kat8585 Posted October 31, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 1,360 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 7,866 Content Per Day: 1.23 Reputation: 26 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/22/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/18/1946 Share Posted October 31, 2007 WHAT IF 20 MILLION ILLEGAL ALIENS VACATED AMERICA? By Frosty Wooldridge October 29, 2007 NewsWithViews.com Tina Griego, journalist for the Denver Rocky Mountain News wrote a column titled, "Mexican visitor's lament" -- 10/25/07. She interviewed Mexican journalist Evangelina Hernandez while visiting Denver last week. Hernandez said, "They (illegal aliens) pay rent, buy groceries, buy clothes...what happens to your country's economy if 20 million people go away?" That's a good question Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RGR Posted October 31, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 512 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 8,601 Content Per Day: 1.13 Reputation: 125 Days Won: 2 Joined: 07/16/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/04/1973 Share Posted October 31, 2007 :wub: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Hamburgers! Posted October 31, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 2,144 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 163 Days Won: 1 Joined: 02/02/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/05/1985 Share Posted October 31, 2007 And what would happen to those 20 million people? There would certaintly be some good that would come from getting rid of illegals, but I think the better solution would be to make many of the illegals here today into legal citizens. That way the problems that come from illegal persons working in our system would become a non-issue, as they would all be responsible for paying taxes, getting the same wages, etc. Of course, on the flip side, many illegal immigrants help keep the prices of goods artificially low. If we had no illegals, expect a slightly steeper cost of living. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hr.jr. Posted October 31, 2007 Group: Senior Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 615 Content Per Day: 0.09 Reputation: 12 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/21/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2007 WHAT IF 20 MILLION ILLEGAL ALIENS VACATED AMERICA? By Frosty Wooldridge October 29, 2007 NewsWithViews.com Tina Griego, journalist for the Denver Rocky Mountain News wrote a column titled, "Mexican visitor's lament" -- 10/25/07. She interviewed Mexican journalist Evangelina Hernandez while visiting Denver last week. Hernandez said, "They (illegal aliens) pay rent, buy groceries, buy clothes...what happens to your country's economy if 20 million people go away?" That's a good question Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kat8585 Posted October 31, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 1,360 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 7,866 Content Per Day: 1.23 Reputation: 26 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/22/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/18/1946 Author Share Posted October 31, 2007 If we in one stroke deported 20 million illegal aliens, and we ended welfare; 20 million lazy americans riding our system would have to go to work and fill the jobs left vacant by the deportation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LadyC Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 what an excellent article. a solid response to the bleeding-heart outcries about how illegals help the economy. some of what the author wrote seemed rather redundant, particularly the repetition on traffic, but it was still a fantastic read. hey burgers... i totally disagree with making the illegals legal. NO AMNESTY. i don't believe in rewarding criminal activity with amnesty. and yes, even their mere presence here is a criminal act. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forrestkc Posted October 31, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 114 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 4,015 Content Per Day: 0.59 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 1 Joined: 12/15/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2007 The author provided a lot of anecdotals, but no actual statistics. For example, illegal aliens represent less than 1.5% of the total healthcare costs in this country. As a demographic, they commit less crime than any other demographic in this country. Moreover, unless one compiles the statistics on the taxes they pay, yes they do pay taxes, and compared that to the public services they receive, then his numbers are meaningless in that regard as well. Also, studies place the number of illegal immigrants in the United States at one time at around 12 million, not 20 million. http://pewhispanic.org/files/factsheets/17.pdf As to the economic impacts of illegal immigrants: "Research by George Borjas, Robert W. Scrivner Professor of Economics and Social Policy at Harvard University, shows that the average American's wealth is increased (albeit by less than 1%) by illegal immigration. The effect on wages for middle class individuals was an overall wealth increase. However, illegal immigrants had a long-term reduction of wages among American poor citizens during the 1980s and 1990s by 4.8%" http://ksghome.harvard.edu/%7EGBorjas/Papers/w11281.pdf Professor Francine Lipman writes in a 2006 paper in the peer-reviewed journal Tax Lawyer of the American Bar Association Section of Taxation that the belief that undocumented migrants are exploiting the U.S. economy and cost more in services than they contribute to the economy is "undeniably false". Lipman asserts that "undocumented immigrants actually contribute more to public coffers in taxes than they cost in social services" and "contribute to the U.S. economy through their investments and consumption of goods and services; filling of millions of essential worker positions resulting in subsidiary job creation, increased productivity and lower costs of goods and services; and unrequited contributions to Social Security, Medicare and unemployment insurance programs." http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=881584 In fact, its estimated by many