considering it is a bit off topic, I will refrain from posting what I have so far, but if you are interested I would be willing to finish up my lists and show them to you, either on a thread or in a PM or something.

I started out as a historian and have recently moved over to philosophy. I do not need your list - no offense, but I could probably quote more historical events relevant to this discussion, off the top of my head, then you read about and were able to put on your list.

[Oh Hamburgers!]

Much of the historical text of the Qu'ran can be found in the Old and New Testaments of the Bible

This simply proves further you haven't studied the religion at all.

Have you still failed to compare the first two centuries of Christianity to the first two centuries of Islam? With an added benefit, compare Jesus and Muhammad. After studying their origins, I dare you to tell me they are peaceful as a religion.

Yeah I just mentioned this in my previous post, I have been busy with work and school, but I am almost done with the compilation of both. The first 200 years or so of Christianity was more of its creation stage, and christians were persocuted in this time period. Islam is definitly more violent in this time period, but it also dealt with a violent split between the sects. I am not going to base my entire viewpoint off of the first two centuries of the religion, I am dealing with all the violent acts I can find from their creation to today, or as close as I can get. I'll post my findings after I get back from class.

In the meantime here is some info on the similarities:

http://www.answers.com/topic/similarities-...-and-the-qur-an

http://www.icon.fi/~erkkik/quran.html

http://eprints.hec.gov.pk/724/01/508.html.htm

[Oh Hamburgers!]

And at this point you've lost all legitimacy. From the Constantine sacral system to the modern day, anything done by "Christian" Europe cannot be counted against Christianity as a religion. Oh darn for you.

How so? What makes christianity exempt based on your definition of religious conflict?