Help understanding the Whirling Wheels and Cheribum

[EricH]

The text never gives a technical explanation of what the nature of the wheels were. For us to speculate is just that, speculation

[Blien]

doesn't hurt to guess

[jesusiskingofkings]

Blien,

Notice that in Eze. 9:4-6 And Rev.7:2-4 talk about the sealing of believers in the forhead. So Eze. and Rev. are lined up, differant peoples words to describe event.

In Eze. chapter 1 Ezekiel saw this from an earthly perspective, Eze. 1:4-5 it was like a whirlwind, came fast, and cloud, covered massive space.

Eze. 9 & 10, Rev 4:7-8 are from an heavenly perspective.

Rev. 4:10 & Eze.8:16 talk about a number of men worshiping, rev. # is 24, Eze. # is about 25. But notice in Eze. the Lord shows Ezekiel that they have there back to the alter, and praying to the east?

In Eze. 1:10 & Eze. 10:14 & Rev. 4:7

1 lion

2 eagle

3 man

4 ox/cherud/calf

Notice how 3 of the faces are the smae every time? The fourth one differs.

In Eze. 1 he calls this thing creature, something he's never seen before.

In Eze. 9 he calls it cherub (angel), we now that satan is an fallen angel.

In Rev. 4 Its called a beast, (Daniel) beasts are kingdoms(governments).

1 lion - feared, stregth, Is the lion the king of other beast in the jungle, like in lion king?

2 eagle-soars in the clouds, someone pionted out symbol for babalon.

3 man-earthly government, ideas, man-made,

4 ox/cherub/calf-notice the cherub is between the acceptible sacrifes. False religon.

creature- man-made

cherub- fallen angel

beast- government.

This is a war that is fought on earth and in heaven. It also happens right after the 144,000 get the seal of the living God in their forheads. He was trying to discribe it as best he could. Now we know Daniel was to seal things up, so was john in Rev. I have always wondered what the 7 thunders uttered in Rev. 10, he did let us know something is going to happen, but couldn't tel us, I've always wondered why?

I believe this to be all the nations that come agaist Isreal. In Eze. 9:1-2 all are called and have weapons of distruction. In Eze. 9:4-6 God says to seal the men that cry for the abominations done to Jerusalem, before the battle can begin. In Eze. 9:8 Ezekiel wants to know about the residue of Isreal in His pouring out of fury on Jerusalem. In Eze. 9:9-10 God says He is recompensing the evil back on the peoples heads that they comitted. In Eze. 10 Ezekiel discribs the battle to the best of his ability, letting us know Eze. 10:20-21, that it's the same vision as in Eze. 1, and the 2 different perspectives by refering us back to chapther 1.

I still think the wheels are referance to modern vehicles, airplans, ect. because in Exe. 1:23 he tells how the wings are lined up across from each other on the left and right sides. In Eze. 1:24 he talks about the noise of their wings, the engiens are an the wings. In Eze. 10:17 he says the spirit of the living creature was in them.

We also know that the earth is considered the Lords footstool, so it would be under His throne.

What do you think???

[jesusiskingofkings]

Blien

While reading and replying to another topic I see how it lines up here.

I had posted this in the "Saints in tribulation" topic.

The fullness of the gentiles, refer to the abomination of desilation.

Matt.24:15-22

mark 13:14-20

Luke 21:20-23

Dan. 7:25 & 8:23-25 & 9:27 & 11:23-24

Jer.25:8-13 & 29:8-14 & 50:13-15

Eze. 1:4-24 & 8:15:18 & 9:1-10 & 10:1-21

I believe the 70 weeks started when jerusalem became inhabited with jewish people, can I give an exact date, no I haven't followed there history. But what I do know is....

In Eze. 8:15-18 God asks him if he sees that the men are praying to the east worshiping the sun, with their back to the alter. In 9:1-2 God calls all the armies together with weapons of slaughter. In 9:4-10 God wont let the battle begain untill all the men that have cried out about the abominations of Jereusalem are seal, 144,000. In chapther 10 he discribes the battle as best he can from an heavenly perspective, he inecates this in 10:20-21 refering us back to chapter 1. In 1 he was on earth seeing this come quikly upon jereusalem.

Notice God is angery that they are defilling the temple by praying to the S-U-N in the EAST? Think about Isreal today, the dome of the rock and the wailing wall, Any simularities?

Now in Jer. 50:13-15 God calls all the armies together agains babylon.

Now what I do see here is God called the armies both places. Islam is now the religion where the old babylonian impire used to be, and Islam is in the dome of the rock right in Jereusalem, God's holy city.

The fulness of the Gentiles is the treading down of the temlpe. It's happening right now, the jewish people do not have their promised land, but is being tread down by the gentiles, with a sun worship, where they do pray to the east, and the sun does rise in the east.

The wrath comes when God gets so angry, he rides Jereusalem of this abomination, and sets up His earthy kingdom in Jereusalem.

I think this lines up here, what do you think???

[Blien]

This is a war that is fought on earth and in heaven. It also happens right after the 144,000 get the seal of the living God in their forheads. He was trying to discribe it as best he could. Now we know Daniel was to seal things up, so was john in Rev. I have always wondered what the 7 thunders uttered in Rev. 10, he did let us know something is going to happen, but couldn't tel us, I've always wondered why?

