apothanein kerdos Posted May 21, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 331 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 8,713 Content Per Day: 1.21 Reputation: 21 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 21, 2007 What you are refering to as David's "biggest sin" is your own opinion. His "biggest sin", killing Uriah(according to you), had a punishment from God killing the child(one child) that came about from this sin. The sin of direct disobedience in numbering, when God specifically told him not to, had a punishment from God of God's angel going around and slaying EVERYONE, until David begged God to stop His angel. Downfall? All sin is downfall but, apparently, the numbering sin made God a bit more angry to send out His angel like that on everyone. You are viewing that through a Utilitarian view and not through the view of the author of Kings. In other words, you're injecting your opinion on it in order to prove your own point. I'm simply relying on the writing style. You also missed the broader point of what I was saying - David's census affected the population immediately. However, his sin with Uriah caused the collapse of his family, set up Solomon as king (who was a failure), and eventually caused a split within the kingdom. This led to multiple wars and eventually exile. If you want to look at this through a utilitarian view point, this sin would still be the worst one because it caused the greatest amount of harm to the greatest amount of people in the long run. How cruel of you to warp what I said. I clearly stated that when some of the prophets, including Moses and even David, spoke for God, they made it certain the audience they spoke to knew it by saying something like, "Thus sayeth the Lord your God..."etc. Accounts that were written, geneologies, history; all these, I believe, were God approved. Just as when Moses, seeing that the men in his camp couldn't control their evil ways, allowed them a certificate of divorce. Jesus made it very clear that that was NOT God breathed but a rule Moses made for his people. The Bible is FLOODED with God's Breath, I'd never deny that, especially when Jesus speaks, how can I NOT believe in God. "My sheep hear my voice and they know me." I know God's voice when I hear it. If men interjected their opinions into scripture, how can you tell what is made by man and what is made by God? How can you be sure Jesus even said those things if you doubt other parts of scripture? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kabowd Posted May 21, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 112 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,489 Content Per Day: 0.48 Reputation: 13 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted May 21, 2007 Without the belief that God's Word is inerrant, infallible and untainted by the opinions of man, every other belief crumbles because there is no foundation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
None Posted May 22, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 39 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,513 Content Per Day: 0.24 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/05/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/01/1908 Share Posted May 22, 2007 What you are refering to as David's "biggest sin" is your own opinion. His "biggest sin", killing Uriah(according to you), had a punishment from God killing the child(one child) that came about from this sin. The sin of direct disobedience in numbering, when God specifically told him not to, had a punishment from God of God's angel going around and slaying EVERYONE, until David begged God to stop His angel. Downfall? All sin is downfall but, apparently, the numbering sin made God a bit more angry to send out His angel like that on everyone. You are viewing that through a Utilitarian view and not through the view of the author of Kings. In other words, you're injecting your opinion on it in order to prove your own point. I'm simply relying on the writing style. You also missed the broader point of what I was saying - David's census affected the population immediately. However, his sin with Uriah caused the collapse of his family, set up Solomon as king (who was a failure), and eventually caused a split within the kingdom. This led to multiple wars and eventually exile. If you want to look at this through a utilitarian view point, this sin would still be the worst one because it caused the greatest amount of harm to the greatest amount of people in the long run. How cruel of you to warp what I said. I clearly stated that when some of the prophets, including Moses and even David, spoke for God, they made it certain the audience they spoke to knew it by saying something like, "Thus sayeth the Lord your God..."etc. Accounts that were written, geneologies, history; all these, I believe, were God approved. Just as when Moses, seeing that the men in his camp couldn't control their evil ways, allowed them a certificate of divorce. Jesus made it very clear that that was NOT God breathed but a rule Moses made for his people. The Bible is FLOODED with God's Breath, I'd never deny that, especially when Jesus speaks, how can I NOT believe in God. "My sheep hear my voice and they know me." I know God's voice when I hear it. If men interjected their opinions into scripture, how can you tell what is made by man and what is made by God? How can you be sure Jesus even said those things if you doubt other parts of scripture? A.K. What part of "My sheep hear my voice and they know me." do you not understand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apothanein kerdos Posted May 22, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 331 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 8,713 Content Per Day: 1.21 Reputation: 21 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 22, 2007 What you are refering to as David's "biggest sin" is your own opinion. His "biggest sin", killing Uriah(according to you), had a punishment from God killing the child(one child) that came about from this sin. The sin of direct disobedience in numbering, when God specifically told him not to, had a punishment from God of God's angel going around and slaying EVERYONE, until David begged God to stop His angel. Downfall? All sin is downfall but, apparently, the numbering sin made God a bit more angry to send out His angel like that on everyone. You are viewing that through a Utilitarian view and not through the view of the author of Kings. In other words, you're injecting your opinion on it in order to prove your own point. I'm simply relying on the writing style. You also missed the broader point of what I was saying - David's census affected the population immediately. However, his sin with Uriah caused the collapse of his family, set up Solomon as king (who was a failure), and eventually caused a split within the kingdom. This led to multiple wars and eventually exile. If you want to look at this through a utilitarian view point, this sin would still be the worst one because it caused the greatest amount of harm to the greatest amount of people in the long run. How cruel of you to warp what I said. I clearly stated that when some of the prophets, including Moses and even David, spoke for God, they made it certain the audience they spoke to knew it by saying something like, "Thus sayeth the Lord your God..."etc. Accounts that were written, geneologies, history; all these, I believe, were God approved. Just as when Moses, seeing that the men in his camp couldn't control their evil ways, allowed them a certificate of divorce. Jesus made it very clear that that was NOT God breathed but a rule Moses made for his people. The Bible is FLOODED with God's Breath, I'd never deny that, especially when Jesus speaks, how can I NOT believe in God. "My sheep hear my voice and they know me." I know God's voice when I hear it. If men interjected their opinions into scripture, how can you tell what is made by man and what is made by God? How can you be sure Jesus even said those things if you doubt other parts of scripture? A.K. What part of "My sheep hear my voice and they know me." do you not understand? How can you know Jesus really said that? Drop the theatrics - use logical reasoning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OopsMartin Posted May 22, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 829 Content Per Day: 0.13 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/25/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/26/1943 Share Posted May 22, 2007 What is feminism? What do we mean by that term? Good question. Most of the time I hear Christians using it on other Christians it's like a swear word. If you don't like what someone said, or if you disagree with them, call them a feminist! Doesn't matter if they are or not. I don't think there are many who consider themselves Christian feminists. While the original suffragetts were called feminists and they did some great things for our country, bringing women the right to vote, own property, eventually have credit, and to NOT have an abortion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