economists that the only demographic that would see a net wage increase if we were to somehow deport all illegal immigrants would be high school dropouts. As to this breaking the law notion by coming here illegally. Almost everyone in this country is a descendant of immigrants. A great number of those immigrants came here illegally. Probably half the people on this board would not be posting from America if their ancestors had not been granted citizenship after they came here undocumented. Illegal immigrants make a nice political and culture war whipping post, but in the end, your taxes have nothing to do with illegal immigrants, skyrocketing healthcare costs have nothing to do with illegal immigrants after all they make up less than 1.5% of total U.S. healthcare costs, and crime rates have dropped over the last decade despite the fact that illegal immigration has increased. It is a fantasy to think that even if we tried we could deport even a fraction of the 12 million illegal immigrants in this country. It is not going to happen. Even if a bigot like Tom Tancredo were to become president, it isn't happening. If you want to do something about illegal immigration, go after their employers. If there were not so many of these cheap labor conservatives up here looking to hire them, they would not be coming here. Folks, they don't come here for the schools or healthcare, they come here for the jobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kat8585 Posted October 31, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 1,360 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 7,866 Content Per Day: 1.23 Reputation: 26 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/22/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/18/1946 Author Share Posted October 31, 2007 Whose side are you on, Forrest, the lawbreakers', or the hospitals that are having to shut down (just one example)? I know how strained Parkland Hospital in Dalla is. It's a wonder they haven't had to shut down, and I'm sure they will eventually have to. More illegal babies are born there than legal ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forrestkc Posted October 31, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 114 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 4,015 Content Per Day: 0.59 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 1 Joined: 12/15/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2007 Whose side are you on, Forrest, the lawbreakers', or the hospitals that are having to shut down (just one example)? I know how strained Parkland Hospital in Dalla is. It's a wonder they haven't had to shut down, and I'm sure they will eventually have to. More illegal babies are born there than legal ones. I am saying that statistically, its not one of the bigger problems we have as a nation. They make up less than 1.5% of our total healthcare costs. Therefore, they are obviously not to blame for our healthcare crisis. You guys act like they are a bunch of bums. They come up here to work. The bums are those who hire them because they are too cheap to pay a decent wage to get legal labor. What would happen if all red states packed up and left the nation? Well, for starters the national divorce rate would go down. There would be less broken families. Less kids growing up in single parent homes. Reason being is that of the top ten states with the lowest divorce rates, 9 of them are Blue States. We would also be a more educated nation as urban areas and blue states have much percentages of college graduates. Our taxes would go down dramatically because blue states tend to pay in more than they get back, while rural red states receive far more than they pay in. Seems like we would be a lot better off without all those welfare queen red states. So why don't we get rid of all the red states? I mean you can employ the kind of logic the writer of that editorial did on a number of issues. It's poor logic and loaded language either way. As to whose side I am on, I am on the side of the guy that wants to work and wants a better life, I am against the guy that wants to exploit those that just want to work and get a better life. If you want less illegal immigration, all you have to do is prosecute the bums that are hiring them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kat8585 Posted October 31, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 1,360 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 7,866 Content Per Day: 1.23 Reputation: 26 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/22/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/18/1946 Author Share Posted October 31, 2007 Whose side are you on, Forrest, the lawbreakers', or the hospitals that are having to shut down (just one example)? I know how strained Parkland Hospital in Dallas is. It's a wonder they haven't had to shut down, and I'm sure they will eventually have to. More illegal babies are born there than legal ones. I am saying that statistically, its not one of the bigger problems we have as a nation. They make up less than 1.5% of our total healthcare costs. Therefore, they are obviously not to blame for our healthcare crisis. It's fast becoming a very huge problem. They are causing hospitals to shut down, straining schools, and causing congestion on our highways, and causing many other problems. If just one hospital has to shut down because of them, it's one too many. You guys act like they are a bunch of bums. Lawbreakers is the word. They come up here to work. The bums are those who hire them because they are too cheap to pay a decent wage to get legal labor. What would happen if all red states packed up and left the nation? I'm not talking about red and blue states. As to whose side I am on, I am on the side of the guy that wants to work and wants a better life, Even if he does it the way they are doing it? I am against the guy that wants to exploit those that just want to work and get a better life. If you want less illegal immigration, all you have to do is prosecute the bums that are hiring them. You've been saying it's not that big a problem. Yet we should prosecute the "bums" that hire them? How can you call yourself a good liberal? Liberals don't want to do this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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