I could be totally wrong here, because I read that verse and it doesn't make sense to me but maybe you have some insight.

During a wartime, if there are artillery shells going off, and landing, they sound very much like "thunder". If there is a battle at night fall or in complete darkness, the shells flash across the sky like 'flashes of lighting'. Perhaps this is what he saw? But then why would he seal up what the 7 thunders said?

I have no idea about the second posting, I dont know much about the wailing wall and dome.

[jesusiskingofkings]

This is a war that is fought on earth and in heaven. It also happens right after the 144,000 get the seal of the living God in their forheads. He was trying to discribe it as best he could. Now we know Daniel was to seal things up, so was john in Rev. I have always wondered what the 7 thunders uttered in Rev. 10, he did let us know something is going to happen, but couldn't tel us, I've always wondered why?

I could be totally wrong here, because I read that verse and it doesn't make sense to me but maybe you have some insight.

During a wartime, if there are artillery shells going off, and landing, they sound very much like "thunder". If there is a battle at night fall or in complete darkness, the shells flash across the sky like 'flashes of lighting'. Perhaps this is what he saw? But then why would he seal up what the 7 thunders said?

I have no idea about the second posting, I dont know much about the wailing wall and dome.

Blien

I wasn't even thinking that about the seven thunders ...but WOW....I was indecating that like Daniel being sealed to the end times, that part of Revalation was to. I was litting you know about what in Rev. I was refering to about being sealed, but WoW!

Maybe the reason it was sealed was because John could do a better job at descirbing things in a way we would understand before the time. In the movie "blast from the past" a boy is born in a fall out shelter underground. His father tells him about baseball, but the boy doesn't understand, then 1 day he has to go up out of the shelter into the world above for supplys. During the time, he is at a baseball game, he tells one person, "Now I get it you have to see it to understand it." I believe when we see these things come about, then we will understand, just like the boy and the baseball.

But wow about the thunders, I had never thought of that before. I dod haw ever wonder why he even mentioned them, if he had to keep it sealed. I do believe it is important, or he wouldn't even of let us know sometning mager is going to happen with them. I personally had always thoght it waqs actual thunder, but now..Wow...I don't know what to think, You?????

Much love in Christ Jesus,

Sister Bridget

[Blien]

No idea.. only GOD knows whether the thunders are actual thunders or something else... personally it doesn't makes sense to me why there would only be seven thunders.

We need to seek the answer from GOD in prayer..

[nebula]

The New American Standard translation says, "being as if one wheel were within another." This is exactly the way the wheels are on your automobile! The tire is on the outside and the metal rim is on the inside.

Hey -

I have a different picture of these wheels:

10 All four wheels looked alike and were made the same; each wheel had a second wheel turning crosswise within it. 11 The cherubim could move in any of the four directions they faced, without turning as they moved.

It looks to me, based on this description, that the wheels are perpendicular to each other ("a second wheel turning crosswise").

Another point is that due to the orientation of the wheels, they could move in the four directions (the four directions refer to north, south, east and west).

Thus, the wheels are oriented such that one is facing north-south, and the other is facing east-west.

I don't know of any machines we have with wheels like this.

[nebula]

I was asking about the Wheels and their relation to the Cherubim. I know what Cherubim are this is just the first time I've seen them with the "Whirling Wheels".. I don't think the wheels are mentioned anywhere else in the Bible. So based on how he [Ezekiel] is describing them, they seem to be describing Airplanes and other motorized vechiles.

Blien, have you considered the Cherubim and their wheels in context with the passage?

What I mean is that the first time they are mentioned (Ezekiel 1), they are underneath the Throne of God as the Lord comes to speak to Ezekiel.

Ezekiel 10 is describing the glory of the Lord leaving the Temple. Ezekiel is seeing into the spiritual realm the cherubim (a type of angel) accompanying the glory of the Lord.

This isn't meant to be a prophecy of future events; this was a prophecy of then current events. Because of Israel's sin and defilement of the Temple, the glory of the Lord was leaving it. Because the glory of the Lord left, it was then vulnerable for Babylon to destroy it. (The temple could never have been destroyed had the Lord's glory been there!)

You see, this is the point of the passage.

[nebula]

In Eze. 1:10 & Eze. 10:14 & Rev. 4:7

1 lion

2 eagle

3 man

4 ox/cherud/calf

Hey -

I have a question.

Did you notice that these four creatures are associated with the Throne of God? (Both in Ezekiel and Revelation?)

Notice how 3 of the faces are the smae every time? The fourth one differs.

In Eze. 1 he calls this thing creature, something he's never seen before.

In Eze. 9 he calls it cherub (angel), we now that satan is an fallen angel.

In Rev. 4 Its called a beast, (Daniel) beasts are kingdoms(governments).

Why would satan and the kingdoms of the world be accompanying the Throne of God (Ezek. 1 & 10)?

Why would they be crying "Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty...." (Rev. 4)?

1 lion - feared, stregth, Is the lion the king of other beast in the jungle, like in lion king?

No.

For one, lions live on the savanna, not in the jungle.

For another, they are like any other animal - keeping to themselves except for when they are hungry (where they then pray upon the herbivores).