None Posted May 22, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 39 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,513 Content Per Day: 0.24 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/05/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/01/1908 Share Posted May 22, 2007 What you are refering to as David's "biggest sin" is your own opinion. His "biggest sin", killing Uriah(according to you), had a punishment from God killing the child(one child) that came about from this sin. The sin of direct disobedience in numbering, when God specifically told him not to, had a punishment from God of God's angel going around and slaying EVERYONE, until David begged God to stop His angel. Downfall? All sin is downfall but, apparently, the numbering sin made God a bit more angry to send out His angel like that on everyone. You are viewing that through a Utilitarian view and not through the view of the author of Kings. In other words, you're injecting your opinion on it in order to prove your own point. I'm simply relying on the writing style. You also missed the broader point of what I was saying - David's census affected the population immediately. However, his sin with Uriah caused the collapse of his family, set up Solomon as king (who was a failure), and eventually caused a split within the kingdom. This led to multiple wars and eventually exile. If you want to look at this through a utilitarian view point, this sin would still be the worst one because it caused the greatest amount of harm to the greatest amount of people in the long run. How cruel of you to warp what I said. I clearly stated that when some of the prophets, including Moses and even David, spoke for God, they made it certain the audience they spoke to knew it by saying something like, "Thus sayeth the Lord your God..."etc. Accounts that were written, geneologies, history; all these, I believe, were God approved. Just as when Moses, seeing that the men in his camp couldn't control their evil ways, allowed them a certificate of divorce. Jesus made it very clear that that was NOT God breathed but a rule Moses made for his people. The Bible is FLOODED with God's Breath, I'd never deny that, especially when Jesus speaks, how can I NOT believe in God. "My sheep hear my voice and they know me." I know God's voice when I hear it. If men interjected their opinions into scripture, how can you tell what is made by man and what is made by God? How can you be sure Jesus even said those things if you doubt other parts of scripture? A.K. What part of "My sheep hear my voice and they know me." do you not understand? How can you know Jesus really said that? Drop the theatrics - use logical reasoning. Theatrics. Nice. (i've seen some of your more colorful threads) If you are one of Jesus' sheep, you'd know, without a shadow of a doubt, as I do, when He speaks. All Christians do. That's how I know He said that. John 10:14-16 14)I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine. 15)As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep. 16)And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd. Logical? Doesn't faith defy logic? Hebrews 4:2 2)For we also have had the gospel preached to us, just as they did; but the message they heard was of no value to them, because those who heard did not combine it with faith. Notice he didn't say, "combine it with logic" Hebrews 11:1 1)Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see. Logic: 1. the science that investigates the principles governing correct or reliable inference. 2. a particular method of reasoning or argumentation: We were unable to follow his logic. 3. the system or principles of reasoning applicable to any branch of knowledge or study. 4. reason or sound judgment, as in utterances or actions: There wasn't much logic in her move. 5. convincing forcefulness; inexorable truth or persuasiveness: the irresistible logic of the facts. 6. Computers. logic circuit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apothanein kerdos Posted May 22, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 331 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 8,713 Content Per Day: 1.21 Reputation: 21 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 22, 2007 Again, how can you have faith if you have no factual basis for your belief? I have faith that I'm supposed to kill all humans. You can't say I'm wrong - faith is supposed to be illogical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apothanein kerdos Posted May 22, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 331 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 8,713 Content Per Day: 1.21 Reputation: 21 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 22, 2007 Oh, and: 1 Peter 3:15 Two words in there: logos and apologia. Both, in Greek, refer to logical arguments. Oh..almost forgot....how can you use scripture to justify what you believe? How can you trust scripture? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firehill Posted May 22, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 11 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,980 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/17/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted May 22, 2007 What is feminism? What do we mean by that term? Good question. What does everyone mean by that term when they use it? What does masculinism mean also? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kabowd Posted May 22, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 112 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,489 Content Per Day: 0.48 Reputation: 13 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted May 22, 2007 Logical? Doesn't faith defy logic? Hebrews 4:2 2)For we also have had the gospel preached to us, just as they did; but the message they heard was of no value to them, because those who heard did not combine it with faith. Notice he didn't say, "combine it with logic" Hebrews 11:1 1)Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see. Logic: 1. the science that investigates the principles governing correct or reliable inference. 2. a particular method of reasoning or argumentation: We were unable to follow his logic. 3. the system or principles of reasoning applicable to any branch of knowledge or study. 4. reason or sound judgment, as in utterances or actions: There wasn't much logic in her move. 5. convincing forcefulness; inexorable truth or persuasiveness: the irresistible logic of the facts. 6. Computers. logic circuit. This is not scriptural. Faith does NOT defy logic. God created logic. God is logical. We are made in His image. It is by logic that we are able to deduce what is true and what is false. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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